RAMC Database

[wig]

There were quite a number of Irishmen recruited to the RAMC of which Mitchell was but one. His brother Edmund Mitchell, also a Doctor served with the RAMC but he survived the war.

At least two other Irish RAMC soldiers who were captured and made prisoners of war were exchanged for German POW's in 1916 and upon their return gave evidence against Sir Roger Casement, on trial for High Treason, and who had unsuccesfully tried to recruit them to an Irish Brigade to fight in the Irish Rising.

[BJanman]

There were quite a number of Irishmen recruited to the RAMC of which Mitchell was but one. His brother Edmund Mitchell, also a Doctor served with the RAMC but he survived the war.

There was, indeed. There was also quite a number of Irish doctors already serving in the medical services when were broke out. At the moment it looks as if there may have been more Irish doctors than English doctors as regular commissioned officers, this has been mentioned to me before and when I've logged them all onto the Access database it will be interesting to see just how many there were.

[gr23051917]

Hi Geoffrey

Thank you for your post. I am definitely interested in any images and/or photographs you are happy to share. I am also interested in your grandfather's war details, can you advise his service number? I have one photograph of some of the personnel from the 92nd Field Ambulance - no names unfortunately but it will be interesting to see if they appear in any photographs you have.

Regards

Barbara

Hi Barbara,

I can attach as an e-mail to an e-mail adress. I havent yet cottoned on to another method to send photos.. Will send photos if you provide an e-mail. My grandfathers

service number was 62570. I have a postcard picture of the full 92nd Ambulance( about 145 men)- I can improve on the quality if needed.

Please let me know. Sorry for delay -Christmas shutdown..

Regards, Geoffrey

[gr23051917]

Hi Geoffrey

Thank you for your post. I am definitely interested in any images and/or photographs you are happy to share. I am also interested in your grandfather's war details, can you advise his service number? I have one photograph of some of the personnel from the 92nd Field Ambulance - no names unfortunately but it will be interesting to see if they appear in any photographs you have.

Regards

Barbara

[gr23051917]

Barbara, My grandfathers number was 62570. I have just tried to ulpoad the five pages of three postcards per page but the system says it is too much material. If you could let me know your e-mail I could probably send direct. Please let me know. Sorry about delay - Christmas shutdown intervened.

Regards, Geoffrey

[BJanman]

Hi Geoffrey

Many thanks for this. PM sent with my email adddress.

Barbara

[DJJones]

Hi Barbara,

I'm still trying to find out more about my Grandfather's history (49170, William Stanley Jones). In the course of my research I came across a vast wealth of information about the RAMC in the official minutes of the House of Commons and Lords (Hansard). Some of the debates seem to shed light on the movement of men from the RAMC to line regiments with several 'compulsory transfers' having taken place through 1915-1918. The first of these occurred in May-July 1915 and may explain why my grandfather's friends in G company RAMC transferred to the RWF but it does not address why they moved / were moved and why my grandfather stayed with the RAMC.

I include an excerpt from Hansard below. The debate was very heated and coonected with the passing of the Army Act (1915); however, even before the act was passed concern was expressed about men being forced or pressurised into transferring aainst their will (and that old chestnut: Conscience).

ROYAL ARMY MEDICAL CORPS.

HC Deb 12 July 1915 vol 73 c650 650

<A title="Link to this speech by Mr John Dewar" href="http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1915/jul/12/royal-army-medical-corps#S5CV0073P0_19150712_HOC_137">§ 41. Sir JOHN DEWAR

asked the Under-Secretary of State for War if he is aware that several hundred men of the G Company of the Royal Army Medical Corps were, without being consulted, transferred to an Infantry battalion; if he is ware that eighty-two Scotsmen so transferred protested that they desired to remain in the Royal Army Medical Corps, but, if the transfer was compulsory, they wished to be sent to a Scottish regiment; and that, notwithstanding this request, they were sent to Plymouth and attached to the 3rd Battalion of the King's Own Regiment; and, under these circumstances, will he arrange that these Scottishmen may be given facilities to join regiments of their own nationality?

I can email a word document I've compiled with references to the RAMC if you're interested.

I am still puzzling over the field ambulance that my Grandfather was most likely attached to. His movements post 1916 appear to correspond to those of the FAs attached to the 10th Irish regiment (Salonika, Egypt, Palestine and then France in 1918) but he first served in Gallipoli in November 1915. At this ime the 10th Irish were in Salonika. He seems to have arrived within a few days of the 3rd RWF also disembarking at Gallipoli (and his two friends who had been transferred). Is it possible that he could have served with another FA or even infantry unit (albeit very briefly) before being transferred. His MIC only lists RAMC.

I am puzzled as eveything after January 1916 suggests he was with part of the 30th, 31st or 32nd FA but not the start of service. The family are definite in that he talked about serving in Gallipoli (confirmed by MIC).

Regards

David

[BJanman]

Hi David

The information on the debates look to be really interesting, I was not aware that any official documentation existed on this so would love a copy of the word document you have compiled.

The Medical Official History states that an order was given on the 23rd March 1915 for a number of men of the RAMC to be transferred to infantry battalions, this order was given to meet the demands for reinforcements to the expeditionary force. I know that other orders were given during the war, and I did read a detailed account of this in a unit history but unfortunately I cannot remember which unit history I read it in. When I find it again I’ll take a copy for you.

Yes it is possible that your grandfather served with different medical units through the war, many did. I seem to remember that your grandfather was wounded, there is a possibility that he may have been transferred to a new unit when he recovered but does this fit into the time frame of his other known movements?

Barbara

[DJJones]

Hi Barbara

I sent you the documents by your normal email address.

I know my Grandfather was wounded in 1917 in Salonika but have no record of injury in 1915/16 (which is not to say he wasn't wounded or became ill). I did toy with the idea that he may have joined the RWF briefly and entered Gallipoli with his two friends but the roll of the 14-15 star seems to rule that out. Not sure where to go from here......

Anyway, enjoy the Hansard texts. It appears that the transfers in 1915 were a fait accomplit by Lord Kitchener and the Army Council and that Parliamentare debate was an after the fact issue. Unsurprisingly, later transfers seem to coincide with the Somme, 3rd Ypres and the German offensives in 1918.

Best wishes

David

[SALLY 164]

Hi,

I have just found this forum, and wonder if anyone out there can assist me.

I am researching my grandfather on my paternal side.

His name was Ernest Hammond.

The only written record I have of him is on my Fathers birth certificate where his occupation is listed as a corporal in the RAMC in 1922 in Guildford.

Were there any RAMC units in the Guildford area at that time?

I have looked into the RAMC medal lists for WW1 and there are three Ernest Hammonds listed between 1914 and 1920.

It does list their units, and makes reference to their medals, and gives dates of entries (is that their enlistment date?)But no service number that I recognise.

What I do not know if any of these three were my grandfather, or indeed if he even served in WW1.

Could he have enlisted post war, or re-enlisted?

I have also found out that post 1920 all enlisted men were given a 7 digit service number

Is my only hope to go to Kew and hope that the remaining RAMC records contain his records?

I would very much appreciate any help or assistance that anyone might be able to give.

Sally

[spof]

Hi Sally and welcome to the Forum.

As your grandfather was still in the ARmy after 1920, his serivce records will still be held by the MoD. Here is a link to the forms and paperwork you need to apply for them.

https://www.gov.uk/requests-for-personal-data-and-service-records

Glen

[BJanman]

Hi,

The only written record I have of him is on my Fathers birth certificate where his occupation is listed as a corporal in the RAMC in 1922 in Guildford.

Sally

Hi Sally

The address on the MIC for 5709 Ernest Hammond is "Ivy Cottages, St Catherine's, Guildford" so that looks promising.

This Ernest Hammond would have been a regular at the start of the war so it is possible that he was discharged and then re-enlisted after the war. If you don't have any luck with the service records still held by the MOD then it might be an idea to check out the Medal Rolls, held at the National Archive - they sometimes provide additional information not added to the cards.

Good luck

Barbara

[SALLY 164]

Hi Barbara,

Thanks very much for identifying 5709 Ernest Hammond, I will follow it up.

Sorry to show my ignorance, but what is MIC (is it something I can look at online?)

I would also like to check the two other Ernest Hammond's I found under the RAMC

One was in the 23rd Field Ambulance Regiment

The other was in Regiment 40802

Really grateful for your kind assistance

Thanks

Sally

[Michelle Young]

Hi Sally

MIC is Medal Index Card, available on Ancestry or in the National Archives website (but the NA ones only show the face not the reverse)

Have a look at the parent site as well for advice on research

http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/research/index.php/find-your-soldier/

Michelle

[SALLY 164]

HI Michelle Thanks for the information will have a look at that. Sally

[Guest TonyC66]

Hello,

I have recently come across this forum as part of my research into my Grandfather, Percy Carruthers (316294) who was a member of the 1st Lowland Field Ambulance and served at Gallipoli, Egypt and Palestine throughout WW1. Rather bizarrely, this interest came about when discussing WW1 with a friend in the pub, we have known each other for around 20 years and only discovered last month that both our Grandfathers served in 52 Division (Lowland Scots), both in the RAMC(TF), mine in the 1st and his in the 3rd Field Ambulance. My Grandfather was English, born in Cumberland, worked for the LMS railway company and I wondered whether this contributed to him joining a Scottish Division although I believe The Border Regiment, normally associated with Cumberland/Westmorland, had some battalions serving in Scottish Divisions. Alex's grandfather was from Edinburgh.

From what I have found on line of the composition of the Division, I assume it is unlikely they ever came across one another as I imagine that each field ambulance would be attached to a different Infantry Brigade but I am interested in finding our more about the war diaries for each of these units. My father still has a box of memorabilia which I will have a sort through including I believe some diaries. One of which is water damaged as we believe he had to swim off the beach during the final evacuation of Gallipoli. In keeping with many of his generation, he did not speak much of his service and he died while I was still young so I don't recall ever hearing him talk of WW1.

If there is any research or if anyone can point me to other reference sites then I would be grateful, I have already tried unsuccessfully to find mention of him through his MIC which returns a blank. I believe his has the usual trio of WW1 medals and not sure whether these would have been recorded on a MIC or not.

I am ex RN myself, I now work with a variety of services charities in Scotland so it is particularly gratifying that the anniversary of WW1 is driving a lot of interest in those that served all those years ago and the sacrifices they made. I believe it has a knock on effect too, through publicity of what charities continue to do in support of the wider military family and for veterans in particular.

Regards,

Tony

[ss002d6252]

From what I have found on line of the composition of the Division, I assume it is unlikely they ever came across one another as I imagine that each field ambulance would be attached to a different Infantry Brigade but I am interested in finding our more about the war diaries for each of these units

It wasn't uncommon for field ambulances in a division to work together and/or be based in the same location or relieve each other so they may have come in to contact (not that you'd ever know for certain).

Craig

[ss002d6252]

I'd go a step further and state that it was very common for field ambulances to work together at the divisional level, coordinated by the Assistant Director of Medical Services.

Thanks - I was (slighty) cagey as the RAMC is outside of my usual area of work.

Craig

[Glengarry1950]

Hi Bjay,

I am currently researching Major Hugh Ross Macintyre DSO, MC + Bar, MID, MD, PHD RAMC, I have his MIC he entered theatre of war 22/12/1914 France, I have copies of his three Citations all for Conspicuous Gallantry, MC 16/08/1917, MC Bar, 18/03/1918, DSO 01/02/1919 for conspicuous gallantry during operation on the 3rd Battle of Piave, Italy between 27th and 29th 1918, MID 04/01/1917.

Hugh Ross Macintyre was born 1882 in NewChwang,(now Yingkon) China, to a Scottish Mother and Father who were both missionaries, along with the famous missionary John Ross, Hugh mothers brother. He attended George Watson's College in Edinburgh Scotland qualified as a doctor from Edinburgh University 1904. MB, Ch. B. 1908 M.D., Practised as a locum in East Harlsey, Northhallerton, Yorkshire, England, RAMC 1914 Dec Lieut.,Captain Dec 1915, Major Jan 1918. Hugh died age 50 on 23 February 1932 while practising with his wife Dr Lilian Sarah Macintyre at Broad Green Sanatorium Edge Lane Drive Liverpool England.

I am not sure if you have the highly decorated RAMC office on your data base.

With kind regards

Hiram

[clk]

Hi Hiram,

... I am seeking help in tracing which unit he was with so that I can then pore over the respective War Diaries...

At least at one time it looks like he was with the 69th Field Ambulance, part of 23rd Division.

Regards

Chris

[johnmelling1979]

Hello

I am wondering if there any more information on this chap below

Hugh G Charnock

Born Whittle le Woods

Died : 8 November 1918

Home

Reg no - 67222

Rank : Sergeant

Enlisted at Sheffield

35 Coy, Royal Army Medical Corps

Enlisted at on 31 August 1915

After dying at 8:50pm of Infuenza at London General Hospital being admitted on

1 November 1918

Looking at whats left of the medical report I found he officially died of

Infuenza, Pneumonia, and Pleurisy

He had been previouly ill in 1915 and 1916 of the same illnesses whilst in Sheffield.

Married Sarah Broadhurst Schofield

His widow and children were given a pension of 36\3 a week.

His Gravestone is at St Johns, Whittle le Woods

Cheers John Melling

​

[BJanman]

Hi Bjay,

I am currently researching Major Hugh Ross Macintyre DSO, MC + Bar, MID, MD, PHD RAMC, I have his MIC he entered theatre of war 22/12/1914 France, I have copies of his three Citations all for Conspicuous Gallantry, MC 16/08/1917, MC Bar, 18/03/1918, DSO 01/02/1919 for conspicuous gallantry during operation on the 3rd Battle of Piave, Italy between 27th and 29th 1918, MID 04/01/1917.

Hugh Ross Macintyre was born 1882 in NewChwang,(now Yingkon) China, to a Scottish Mother and Father who were both missionaries, along with the famous missionary John Ross, Hugh mothers brother. He attended George Watson's College in Edinburgh Scotland qualified as a doctor from Edinburgh University 1904. MB, Ch. B. 1908 M.D., Practised as a locum in East Harlsey, Northhallerton, Yorkshire, England, RAMC 1914 Dec Lieut.,Captain Dec 1915, Major Jan 1918. Hugh died age 50 on 23 February 1932 while practising with his wife Dr Lilian Sarah Macintyre at Broad Green Sanatorium Edge Lane Drive Liverpool England.

I am not sure if you have the highly decorated RAMC office on your data base, but currently I have nothing on his military service or a photograph of him, therefore, I am seeking help in tracing which unit he was with so that I can then pore over the respective War Diaries.

I am also not sure if this is the right thread to post a request for help in reference to his military service.

With kind regards

Hiram

Hi Hiram

I have him listed as entering the war in France with No 9 Casualty Clearing Station [or 9 Clearing Hospital as it was named at the time].

I also have him listed as serving with the 69th Field Ambulance, and 29th Field Ambulance (according to a book I have on DSOs]

I have not researched this to see if the above is accurate, and do not know what order he served in these units or if he served in any other units as well. The war diary for No 9 CCS would probably be the place to start.

Hope that helps.

Barbara

[clk]

This is also running as a separate topic,, and is a good example as why not to post the same question in two places. People trying to help duplicate effort, and end up tripping over each other.

Regards

Chris

[BJanman]

Hello

I am wondering if there any more information on this chap below

Hugh G Charnock

Born Whittle le Woods

Died : 8 November 1918

Home

Reg no - 67222

Rank : Sergeant

Enlisted at Sheffield

35 Coy, Royal Army Medical Corps

Enlisted at on 31 August 1915

After dying at 8:50pm of Infuenza at London General Hospital being admitted on

1 November 1918

Looking at whats left of the medical report I found he officially died of

Infuenza, Pneumonia, and Pleurisy

He had been previouly ill in 1915 and 1916 of the same illnesses whilst in Sheffield.

Married Sarah Broadhurst Schofield

His widow and children were given a pension of 36\3 a week.

His Gravestone is at St Johns, Whittle le Woods

Cheers John Melling

​

He has a service record on Ancestry.

This is also running as a separate topic,, and is a good example as why not to post the same question in two places. People trying to help duplicate effort, and end up tripping over each other.

Regards

Chris

See the forum doesn't change much, lol.

Barbara

[Guest]

Mate,

This may be hard to confirm but I have a number of British Doctors attached to AIF units in Palestine.

Some I found by their MIC but I am still not sure on all, can they be confirmed?

ANDERSON George Grantham Dr Capt British Army RAMC to Maj 51 BGH F&B buried Etaples Military Cemetery France (CMF) Australian in UK on medical studies when war started joined the British Army

BATES M Dr T/Capt British Army RAMC to RMO 67 Sqn (1 Sqn) AFC

BELLAS JS Dr Capt British Army RAMC att RMO HQ 67 Sqn (1 Sqn) AFC att 5 Wing RFC (not identified)

CAPON Norman Brandon Dr Capt British Army RAMC att ACFA

COLLIER Willliam Tregonwell Dr Capt British Army RMO 2Bn ICC MC MID WIA 19-4-17 WIA 27-11-17 back shrapnel Ex RAMC to 15 GH to 88 GH

DeBOAR Henry Speldewinde Dr Capt British Army RAMC RMO 1Bn Royal Dublin Fusiliers (G) to RMO HQ/1Bn ICC 12-16 to ACFA to 5 LHFA 7-18 later Director of Medical Service Uganda CMG MC MRCS

GREEN Claude Dr Capt British Army RAMC att RMO 2 LH Sig Sqn

LINTON RF Dr Capt British Army RAMC to RMO RHQ/14 LHR AKA Lindon

McDOO N/R Dr Capt British Army to ICC RMO (not identified)

Cheers

S.B