Kymmie Posted 22 January , 2023 Share Posted 22 January , 2023 36 minutes ago, museumtom said: We search for soldiers who died after discharge, before 31/08/1921 from anything that was caused by or was contracted during the war. Some of them are entitled to be remembered in the Commonwealth War Graves Commission, however Walter died after this date so does not qualify. Cheers. Tom. Below from. Tom regardless of the timeframe do you think his Tuberculosis was from the war ? I know his dad died of TB as well so it was already prevelant in his family before he went to war and being as it's contagious .I guess that's something I will never know ,was a hero In My eyes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 22 January , 2023 Share Posted 22 January , 2023 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Kymmie said: do you think his Tuberculosis was from the war ? A Ministry of Pensions pension card at WFA/Fold3 Image thanks to WFA/Fold3 The 40/- pw pension was a 100% disability rate - 100% rate typically in cases of TB being chosen to try and help avoid a man going out to work and spreading the disease! Ministry of Pensions pension ledger at WFA/Fold3 Image thanks to WFA/Fold3 Shows he got his disability pension for TB The MoP reason for a disability pension being awarded ... Image thanks to @ss002d6252 i.e. Caused or at least aggravated by service We can see from the pension card that apparently his MoP FILE DESTROYED, 23.10.28 - for award files this was standard practice once their use was passed. M Edited 22 January , 2023 by Matlock1418 add Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 22 January , 2023 Share Posted 22 January , 2023 11 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said: A Ministry of Pensions pension card at WFA/Fold3 Image thanks to WFA/Fold3 The 40/- pw pension was a 100% disability rate - 100% rate typically in cases of TB being chosen to try and help avoid a man going out to work and spreading the disease! Ministry of Pensions pension ledger at WFA/Fold3 Image thanks to WFA/Fold3 Shows he got his disability pension for TB The MoP reason for a disability pension being awarded ... Image thanks to @ss002d6252 i.e. Caused or at least aggravated by service We can see from the pension card that apparently his MoP FILE DESTROYED, 23.10.28 - for award files this was standard practice once their use was passed. M Oh wow that's incredible info thanks so much for sharing this with me really appreciate it 😊 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 22 January , 2023 Share Posted 22 January , 2023 4 minutes ago, Kymmie said: Oh wow that's incredible info thanks so much for sharing this with me really appreciate it 😊 That made me feel so sad ,he was dead within 2 years of coming home ,his dad died 1889 from TB so Walters probably was from war ,he was a jockey before the war who bred dogs and trained horses ,just makes it all so real and bloody fascinating,the rabbit holes are endless, thanks again for the priceless precious pictures and information Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 22 January , 2023 Share Posted 22 January , 2023 11 minutes ago, Kymmie said: Oh wow that's incredible info thanks so much for sharing this with me really appreciate it 😊 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC78 Posted 23 January , 2023 Share Posted 23 January , 2023 One here for the Ireland detectives: James White 44480 Royal Defence Corps, died 27/05/1921. Not much to go on, SWB roll says he enlisted on 25/04/1917 and was discharged due to sickness on 09/11/1917, age 51. Another pension card gives his disability as debility aggravated by service. No names of any relatives, the only address I have is the one above at Cork. I've looked but can't find a corresponding death certificate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 5 hours ago, PaulC78 said: One here for the Ireland detectives: James White 44480 Royal Defence Corps, died 27/05/1921. Not much to go on, SWB roll says he enlisted on 25/04/1917 and was discharged due to sickness on 09/11/1917, age 51. Another pension card gives his disability as debility aggravated by service. No names of any relatives, the only address I have is the one above at Cork. I've looked but can't find a corresponding death certificate. Is 23 South mall county Cork the place he died do you think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 11 hours ago, PaulC78 said: he enlisted on 25/04/1917 1914? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner 87 Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, Kymmie said: Is 23 South mall county Cork the place he died do you think Hi Kymmie. Looking at the newspapers I found nothing for James at Find My Past but I did find some interesting information about the address of 23 South Mall, Cork. In 1887 it was up for auction and described as a 'Desirable Dwelling House and Premises with Offices', possibly not accommodation James would reside in. More relevant perhaps is in 1918 it was care of the Ministry of Pensions and in 1921 this appears to still be the case. Considering this I think it was most likely the offices of the ministry assisting James to apply for his pension. I have attached te articles from he Cork Constitution 22nd January 1887, Irish Independent 23rd August 1918 and Cork Weekly News 16th April 1921 all relating to 23 South Mall. Edited 24 January , 2023 by Gunner 87 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 8 minutes ago, Gunner 87 said: Hi Kymmie. Looking at the newspapers I found nothing for James at Find My Past but I did find some interesting information about the address of 23 South Mall, Cork. In 1887 it was up for auction and described as a' Desirable Dwelling House and Premises with Offices', possibly not a premises James would reside in. More relevant perhaps is in 1918 it was care of the Ministry of Pensions and in 1921 this appears to still be the case. Considering this I think it was most likely the offices of the ministry assisting James to apply for his pension. I have attached te articles from he Cork Constitution 22nd January 1887, Irish Independent 23rd August 1918 and Cork Weekly News 16th April 1921 all relating to 23 South Mall. Hi Gunner Ahhhhh that makes perfect sense,these webpages charge way to much for Research i think ill wait for a free trial to come up before i go done more rabbit holes of finding people ,its so addictive ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner 87 Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 1 minute ago, Kymmie said: Hi Gunner Ahhhhh that makes perfect sense,these webpages charge way to much for Research i think ill wait for a free trial to come up before i go done more rabbit holes of finding people ,its so addictive ! Both Ancestry and Find My Past are offering 14 Day Free Trials at the mo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 4 minutes ago, Gunner 87 said: Both Ancestry and Find My Past are offering 14 Day Free Trials at the mo... ok im on it ! thankyou ~~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 January , 2023 Author Share Posted 24 January , 2023 Perhaps he did not died in Ireland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 1 hour ago, Gunner 87 said: Hi Kymmie. Looking at the newspapers I found nothing for James at Find My Past but I did find some interesting information about the address of 23 South Mall, Cork. In 1887 it was up for auction and described as a 'Desirable Dwelling House and Premises with Offices', possibly not accommodation James would reside in. More relevant perhaps is in 1918 it was care of the Ministry of Pensions and in 1921 this appears to still be the case. Considering this I think it was most likely the offices of the ministry assisting James to apply for his pension. I have attached te articles from he Cork Constitution 22nd January 1887, Irish Independent 23rd August 1918 and Cork Weekly News 16th April 1921 all relating to 23 South Mall. i found this but when i click and open the death cert i cant really make out the handwriting 4400293.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie) Death of JAMES WHITE in 1921 Group Registration ID 3352123 SR District/Reg Area Dublin South Deceased Age at Death 51 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 January , 2023 Author Share Posted 24 January , 2023 http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Kingstown_No__3/George_s_Street__Lower/91119/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 1 minute ago, museumtom said: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Kingstown_No__3/George_s_Street__Lower/91119/ Nephritis mean Kidney issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 13 minutes ago, Kymmie said: Nephritis mean Kidney issues? Not a medic, but yes in my opinion - and Anaemia M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 2 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said: Not a medic, but yes in my opinion - and Anaemia M thanks Matlock! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner 87 Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Kymmie said: Nephritis mean Kidney issues? I see he was a publican which may have been a factor for kidney issues... on the second Pension Ledger and Index Card, attached, James is recorded as suffering from 'Debility' aggravated by his service, which I understand is 'Debility Syndrome' and covers a host of ailments. Edited 24 January , 2023 by Gunner 87 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 4 minutes ago, Gunner 87 said: I see he was a publican which may have been a factor for kidney issues... on the pension card James is recorded as suffering from 'Debility' aggravated by his service, which I understand is 'Debility Syndrome' and covers a host of ailments. i had to google Debility Syndrome' learn something new everyday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 Thought i had him for a brief second but no !! 2079313 Private James White served 338 days from 29/12/1916 to 01/12/1917. Disability: Injury to head, formally a miner Age 50 at last birthday. Injured 1915 at Stoke-On-Trent (in mine?) prior to war service, says a lump of rock fell on his head in the coal mines. Labour Corps. 297t Company. James White No. 2079313 - Reason for discharge being no longer physically fit for war service. Military character was very good, and well conducted during short service.Grave 10727, Block 51, Row 7, 16th along Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC78 Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 Thanks all for the comments! 14 hours ago, George Rayner said: 1914? The SWB roll says 1917, but I can see how the medal card above might be read as 1914. 13 hours ago, museumtom said: Handwriting can be tricky though - I would probably have read that age as 37 rather than 51! It's a close fit, slightly different date of death though and no way to prove it without any other matching details. If it is the same man he would have no case for commemoration as the disability and cause of death don't match. I managed to find the following in the Evening Herald (Dublin) 17 May 1921: If he's buried at Glasnvein Cemetery then I can't find him in their online database. Incidentally, that address is currently an Irish Cancer Society charity shop. 13 hours ago, Matlock1418 said: Not a medic, but yes in my opinion - and Anaemia I think its uraemia on the DC. 14 hours ago, museumtom said: Perhaps he did not died in Ireland? Entirely possible. If the age on the SWB roll is to believed then he would have been 54-55 when he died, but if not in Ireland then it could have been anywhere! I can't see any other likely candidates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 Two thoughts I still think it says 1914-differences in formation of 7&4 fairly clear to my eye. Unless you have other evidence for enlistment date? And I would agree with 31 not 57 George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC78 Posted 24 January , 2023 Share Posted 24 January , 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, George Rayner said: I still think it says 1914-differences in formation of 7&4 fairly clear to my eye. Unless you have other evidence for enlistment date? From the SWB roll: EDIT: A further search of the newspapers turned up the following report from the Dublin Daily Express, 31 August 1917. Since this falls within the above dates but makes no mention of military service, perhaps it's an argument for it not being the same man? Full article on FMP: https://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0001384%2f19170831%2f026&stringtohighlight=70 lower george street Edited 24 January , 2023 by PaulC78 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kymmie Posted 25 January , 2023 Share Posted 25 January , 2023 2 hours ago, PaulC78 said: From the SWB roll: EDIT: A further search of the newspapers turned up the following report from the Dublin Daily Express, 31 August 1917. Since this falls within the above dates but makes no mention of military service, perhaps it's an argument for it not being the same man? Full article on FMP: https://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0001384%2f19170831%2f026&stringtohighlight=70 lower george street Wow you guys are incredible working it all out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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