Muerrisch Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 17 hours ago, FROGSMILE said: Interesting and puzzling in equal measure. Thank you for looking and reporting back. I wonder if he is RAMC as we assumed. He might just be one of those cases where a man [technically incorrectly] wears the Geneva Cross because of previous RAMC service or medical training ....... we have seen several such on this thread. His cap badge does look rather big for RAMC, and his shoulder strap/ S/T area looks unusual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Muerrisch said: I wonder if he is RAMC as we assumed. He might just be one of those cases where a man [technically incorrectly] wears the Geneva Cross because of previous RAMC service or medical training ....... we have seen several such on this thread. His cap badge does look rather big for RAMC, and his shoulder strap/ S/T area looks unusual. Yes, I think you’re right, the badge does indeed look too big to be RAMC. I allowed myself to be blinded by his RAMC Geneva Cross, as you say. Perhaps he is Yeomanry and the regiment’s hospital sergeant, but also qualified as a Roughrider. It’s the kind of oddity that one often used to find in Territorial units right up until very recently. Edited 6 May , 2019 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Atkins Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 Army Veterinary Corps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scalyback Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 2 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said: Army Veterinary Corps? Geneva convention does not apply to animals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 AVC didn’t wear the Red Cross, and unlike combatant units of the cavalry and infantry they would not have been established for a hospital sergeant, so I think it unlikely, Pat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorporalPunishment Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 3 hours ago, FROGSMILE said: Yes, I think you’re right, the badge does indeed look too big to be RAMC. I allowed myself to be blinded by his RAMC Geneva Cross, as you say. Perhaps he is Yeomanry and the regiment’s hospital sergeant, but also qualified as a Roughrider. It’s the kind of oddity that one often used to find in Territorial units right up until very recently. I'm thinking Duke of Lancaster's Own Yeomanry myself. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, CorporalPunishment said: I'm thinking Duke of Lancaster's Own Yeomanry myself. Pete. The shape of the badge certainly fits, Pete. Edited 6 May , 2019 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Atkins Posted 6 May , 2019 Share Posted 6 May , 2019 6 hours ago, Scalyback said: Geneva convention does not apply to animals? Fair point, Scalyback! Also, interested to know that about hospital sergeant, thanks Frogsmile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scalyback Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 Hypothetical question. If a man qualified in regular service to a skill/trade was there any reason to stop him joining a completely different TF unit and requalify in a completely different skill/trade? Then going to a third unit........ We had a few unit jumpers in the TA but mostly clerks/chefs/stores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 33 minutes ago, Scalyback said: Hypothetical question. If a man qualified in regular service to a skill/trade was there any reason to stop him joining a completely different TF unit and requalify in a completely different skill/trade? Then going to a third unit........ We had a few unit jumpers in the TA but mostly clerks/chefs/stores. Nothing to stop him. Regulars and TF served under entirely different terms, whereas war-raised Service Battalions were seen as Regulars on limited service. Lots of men moved units and retrained. In particular many Corps and Departments were combed out in desperate efforts to bolster the diminished strength of the infantry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Brayley Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 NCOs and an Officer of the 4th Battalion, (Territorial Force ) Gloucestershire Regiment. This postcard was sent in August 1915, but I suspect it was taken earlier. Note the Imperial Service Tablet worn on the Sgts sash and the seldom seen Type B patrol uniform worn by the seated officer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Toby Brayley said: NCOs and an Officer of the 4th Battalion, (Territorial Force ) Gloucestershire Regiment. This postcard was sent in August 1915, but I suspect it was taken earlier. Note the Imperial Service Tablet worn on the Sgts sash and the seldom seen Type B patrol uniform worn by the seated officer. Superb image Toby. An early Type B blue patrol uniform that looks like it has been converted from a Type A by the tailor, given that the revers of the lapels are oddly cut. Perhaps this was to make use of a single pattern. The SNCO at right is dressed as a 2nd Class Staff Sergeant complete with sword. Edited 7 May , 2019 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Scalyback said: Hypothetical question. If a man qualified in regular service to a skill/trade was there any reason to stop him joining a completely different TF unit and requalify in a completely different skill/trade? Then going to a third unit........ We had a few unit jumpers in the TA but mostly clerks/chefs/stores. I suspect that the question behind the question is "and could such a qualification be worn in the new unit?" A moot point because some skills/trades had annual or requalification criteria especially if they carried extra pay. As to whether the practice happened: of course! Frogsmile and or Ron Clifton may well know better, but I think Hospital Sergeant as an appointment or as a paid extra duty died out c. 1880 in regular units. As to auxilliary, Militia/SR and VF/TF, I simply don't know but such units had an Hon Doctor [and a Padre] quite often. Pay Warrants. 1866 and 1870 have Hospital Sergeants. None on active service Zulu war 1879 as far as I can see. Still scratching. Edited 7 May , 2019 by Muerrisch addendum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Muerrisch said: I suspect that the question behind the question is "and could such a qualification be worn in the new unit?" A moot point because some skills/trades had annual or requalification criteria especially if they carried extra pay. As to whether the practice happened: of course! Frogsmile and or Ron Clifton may well know better, but I think Hospital Sergeant as an appointment or as a paid extra duty died out c. 1880 in regular units. As to auxilliary, Militia/SR and VF/TF, I simply don't know but such units had an Hon Doctor [and a Padre] quite often. I will scratch around Establishments and Pay Warrants. Yes, the term Hospital Sergeant became obsolete as you say, but in typical infantry fashion it continued to be used within the battalion for the regimental sergeant who assisted the RMO with the peacetime running of the sick room, and in wartime the stretcher bearer section. I cannot recall with 100% certainty, but I believe that he was a misemployed Company sergeant replaced by a Lance sergeant. He certainly existed. Edited 7 May , 2019 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scalyback Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 Thank you both. Officially one man one trade. Unofficially one man one trade and cheeky doubling up in another. Fred was RMAC make him a medical chap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 "What do you think it - eh?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 Mr and Mrs Bridgeman(?) Any ideas on the medal ribbons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jools mckenna said: "What do you think it - eh?" Superb group photo of Army Ordnance Corps NCOs from the late 1890s. Collar badges are the AOC shield and the man seated on the ground has an AOC shoulder title in woven script. The SNCO seated 2nd from right as we look is an Armourer Staff Sergeant and the highest paid man of the group. Edited 7 May , 2019 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 1 hour ago, Scalyback said: Thank you both. Officially one man one trade. Unofficially one man one trade and cheeky doubling up in another. Fred was RMAC make him a medical chap. I have a source that I can track down if needs be: a cavalryman badged with spur and farriers badge. "I shoes 'orses at the gallop!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Brayley Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 2 hours ago, Jools mckenna said: "What do you think it - eh?" Very nice, a couple of the AOC pocketed serge frocks in wear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 (edited) 19 hours ago, Toby Brayley said: Very nice, a couple of the AOC pocketed serge frocks in wear. Yes, and the SNCO Armourer is wearing the SSgt and WO version, with its 7-buttons and gold braid at base of collar, etc. Edited 8 May , 2019 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragoon Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 3 hours ago, Jools mckenna said: Mr and Mrs Bridgeman(?) Any ideas on the medal ribbons? Queens and Kings South Africa ( Boer War) I'd say Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorporalPunishment Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 24 minutes ago, Dragoon said: Queens and Kings South Africa ( Boer War) I'd say Chris Me too. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorporalPunishment Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 4 hours ago, Jools mckenna said: "What do you think it - eh?" A couple of them look to be wearing the QSAM. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 7 May , 2019 Share Posted 7 May , 2019 T - A.S.C. Imperial Service badges on show, lanyards of mixed styles and shoulders of wear; R,L,L,R! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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