Andrew P Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 I agree with you Michael, but I have found it sad that some members of this forum have accused those that care for the future of the Gallipoli battlefields as among other things, being precious, lacking humility, proportion and balance. It will be a very sad day if in the future we just buried our heads in the sand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CGI Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 In 1989, Phil Taylor and Pam Cupper published their 'Gallipoli Battlefield Guide', still much better than any other guide that has been thrown onto the market since. In a newspaper article, they have now expressed their feelings about what is going on in the Peninsula : http://wimmera.yourguide.com.au/display.asp?class=news and then choose the article "Gallipoli work appals" of 22/03/2005. Interesting reading. CGI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 "Just what is it about Gallipoli that continues to defy logic?" Some interesting observations by the author of one of the best histories of the campaign. Worth a read, even though not specifically about the topic. http://www.awm.gov.au/events/talks/oration2004.asp Cheers Geoff S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 Yep. Very good link. That just about sums it up for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark A Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 Geoff S- Thanks for the link, a great lecture. I'd recommend anyone with broadband to make a cup of tea, pull up a chair and listen to L A Carlyon, it's fascinating and in an even handed way, sums up what Gallipoli means to Australians. Mark PS- and then buy his excellent book! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 Thanks Mark. FYI- Access via broadband is not required to listen to this lecture. (Dial-up will suffice) I would encourage anyone who truly wants a greater understanding of what Gallipoli means to Australians in general to read or listen to this lecture. Carlyon makes some very astute comments.- apart from all his sniffing. Cheers Geoff S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark A Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 Yeah reckon the poor guy was suffering from a cold. There were a few coughs as well. But don't let that put you off everyone! M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 Very many thanks for that link Geoff some very astute analysis there by LC I found his talk enthralling Thanks again Michael D.R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brox Posted 31 March , 2005 Share Posted 31 March , 2005 Geoff Les says it all. Whenever some-one asks Why Gallipoli???, the best reply would be to refer to that link! Thank you. As another "Precious" Australian, I was sickened by the desecration of Anzac Cove. But there are a number of options WE can follow:- 1 Make a balanced complaint to those who's incompetence caused it 2 Take a holier than thou stance and waffle-on about point-scoring or some other triviality 3 Do something meaningful OURSELVES. Many of us have shot off the e-mails to the pollies etc, and will be indignant when they reply using the same format as they trotted out for the Villers-Brettoneux Chateau. But it does give us a warm glow inside to have done Something. Hopefully option 3 might eat away at our insides. Anzac Day is revving up early this year, maybe helped by the desecration issue, but some off-beat items are surfacing. Comment has been made about the disappearance of some of the Avenues of Honour which were such a feature of Western Victoria. In an amazing co-incidence many of these special memorials have succumbed to road-widening & alignment projects. In Footscray a "Soldiers Memorial" bought & dedicated by the returned soldiers themselves, has been hidden & the German Trophy Howitzer has disappeared without trace. The avenue trees have also gone. Now there is an opportunity for some-one with fire in their belly. But a word of caution. A peace park remembering anyone from anywhere who had a bad time during their life is a much more feasible proposition . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CGI Posted 1 April , 2005 Share Posted 1 April , 2005 For those who might not recognize it : this used to be Ari Burnu. CGI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CGI Posted 1 April , 2005 Share Posted 1 April , 2005 And this as well. CGI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CGI Posted 6 April , 2005 Share Posted 6 April , 2005 A chronological survey of everything that happened at Anzac Cove + all the pictures can now be found at : http://users.skynet.be/Gallipoli/anzacgone/anzacgone.htm CGI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auimfo Posted 6 April , 2005 Share Posted 6 April , 2005 CGI, Thanks for the link to the updated info..... words fail me. Tim L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryn Posted 7 April , 2005 Share Posted 7 April , 2005 The kid who accidentally started the fire at Gallipoli in 1995 got hard jail time. What's going to happen to the politicians who've allowed this to happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6th Hauraki KIA KAHA Posted 7 April , 2005 Share Posted 7 April , 2005 Take back all I said cant bare reading it anymore so I have deleted it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryn Posted 8 April , 2005 Share Posted 8 April , 2005 6th Hauraki KIA KAHA, The fact that this board, 'Battlefields in danger', exists, implies that a lot of people do care and can see what all the fuss is about. Four officers and a lot of men from the Haurakis died on 25th April 1915 at Anzac, and a great number more throughout the campaign. Most of their bodies were never recovered, and it's possible that roads and carparks are being built on them, as well as on all the others who have no known graves. It'll be a sad day when the number killed is the only criteria for deciding that a battlefield is worth preserving. Hmm, let's see - only 160,000 died at Gallipoli. Well, sorry, that's officially not enough to care about. Whaka tangata kia kaha (Canoe men be brave), because your resting place is standing in the way of 'progress' and a lot of people can't see what the fuss is about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6th Hauraki KIA KAHA Posted 8 April , 2005 Share Posted 8 April , 2005 Ok maybe I should have said that another way. The roads are being built for the propose for people to gain access so we can remember the fallen they are not building a supermarket or theme park it is just for access. My great grand father was a company Sergeant Major of Australian Signals at Gallipoli and my other great grandfather was a Corporal in 6th Hauraki There was no disrespect for the fallen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted 8 April , 2005 Share Posted 8 April , 2005 I believe the feeling of "pilgrimage" when visiting Anzac Cove is more akin to restricting the access of vehicles to the site. And I would have thought that the roads/parking lots could have been situated in more appropriate places, or more work could have done to restrict the damage which it appears to have been done to the site. I think respect or remembrance for the site where the men fought & died of equal importance. Otherwise,, we only be left with books, images & artifacts. Cheers Geoff S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest angryhamster Posted 8 April , 2005 Share Posted 8 April , 2005 Here is a view of a Turk if you will! I have lived seeing history slip from our hands either for the sake of dams, housing or hotels. The history I am talking is ancient in most cases. Now the same attitude has got to recent history, that of the Gallipoli Campaign, for the sake of visitors’ comfort and convenience. Well, that is why we should all speak since we are this time cited as the reason for these works. Please do NOT do this on my behalf. Why? I do not think that either those who fell in the campaign nor those who fought had much comfort then. When we visit the site do we want to see what they went through, what a hell warfare can be like? I want to. I think preserving this site, which was unspoiled yet accessible (do not worry visitors) is the only way of comprehending it. Especially as we Turks have not done our homework, do not have many books or written accounts and are desperately in need of preserving the battlefields if we want to learn about the campaign. Well, in my view, when it comes to history, it is not only in Turkey’s hands and from experience let it not please be so since history is for all of us and all people. This history, and these battlefields, do not just belong to us, we owe it to future generations to pass this legacy on. Serpil Karacan Sellars Eceabat Turkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eceabat Posted 10 April , 2005 Share Posted 10 April , 2005 For the information of forum members The latest update on the situation around ANZAC Cove. All vehicle access to the coastal region has been banned by Turkish authorities as of Sunday to allow contractors to lay the asphalt for the new seven to eight metre wide road above the Cove. It is expected that the road work, or at least most of it, will be completed in time for Australian Prime Minister John Howard’s visit on 25 April. A few others, hopefully who have a greater interest in history than asphalt, will also be in attendance. Grading and excavations for the road widening has extended to Embarkation Pier Cemetery to the north and to near the CWGC zone boundary marker to the south. The car parks at Ariburnu and at the mouth of Shrapnel Gully have been completed and look a treat, that is if you like cobble stones and concrete in place of history. For those who like a touch of humour with their desecration, the life expectance of the new road, based on recent experience, is three weeks. New road works at Kilia Liman, on the Dardanelles side of the Peninsula, completed in time for Turkish Prime Minister Recep Erdogan’s visit on 18 March, have started to break up and pot hole and are being repaired by maintenance crews. The ANZAC Cove road should last until John Howard flies out. I hope to walk in to the Cove area in the next few days and will hopefully post photos of the beautification project. Bill Sellars Eceabat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie Posted 11 April , 2005 Share Posted 11 April , 2005 Anzac Cove actually made the news here in Oz last night. It is a travesty what has been done. The Government should be ashamed of themselves and apologise for instigating this. If you want to have a say in this country go to this site. http://seven.com.au/sunrise/form_thanks/5375 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eceabat Posted 11 April , 2005 Share Posted 11 April , 2005 Thanks for the link Ozzie. I saw the renewed media coverage of what is happening on the Gallipoli battlefields and also the news about the skull of what is believed to be an Australian soldier on display in a museum in Papua New Guinea. Is it just me or is it interesting that while the Australian Minister of Veterans’ Affairs was too busy to comment on the devastation at ANZAC Cove she was able to come out with a statement on the PNG issue. Of course, the government managed to come up with a favourable result on that one. I wonder if she could find time to comment on the human remains on display in the Gabatepe Museum just to the south of the Ariburnu battlefields, some of which are of Allied soldiers (not many Ottoman soldiers died in the waters of ANZAC Cove and had their bones washed up years later encrusted with sea crustaceans). Mind you, I find the showcasing of human remains of any side distasteful. Bill Eceabat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie Posted 11 April , 2005 Share Posted 11 April , 2005 After what has happened I'd be happy for the government to be dropped in Antartica to have a serious think about what they have done! Not being allowed to use force, that, I think, is about as good a punishment that I can think of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eceabat Posted 11 April , 2005 Share Posted 11 April , 2005 Sorry, can’t agree with you Ozzie. What, drop Howard and his merry crew in Antarctica and risk having them ruin an entire continent? Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie Posted 11 April , 2005 Share Posted 11 April , 2005 We could always give them the the Yanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now