Postcards

[Kimberley John Lindsay]

Dear All, and Muerrisch,

I would have thought the maxim "Nothing but the Best" would be preferable. 

The lack of symmetry gave the whole an unfortunate lop-sided - and somehow Unfinished - appearance...

Kindest regards,

Kim.

Edited 24 June , 2020 by Kimberley John Lindsay

[Muerrisch]

Perhaps you did not catch the irony.

 

I do irony, some do not........ton od emos ,ynori od I

[Jerry B]

interesting pc, lots of medals,swords, and flashed sun helmets, but I have no idea of the actual unit they are from. 

 

All nco's from a cavalry (from the swords and breeches?) unit I assume, a mc and 2 mm's among the medals as well as WWI trios (many with the bar) and pairs, by an egyptian photographer. 

 

The mc holder has a S in wreath under larger crown on his right forearm and at least two have gun arm badges

Edited 26 June , 2020 by Jerry B

[charlie962]

25 minutes ago, Jerry B said:

nteresting pc, lots of medals,swords, and flashed sun helmets, but I have no idea of the actual unit they are from. 

 

All nco's from a cavalry (from the swords and breeches?) unit I assume, a mc and 2 mm's among the medals as well as WWI trios (many with the bar) and pairs, by an egyptian photographer. 

 

The mc holder has a S in wreath under larger crown on his right forearm and at least two have gun arm badges

They are all from an Artillery Battery, presumably RHA, judging by the amount of ball buttons.  So post-war, Cairo, RHA

 

All of a certain age except the youngest in the middle who has no medals.

 

 

Lots of Mons clasps

Edited 26 June , 2020 by charlie962

[Muerrisch]

The S wreath crown is tthe top qualification for survey, a key artillery skill.

Rare to see it in wear, thank you.

[GWF1967]

Lt. William Glynne Charles Gladstone.  M.P.   3rd Royal Welsh Fusiliers.  

Commissioned 2/Lt. 15th August 1914.   France 22nd March 1915.   Promoted Lt. 7th April 1915. 

 He wrote to his mother -   "I am very glad and proud to have got to the Front. It is not the length of existence that counts, but what is achieved during that existence, however short".

Lt. Gladstone was killed in action near Laventie 13th April 1915.  His body was disinterred on 22nd April, being the last (known) to be officially repatriated to the UK.  On 23rd April his body was reburied in the churchyard of St. Deiniol's church, Harwarden, Flintshire

Edited 26 June , 2020 by GWF1967

[IPT]

That's amazing. Have you got the actual card?

 

[FROGSMILE]

59 minutes ago, GWF1967 said:

Lt. William Glynne Charles Gladstone.  M.P.   3rd Royal Welsh Fusiliers.  

Commissioned 2/Lt. 15th August 1914.   France 22nd March 1915.   Promoted Lt. 7th April 1915. 

 He wrote to his mother -   "I am very glad and proud to have got to the Front. It is not the length of existence that counts, but what is achieved during that existence, however short".

Lt. Gladstone was killed in action near Laventie 13th April 1915.  His body was disinterred on 22nd April, being the last (known) to be officially repatriated to the UK.  On 23rd April his body was reburied in the churchyard of St. Deiniol's church, Harwarden, Flintshire

 

I’m assuming he might be associated with the family of the former Prime Minister?

Edited 26 June , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, Jerry B said:

interesting pc, lots of medals,swords, and flashed sun helmets, but I have no idea of the actual unit they are from. 

 

All nco's from a cavalry (from the swords and breeches?) unit I assume, a mc and 2 mm's among the medals as well as WWI trios (many with the bar) and pairs, by an egyptian photographer. 

 

The mc holder has a S in wreath under larger crown on his right forearm and at least two have gun arm badges

The three centrally seated warrant officers are not gunners, whereas the rest of them in the photo are RHA.  It suggests that the former are cavalry and I think that the two Wolseley helmets at centre have been strategically placed with their pagri flashes on view to signpost the two units.  Only the WOI (a 1914 BEF veteran) at centre is wearing a Sam Browne, the others are wearing the Indian pattern pistol belt and brace issued to those in appointments armed with a pistol and sword.  The photo seems to depict a Warrant Officers‘ and Sergeants’ Mess, with the RSM in pride of place at centre.

Edited 26 June , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[GWF1967]

52 minutes ago, IPT said:

That's amazing. Have you got the actual card?

 

 

 

1 hour ago, GWF1967 said:

 

Yes!

 The card was sent and signed by "A. Wheelton.  Rawtenstall" in my other thread.

[GWF1967]

18 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said:

I’m assuming he might be associated with the family of the former Prime Minister?

Yes, Grandson of W.E. Gladstone. 

 W.G.C. was the 4th generation of his family to serve as an M.P.

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, GWF1967 said:

Yes, Grandson of W.E. Gladstone. 

 W.G.C. was the 4th generation of his family to serve as an M.P.

I should have guessed when I saw that he was an immaculate Royal Welsh Fusilier.

[Jerry B]

9 hours ago, IPT said:

That's amazing. Have you got the actual card?

 

it was on ebay just recently, I considered bidding but did not in the end, though I did save the image and I assume the poster was the buyer.

[Jerry B]

glamorgan yeomanry undergoing an inspection at camp c1912, as published in Bryn Owen's Glamorgan Its gentlemen and yeomanry (plates between p120-121).

This is Bryn Owen's card from his collection, as marked on the reverse and I assume the actual card used for the plate

 

Edited 27 June , 2020 by Jerry B

[Jerry B]

10 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

The three centrally seated warrant officers are not gunners, whereas the rest of them in the photo are RHA.  It suggests that the former are cavalry and I think that the two Wolseley helmets at centre have been strategically placed with their pagri flashes on view to signpost the two units.  Only the WOI (a 1914 BEF veteran) at centre is wearing a Sam Browne, the others are wearing the Indian pattern pistol belt and brace issued to those in appointments armed with a pistol and sword.  The photo seems to depict a Warrant Officers‘ and Sergeants’ Mess, with the RSM in pride of place at centre.

thanks as always groggy.

 

I hope someone will have some info on the unit involved

[FROGSMILE]

4 minutes ago, Jerry B said:

thanks as always groggy.

 

I hope someone will have some info on the unit involved

There were only a certain number of Indian Stations (Cantonments) with RHA Troops and they were usually co-located with cavalry.

[Jerry B]

4 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said:

There were only a certain number of Indian Stations (Cantonments) with RHA Troops and they were usually co-located with cavalry.

 

the latter seems to be the case, obviously mixed cavalry and gunners in the pic.  I assume such units are not as well researched as those in other theaters of service

[FROGSMILE]

14 minutes ago, Jerry B said:

 

the latter seems to be the case, obviously mixed cavalry and gunners in the pic.  I assume such units are not as well researched as those in other theaters of service

I think it’s more to do with the fact that the British-Indian Army’s history in the period between the wars has largely been lost from public consciousness in Britain.  It’s a Colonial legacy that doesn’t sit comfortably with current thinking and attitudes.  The details still exist in places like the archives of the India Office and the Royal Artillery Institute (the latter currently in storage awaiting a home).  You can also find quite a bit in FIBIwiki.

Edited 27 June , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Jerry B]

12 hours ago, charlie962 said:

They are all from an Artillery Battery, presumably RHA, judging by the amount of ball buttons.  So post-war, Cairo, RHA

 

All of a certain age except the youngest in the middle who has no medals.

 

 

Lots of Mons clasps

thank you

12 hours ago, Muerrisch said:

The S wreath crown is tthe top qualification for survey, a key artillery skill.

Rare to see it in wear, thank you.

thank you, I wonder how many mc winners had qualified for it

[Muerrisch]

The three centrally seated warrant officers are not gunners, whereas the rest of them in the photo are RHA.  It suggests that the former are cavalry and I think that the two Wolseley helmets at centre have been strategically placed with their pagri flashes on view to signpost the two units. 

 

It seems to be a verylarge WO and sergeants' Mess.

All three appear to be wearing ball buttons, usually RHA but some cavalry, so on that score they could be cavalry.

They do not wear the gun badge.

The helmet display does suggest two units.

 

However, the rhs [seen by viewer] WO II has the unique to RA survey badge.  I think that he is the senior RHA man present. Why no gun badges I cannot suggest.

There is always a story to these group photos.

Super posting!

[FROGSMILE]

I agree that the absence of guns and yet a survey badge seems odd and I don’t know what the answer to that is.  The RE were the first to employ Surveyors (then to RA), but the ball buttons and absence of a bomb rules them out.
Ball buttons were first worn by all Hussar regiments, from whom the RHA emulated the practice.  It was not the other way around.

I don’t think that the Sergeants’ Mess shown is particularly large, once the specialists are factored in there were quite a number of WOs and SNCOs in a combined unit.

Edited 27 June , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[GWF1967]

2 hours ago, Jerry B said:

it was on ebay just recently,  I assume the poster was the buyer.

Indeed.  

 I’ve seen the same photograph before, but seemingly reproduced from a newspaper photograph, so heavily pixelated. 

[Jerry B]

2 hours ago, Jerry B said:

glamorgan yeomanry undergoing an inspection at camp c1912, as published in Bryn Owen's Glamorgan Its gentlemen and yeomanry (plates between p120-121).

This is Bryn Owen's card from his collection, as marked on the reverse and I assume the actual card used for the plate

 

 

 

another Glamorgan yeomanry pc that came as part of the lot, this one with analysis annotated on the reverse but not with the bryn owen stamp, instead a monograph that I do not recognise but likely part of his collection

 

at camp c 1910 Pontypridd.  I note that some have the striped regimental breeches and knotted cuffs and one blurry figure has the regimental banded cap, perhaps an officer.

 

 

Just now, GWF1967 said:

Indeed.  

 I’ve seen the same photograph before, but seemingly reproduced from a newspaper photograph, so heavily pixelated. 

 

glad it went to a good home, I was very tempted to bid

[Dragoon]

12 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

The three centrally seated warrant officers are not gunners, whereas the rest of them in the photo are RHA.  It suggests that the former are cavalry and I think that the two Wolseley helmets at centre have been strategically placed with their pagri flashes on view to signpost the two units.  Only the WOI (a 1914 BEF veteran) at centre is wearing a Sam Browne, the others are wearing the Indian pattern pistol belt and brace issued to those in appointments armed with a pistol and sword.  The photo seems to depict a Warrant Officers‘ and Sergeants’ Mess, with the RSM in pride of place at centre.

I do believe the three WO's are RHA.

The RSM, and two Battery Sergeant Majors either side.

Their helmets are shown probably to show two separate Battery's by the Helmet flash.

I have a photo of my Great Grandfather in Amritsar India in 1919, he's a BSM and wears no gun badge with his rank crown.

I don't think they are cavalry due to the lack of shoulder chains, and I know the cavalry loved their shoulder chains, especially on this form of dress.

Just my thoughts on this wonderful photo.

Chris

[David Hewitt]

Heres one from the other side, if not allowed I will take it down