Kings Shropshire Light Infantry

[ernest1]

Matt email sent (I think)

Annette thank you very much for the help.

[zipadeedoodaa]

Hello Annette,

I have recently visited Hadra War Memorial Cemetery in Alexandria, Egypt, visiting my Uncle's grave - Francis John Bailey 203570 8th.Btn.K.S.L.I died 5.5.1918.

I searched the register for Hadra cemetery and found two other graves. Private Jack Lloyd , Knowbury,Ludlow 23796 and Second Lieutenant J.V.Church.. belonging to K.S.L.I.

I am in touch with J.Lloyd's relatives and I would like to get a bit more information about him, for them, if possibel.

Do you, by any chance have anything on him. He died 12.12.1916.

Many thanks,

Neville

[bushfighter]

Casualty Details

Name: WALKER, SAMUEL

Initials: S

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Serjeant

Regiment/Service: King's Shropshire Light Infantry

Unit Text: 3rd Bn.

Secondary Regiment: Nigeria Regiment, W.A.F.F.

Secondary Unit Text: attd.

Age: 23

Date of Death: 17/10/1917

Service No: 12485

Additional information: Son of Samuel and Annie Walker, of 67, Rigg St., Crewe, England.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: 3. G. 5.

Cemetery: DAR ES SALAAM WAR CEMETERY

Annette

If at this stage you would like more details about his East African service and death, please send a PM.

Harry

[bushfighter]

Casualty Details

Name: HIGGINS, PERCY CLYNTON

Initials: P C

Nationality: United Kingdom

Rank: Captain

Regiment/Service: King's Shropshire Light Infantry

Unit Text: 1st Bn.

Secondary Regiment: Nigeria Regiment, W.A.F.F.

Secondary Unit Text: attd.

Age: 28

Date of Death: 22/09/1917

Additional information: Son of Lt. Col. R. T. Higgins.

Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead

Grave/Memorial Reference: 7. J. 5.

Cemetery: DAR ES SALAAM WAR CEMETERY

Annette

If at this stage you would like more details about his East African service and death, please send a PM.

Harry

[6th Shropshires]

Annette

The only extra to his S W Badge Medal Card is the age.Oh, and the Badge number which is 298809.

Hywyn

Cheers Hywyn, sorry for delay, I tend to be in a rush when I visit the forum, and wizz through the posts and somehow missed looking at my own thread

Annette

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Annette,

As a member with an obvious interest in the King's Shropshire Light Infantry, you may like to look at a rare item from my Collection, a WW1 King's Shropshire Light Infantry 1907 Hooked Quillion Bayonet with regimental issues marks on the Pommel.

In addition, the bayonet has the extremely rare Mk.1 scabbard with the internal chape.

Regards,

LF

[6th Shropshires]

Hi Neville

I only have C.W.G.V. & SD info. on 23796 Pte. John Lloyd, which I am guessing you have but if you don't have this info. let me know. Going by his number and the records of men near that number I can say he was called up on 22nd March 1916, he was possibly posted to Salonika on 9th Sept 1916 joining the 8th Battalion on 13th Sept. (I got the later info. from 23724 Pte. Edwin Thomas,Lloyd service papers, how these two may be related because Edwin was born in Caynham and lived in Dhu Stone Lane, Clee Hill, which is about a fifhteen minute walk away from

Knowbury but then again there were lots of Lloyds on the Hill in them days and I doubt they were all related).

I have looked in Regimental History to see where and when he may have recieved his wounds, the only action or events near the 12th Dec. 1916, was a large raid carried out on "the Nose" on the night of 26th/27th November. Also all the men who I know were wounded in the raid appear in a casualty list in the Ludlow Advertiser dated 13th Jan. 1917, this list includes 23796 Pte. John Lloyd.

I have recently visited Hadra War Memorial Cemetery in Alexandria, Egypt, visiting my Uncle's grave - Francis John Bailey 203570 8th.Btn.K.S.L.I died 5.5.1918.

Neville I have conflicting info. on your uncle SD records him as Frank Bailey and died while serving with the 10th Battalion, C.W.G.C. also records 10th Batt. and gives his initials as F J.

His number comes from a range that trained with the 4th Reserve Battalion and posted to the 10th Battalion around 29-07-17. On 29th April 1918 the 10th Battalion entrained at Kantara for Alexandria.

Annette

[Lancashire Fusilier]

More KSLI bayonet pics

More KSLI bayonet pic.

[6th Shropshires]

Cheers Harry for the info. on Captain Higgins and Pte Walker, I'll send you a PM as I have nothing on Captain Higgins.

Annette

[6th Shropshires]

Cheers LF for photos, I used to collect when I had money Can I ask how you know from the marking that it's K.S.L.I. I only ask because I have a 1907 bayonet but not the hooked one like yours, the writing on mine is worn but on the handle it as what looks like O.I?.C. then CL. C. and 277 just wondered what it stood for.

Annette

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Annette,

Many thanks for the reply.

Ian Skennerton, who has written extensively on the subject, published a comprehensive list of regimental markings in his book " The Broad Arrow ", and on page 96 ( Unit and Issue markings ) you will see the mark " SH " is designated for the King's Shropshire Light Infantry.

I think that the mark on your bayonet is " O.T.C " for Officer Training Corps, and " CL.C " is for Clifton College, with " 277 " being the bayonet issue number.

The OTC & CL.C marks are shown on page 98 of the same book.

Hope that helps,

Regards,

Leo

[zipadeedoodaa]

Thank you, Annette,

The information you give me about John Lloyd is helpful. I have most of it, but your reference to Ludlow Advertiser was not known to me.

I have all the information about my Uncle.

Thank you once again.

Neville

Hi Neville

I only have C.W.G.V. & SD info. on 23796 Pte. John Lloyd, which I am guessing you have but if you don't have this info. let me know. Going by his number and the records of men near that number I can say he was called up on 22nd March 1916, he was possibly posted to Salonika on 9th Sept 1916 joining the 8th Battalion on 13th Sept. (I got the later info. from 23724 Pte. Edwin Thomas,Lloyd service papers, how these two may be related because Edwin was born in Caynham and lived in Dhu Stone Lane, Clee Hill, which is about a fifhteen minute walk away from

Knowbury but then again there were lots of Lloyds on the Hill in them days and I doubt they were all related).

I have looked in Regimental History to see where and when he may have recieved his wounds, the only action or events near the 12th Dec. 1916, was a large raid carried out on "the Nose" on the night of 26th/27th November. Also all the men who I know were wounded in the raid appear in a casualty list in the Ludlow Advertiser dated 13th Jan. 1917, this list includes 23796 Pte. John Lloyd.

Neville I have conflicting info. on your uncle SD records him as Frank Bailey and died while serving with the 10th Battalion, C.W.G.C. also records 10th Batt. and gives his initials as F J.

His number comes from a range that trained with the 4th Reserve Battalion and posted to the 10th Battalion around 29-07-17. On 29th April 1918 the 10th Battalion entrained at Kantara for Alexandria.

Annette

[6th Shropshires]

I think that the mark on your bayonet is " O.T.C " for Officer Training Corps, and " CL.C " is for Clifton College, with " 277 " being the bayonet issue number.

Thanks Leo

[GraemeClarke]

Hi Annette,

Whilst researching another soldier I found the below which may be of interest to you (or not).

On the back of a piece of relevant paperwork was a list of critical injuries to other soldiers (obviously re-using paper). This relates to

Pte. 8272 John Barber, 1KSLI who 'died' on 6/10/14. SDGW records 'DIED' which suggests, well you know what it suggests.

The paper records that he was 'wounded right thigh, condition very serious'.

May or may not mean anything to you,

Graeme

[6th Shropshires]

Hi Graeme

Thanks,that is useful, Pte. 8272 John Barber, seems to have died from Tetanus, which I guess he got from the wound or should I say the object that wounded him. What was the relevant paperwork just so I can add this to his notes (in the past I have failed to record where info. came from).

Cheers

Annette

[GraemeClarke]

Hi

Here it is

The date under the notations do not appear to bear any relation to his date of death.

regards

Graeme

[6th Shropshires]

Cheers again Graeme, like you say the date under the notations bear any relation to his date of death (must probly date the doc was recieved at War office.

Annette

[Guest]

I've been trawling the internet for information on my great grandfather.

Looking at his using his cap badge,I presume he was in the King's Shropshire Light Infantry

He lived in Whitchurch, Shropshire before the war, and have been told he had some kind of rifle with scope on, operating for part of the war as a sniper.

Near the end of the war was wounded in action whilst shooting down from the top of a church(?) and a bullet going through the wood below him.

John Fowles:

1894 -1977

(He is the one on the left)

[6th Shropshires]

Hi efbe

Your great grandfather may be 10980 John Fowles, I have nothing on where this man lived but three men either side of his number enlisted in Whitchurch on 19th August 1914. 10980 John Fowles landed in France with the 5th Battalion on 22nd May 1915, he is reported wounded in Ludlow Advertiser under date 10th June 1915, and I believe he was wounded some time between 1st & 5th June. I do not yet have his Victory/British medal roll page yet so not sure if he served in any other Battalion, he was discharged to class Z Reserve on 26-03-19. Do you think the above is your great grandfather.

I have the names of a few more Fowles with at last one of whom is from Whitchurch.

Annette

[Guest]

Hi efbe

Your great grandfather may be 10980 John Fowles, I have nothing on where this man lived but three men either side of his number enlisted in Whitchurch on 19th August 1914. 10980 John Fowles landed in France with the 5th Battalion on 22nd May 1915, he is reported wounded in Ludlow Advertiser under date 10th June 1915, and I believe he was wounded some time between 1st & 5th June. I do not yet have his Victory/British medal roll page yet so not sure if he served in any other Battalion, he was discharged to class Z Reserve on 26-03-19. Do you think the above is your great grandfather.

I have the names of a few more Fowles with at last one of whom is from Whitchurch.

Annette

Annette. Yes that is definitely him. Thank you very much for that info!

The family was from Whitchurch, actually from a small town outside Whitchurch called Quoisley. If you have any further info about other Fowles I would be very appreciative.

[6th Shropshires]

Hi efbe

Here is list of Fowles who served in K.S.L.I.

19289 A/Cpl. Fowles, William Fitzray resided 40 High St., Bridgnorth, Shrops. K.S.L.I. Info. from Absent Voters Lists 1918.

22301 Pte. Fowles, Frederick, Born Prees Heath, Shrops. Enlisted Oswestry, Shrops. 7/K.S.L.I. K. in A. 09/04/17. Aged 26. Son of Samuel Fowles, of New Street Lane, Market Drayton. His name is on the Arras Memorial. Info. from C.W.G.C., Soldiers Died & Victory/British War Medal Rolls.

22424 Pte. Fowles, George, Resided 144 Wrexham Rd., Whitchurch, Shrops.) 7th + 1/K.S.L.I. Reported released from POW camp. Info. from Absent Voters Lists 1918, Victory/British War Medal Rolls & Ludlow Advertiser 21-12-18.

34810 Pte. Fowles, Harry , K.S.L.I. Trans. to L.C. 629290. Info. from M.I.C.

203854 Pte. Fowles, Sydney Born Runcorn, Ches.Enlisted Runcorn, Ches. K.S.L.I. Trans. to 2/6/War. Regt. 260165 K. in A. 06/09/17. Aged 20, Son of James and Mary Jane Fowles, of 4, Curzon St., Runcorn, Cheshire. Buried in New Irish Farm, Cemetery, Ypres. Info. from M.I.C., C.W.G.C. & Soldiers Died.

Annette

[Guest]

HELP -

I am trying to find out about my grandfather Private John (Jack) Percival Smith born 1897 Llanfair Caereinion, enlisted Shrops Yeomanry, appears to have been transfered KSLI, he has two service nos -

Shropshire Yeomanry 2807 Private

King's Shropshire Light Infantry 26691 Private

I don't know any person details other than he was awarded the 2 war medals, I was told by my gran he served on the Somme and I believe Hill 70 Ypers. Not sure when he enlisted / was drafted, I was told it was 1916 but this is not definite.

Would you be drafted into a TF unit? Why does he have two service no? In his photo (which looks like the standard post basic training pic) he has the Shrops Yeomanry cap badge. Yet his medals are awarded to him under his Shrops Yeomanry enlistment. Is there a responsible explanation for this?

Hope someone can help

[6th Shropshires]

Hi jazds

Did your grandfather move to the Upton Magna area, Absent Voters records 26691 Pte. John Percival Smith residence as The Villa, Withington, while Wellinton and Shrewsbury Journal records Upton Magna.

All the men near his K.S.L.I. number who's service papers I have landed in France on 20-09-16 and Transfarred from Shropshire Yeomanry to the 4th K.S.L.I. on 29-09-16 but were then posted to the 7th Battalion, I have your grandfather's medal roll entry which confirms he was also first posted to the 7th Battalion but finnished up with the 1st Battalion

He is recorded as wounded in the 16-12-16 addition of Wellinton and Shrewsbury Journal this places him being wounded in early to mid November 1916 (likly to have been during the 7th Batt's fighting at Serre over 13th -14th November but at moment I am only 85 % of this I have not finished working on casualty lists).

He is again recorded wounded in the 13-10-17 addition of Wellinton and Shrewsbury Journal but I have done no work on this list of casualties yet, so not sure whether this was with the 7th or 1st Battalion but would have in early to mid September 1917 (could have been with the 1st Batt. who were in Loos area including at few spell at Hill 70, which is in Loos area not Ypres )

He is recorded wounded for a third time in the 02-11-18 addition of the Ludlow Advertiser, again I have not yet worked on this list of casualties but am sure he recieved this wound with the 1st Battalion during late September 1918 (in Fresnoy-le-Petit area) or early October (Mericourt area).

As I have seid I am still working on casualty lists the above is only a rough guide but once I have worked on the seid lists I will be more sure of where he recived his wounds, only problem is I have only got to early 1916 at moment so could be a year or more to get to late 1918.

I do not know alot about medals but I think medals are issued by the Regiment he served in last.

Could I ask for a copy of his picture please to add to my collect of K.S.L.I. lads.

Annette

[Guest]

Hi Annettee,

Thanks for your reply I'm over the moon with the information you've provided.

Did your grandfather move to the Upton Magna area, Absent Voters records 26691 Pte. John Percival Smith residence as The Villa, Withington, while Wellinton and Shrewsbury Journal records Upton Magna.

Unfortunately, I don't know. We never had any contact with his side of the family, they appear to have lost contact and he did long before I was born. I can provide some information that may be helpful, also if anyone else has any details of the family - it would be gratefully received .

He met my gran Lottie Rogers (from 3, Chaple Street, Shrewsbury), either during or shortly after the war. They were married in St Chads, Shrewsbury 1920ish. They soon moved to Sheriffhales, Shropshire where they took on a farm. This didn't work out debts mounted and cattle died of some disease and they moved in the early to mid 30's (1932 I believe) to Birmingham (45 Well Green Road, then to 210 Church Road, Sheldon).

John Percival Smith was born on 13th Janurary 1897 in Llanfyllin district, Llanfair. The family lived at "46" Bryn Penarth, Llanfair Cardigeon, they appear in the 1901 Census as -

Edwin Smith father - pig and cattle dealer aged 40

Emily J Smith wife 36

Edwin Jnr 14

Arthur C. G. 12

Harold M 10

Joseph 8

Myfanwy 7

Fredrick N 6

John P 4

Florence M 4mths

The family I was told went on to own butchers shops in Llanfair and local area. I believe they were still living there in 1948, but after that... no idea. I am at this moment chasing up leads.

I wasn't aware he'd been wounded so many times. I was told he was gassed. I will try and get more information from relatives and post an update.

Please find attached a copy of his photo in uniform Shrops Yeo

[6th Shropshires]

Thanks jazds for photo & extra info on grandfather.

Also just looked at map and see Withington is just a few miles away from Upton Magna and Sheriffhales is also not far away.

Annette