brassards, armlets, armbands

[rugbyremembers]

Many thanks. Seems inconceivable that someone would not have realised that law of unintended consequences would apply here!

[green_acorn]

I have a problem with W = wire anything.

1. 'wires' were called 'lines'.

2. Anybody operating Wire less would be in a bunker, and not needing a brassard as ID.

Are we being too presumptive dismssing "Wireless"? It was the period term for a radiotelegraphy and the "Signallers" did have a love for their armbands in all forms. I seem to recall seeing a photo here on the GWF of a large room full of "switch b####'s", sorry switchboard operators all wearing their sigs armbands. I would think that Wireless Operators, just like Signal Delivery Service Riders, would have more need for the identification than the switch ops at Army and GHQ, particularly dring the 100 Days of 1918 when they were more often moving forward, setting up their long wire antenna's etcetra.

Cheers,

Hendo

[wainfleet]

Are we being too presumptive dismssing "Wireless"? It was the period term for a radiotelegraphy and the "Signallers" did have a love for their armbands in all forms. I seem to recall seeing a photo here on the GWF of a large room full of "switch b####'s", sorry switchboard operators all wearing their sigs armbands. I would think that Wireless Operators, just like Signal Delivery Service Riders, would have more need for the identification than the switch ops at Army and GHQ, particularly dring the 100 Days of 1918 when they were more often moving forward, setting up their long wire antenna's etcetra.

Cheers,

Hendo

Hendo

Wire layer was dismissed, but Wireless is still the best candidate. I've been in touch with the Royal Signals Museum and they don't know it, so still none the wiser!

W.

[Great War Truck]

I have just the one brassard, but i am very fond of it for obvious reasons.

Any thoughts or comments greatfully received.

[Muerrisch]

other than WOW!

what is the plate made of, please?

[Great War Truck]

It appears to be aluminium (or Aloominum as my wife would say). There are cotton tabs on the back with buttons to secure it.

Your comment indicates that it is quite unusual. I have never seen another like it although i have been searching for years. I have also been looking for photos of them in service and have not come across any of those either.

[servicepub]

I am coming to this thread very late having only just been referred to it. Although I have no actual examples to post I have been compiling WWI armband data from a number of Canadian official sources. This is the list to date (abbreviations are shown in lower case but are actullay upper case in use);

Staff officers at General Headquarters: red over blue

Staff officers at Army Headquarters: red over black over red

Staff officers at Army Corps Headquarters: red over white over red

Staff officers at Royal Flying Corps Headquarters: light blue with red stripe lengthwise across centre, dark blue edging and black lettering ‘r.f.c.’

Staff officers at cavalry division headquarters: ‘c.d.’ in black letters on a red background

Staff officers at divisional headquarters: red

Staff officers at cavalry brigade headquarters: ‘c.b.’ in black letters on a blue background

Staff officers at infantry brigade headquarters: blue

Staff officers at cavalry divisional artillery headquarters: embroidered gun and ‘c.d.’ in black letters on a red background

Staff officers at divisional artillery headquarters: embroidered gun in black on a red background

Staff officers at general headquarters troops headquarters: ‘g.h.q. trps’ in red letters on a dark blue background

Staff officers on lines of communication: ‘l of c’ in black letters on a red background; worn on right arm only

Provost Marshal: ‘p.m.’ in red letters on a black background

Assistant Provost Marshal: ‘a.p.m.’ in red letters on a black background

Signals Service: white over blue; worn on both arms

Military Police (mounted and dismounted): ‘m.p.’ in red letters on a black background; worn on the right arm only

Railway transport officers: ‘r.t.o.’ in black letters on a white background

Embarkation Staff: ‘embark’ in black letters on a white background

Inland Water Transport: blue anchor on a white background

Servants to military attaches: yellow

Stretcher Bearers: ‘s.b.’ in red letters on white background

All medical personnel: red cross on a white background

Press correspondents and servants (other than otherwise mentioned): green

Train Conducting Officers: either ‘t.c.o.’ in black letters on a red background or ‘train conductor’ in black letters on a brown canvas background

Further to the above, the following armbands were authorized by war-time Army, Corps and Divisional Orders.

For wear by enlisted personnel

Regimental Police - 'rp' in red letters on a black armband, worn on the right cuff.

Hospital patients – blue – these replaced the blue hospital suit worn by patients on day leave; worn on both sleeves.

Salvage companies - ‘salvage’ in red letters on a khaki background

Traffic control - ‘traffic’ in red letters on a black background - worn by other ranks employed under the provost marshal on traffic control posts; worn on the right arm only.

Intelligence corps – ‘i.c.’ in green letters on a blue background – worn by other ranks of the intelligence corps to assist them in their dealings with the civilian population; worn on the right arm only.

YMCA guides - no details other than an armband marked ‘y.m.c.a. guides’ was authorized.

Docks directorate – ‘d’ in black letters on a white background - worn by other ranks of the docks directorate whose duty it was to supervise work at the docks; worn on the right arm only. This was later changed to a ‘d’ in green letters with a dark brown background.

GHQ school instructors – square patch in black on a blue background; worn on right arm only.

Checkers – ‘checker’ in black letters on a white background

Special Constables recruited from re-occupied territories – ‘aps’ in black letters on a lilac background

Base Camp Instructors – yellow, with or without crossed machine-guns

‘special’ brigade (engineering gas troops) – red, white and green vertical stripes

Cadets in school – ‘cadet school’ in silver letters on a green background

For wear by officers

Staff officers at Corps Heavy Artillery Headquarters – embroidered gun on a blue background

Camouflage officers – green over yellow over brown; worn on the right arm only

Divisional Gas Officers – green over black

Town Majors – ‘town major’ in red letters on a black background

Area commandants - ‘area commandant’ in red letters on a blue background

Billet and camp warden - ‘warden’ in Black letters on a yellow background

War trophies - ‘war trophies’ in red letters on a khaki background; worn on the right arm only.

Officer patients – blue - when proceeding with permission outside the hospital; worn on the left arm only.

Signal service – the normal blue and white pattern, but late in the war approval was given for officers to add a maple leaf.

Within the 1st Canadian Division, a number of coloured ‘distinguishing bands’ were also authorized to identify a soldier’s role. It is unknown if the other Canadian divisions followed this lead. These included:

Scouts - green

Runners - red

Regimental and Company signalers - blue

Carrying parties - yellow

Mopping up parties – white

A series of armbands were also authorized for officers belonging to the staff of the various directorates of transportation service. These armbands all had red lettering with blue backgrounds:

Light railways – ‘l.r.’

Roads – ‘r.’

Docks – ‘d.’

Transportation – ‘t.n.’

Inland Water Transport –‘ i.w.t.’

Broad gauge railways –‘ r.c.’

[servicepub]

Further to my previous post (above) I am considering publishing a small booklet on (primarily Canadian) armbands as used throughout WWI and WWII. If anyone would like to share their knowledge or photos please let me know.

Clive

Clive M. Law - Service Publications (www.servicepub.com)

[Muerrisch]

Further to my previous post (above) I am considering publishing a small booklet on (primarily Canadian) armbands as used throughout WWI and WWII. If anyone would like to share their knowledge or photos please let me know.

Clive

Clive M. Law - Service Publications (www.servicepub.com)

You need to involve Joe Sweeney if possible, and thank you for your contribution above.

[Grovetown]

Not one you see everyday....

Cheers,

GT.

[Ruth Ward]

Hello

Can anyone shed any light on why & when the armband given to Derbyites to wear to show they'd volunteered changed from grey with a red crown to khaki with a red crown?

This is the grey one http://www.1914-1918.net/derbyscheme.html and the khaki one is shown in post #18 of this thread & identified in post #25.

Many thanks.

Ruth

[Grovetown]

Infantry Brigade - Brigade Major.

Infantry Brigade - Staff Captain.

Assistant Provost Marshal.

[Grovetown]

RE Signal Service - cut down, probably, so as to be worn as a sleeve patch rather than a brassard itself. For my part, I would associate this type of insignia with Despatch Riders.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

As one Aussie in the Lone Pine attack later wrote "We were issued with a white strip of calico to sew on to each arm and a big patch for the back, this was for the artillery to show where our men were, and also made a good mark for Johnie as we soon found to our cost".

regards, Krithia

Krithia,

Here is a photograph showing Australian troops on Gallipoli using a Beech Periscope Rifle at Quinn’s Post. It is possible that this photograph was taken around August of 1915, owing to the white armband which can be seen on the left arm of the subject in the foreground. These armbands were worn on the sleeve; and white patches of material sewn onto the backs of the Australian uniforms, for identification purposes during the August offensive.

LF

[Grovetown]

Regimental Police.

[Muerrisch]

Good additions, I particularly like the Staff Captain.

Thanks indeed.

[Wexflyer]

Could someone hazard an identification of the armlet worn on the right arm by the mounted officer in the photograph referenced in the first post of the following thread:

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=185294&hl=

Thanks!

[green_acorn]

We often see discussion about the Derby scheme vlounteer brassards, but I had not known of a similar Royal Navy scheme until I was wandering though ebay today. A plain blue armlet worn and issued under the general rules as the Derby scheme brassard.

Now how do I upload an image from my HD to the forum these days?

Cheers,

Hendo

[Muerrisch]

Here's one new to me, in the Holley/Cornelius Collection at Bletchley Park, very much in the style of Military Police.

Any ideas please?

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Here's one new to me, in the Holley/Cornelius Collection at Bletchley Park, very much in the style of Military Police.

Any ideas please?

Grumpy,

I have seen a reference to a armband with ' SFP ' lettering on it, this being for ' Supplementary Firing Party ' used in connection with the ARP service.

Another reference to ' SFP ' again relating to the ARP service, was Supplementary Fire Patrol.

Regards,

LF

[Muerrisch]

Thank you: as the bulk of the collection is WW II, that seems sensible, but the style is very reminiscent of Great War, is it not?

The following does not sort the matter!

http://m.iwm.org.uk/...object/30076530

this Google comes nearer to floating my boat:

Jane joined the A.R.P. street fire patrol, and was issued with an armband and a steel helmet. “When the siren sounded I put my children into the shelter, and then went out during the air raid to my post to watch for incendiary bombs.”

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Thank you: as the bulk of the collection is WW II, that seems sensible, but the style is very reminiscent of Great War, is it not?

The following does not sort the matter!

http://m.iwm.org.uk/...object/30076530

this Google comes nearer to floating my boat:

Jane joined the A.R.P. street fire patrol, and was issued with an armband and a steel helmet. “When the siren sounded I put my children into the shelter, and then went out during the air raid to my post to watch for incendiary bombs.”

Sounds to be WW2, ARP and one or all of, Street Fire Patrol, Supplementary Firing Party or Supplementary Fire Patrol, perhaps they are all versions of the same ' SFP ' activity within the ARP.

Regards,

LF

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Thank you: as the bulk of the collection is WW II, that seems sensible, but the style is very reminiscent of Great War, is it not?

Jane joined the A.R.P. street fire patrol, and was issued with an armband and a steel helmet. “When the siren sounded I put my children into the shelter, and then went out during the air raid to my post to watch for incendiary bombs.”

Grumpy,

Here are 2 more references to the ' SFP ' armband being used, another photograph, and 2 photos of the SFP helmet referred to.

" Lots of people had other duties during the war, like Air Raid Wardens, SFP (Special Fire Parties) outside when there was an air raid, with a steel helmet, an SFP arm band and a stirrup pump (I was one!). People did Fire Watching in factories overnight to be ready to fight incendiary bombs and we were paid 3 shillings per night (that is 15p). "

" In September 1940, a Fire Watchers Order was issued. Men could now be compelled to fire watch for a maximum of forty-eight hours per month. Local fireman also trained new Supplementary Fire Parties (SFP). In some cases local authorities provided the men with steel helmets and armbands marked SFP. "

Regards,

LF

[Muerrisch]

Thank you: looks like SFP was "one size fits all"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Thank you: looks like SFP was "one size fits all"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You are correct, and I am sure that those stuck fire watching on a factory roof, overnight in the dead of winter with snow and sub-zero temps, may well have had their own meaning for S...F....P!

Regards,

LF