museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 (edited) Good man Craig!! That is so tempting, if we could only find something with attrib or caused by we would well on the way. I sent the card and asked did he died while serving, so fingers crossed. Kind regards. Tom. Edited 2 May , 2020 by museumtom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 3 minutes ago, museumtom said: Good man Craig!! That is so tempting, if we could only find something with attrib or caused by we would well on the way. I sent the card and asked did he died while serving, so fingers crossed. Kind regards. Tom. Looking again at the SWB he was discharged in 1918 so the reference to the 'W/S' seems to be for the TB (although it is meant to be in reference to whether serving at the time of death or not). Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Another mysterious set of initials explained. Thanks Craig George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Terry says- It should do but often doesn’t. We have found it both referring to ‘died in service’ and ‘contracted in service’ – referring to when the fatal illness was contracted. You cannot rely on it as meaning that the man was still in service at death. The pension clerks obviously were not sure which it meant. You need other evidence for each case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 7 minutes ago, museumtom said: Terry says- It should do but often doesn’t. We have found it both referring to ‘died in service’ and ‘contracted in service’ – referring to when the fatal illness was contracted. You cannot rely on it as meaning that the man was still in service at death. The pension clerks obviously were not sure which it meant. You need other evidence for each case. That's the same as I added (which crossed with Terry) in #1342, the clerks confuse the section regularly, it would appear. What does his death record say he died of ? If he died of TB then I think we have him as the box, if not referring to having died in service must refer to him having contracted the TB whilst in service. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Terry says. Good example He could not have a SWB if he was still in service! So he was discharged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 6 minutes ago, museumtom said: Terry says. Good example He could not have a SWB if he was still in service! So he was discharged. In which case we know he died of TB and we know he had TB whilst serving so, short of a miracle of an entire recovery and then catching it again the link has to be there. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Ah I see, Craig, very good logic. If we don't have attrib or caused by, we are screwed. Still he will be remembered with the Irishmen that don't qualify anyway. Thank you again for the help, very much appreciated. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 An interesting dichotomy here - the pension card shows att for both rather than one att & one agg but anyway post March 1916 it made no difference for pension purposes. https://www.fold3.com/image/645032713?terms=griffin,1019,5008 Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Well done Craig. In your search criteria is 1019 shorthand for October 1919? George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 4 minutes ago, George Rayner said: Well done Craig. In your search criteria is 1019 shorthand for October 1919? George I don't know - it's not part of the criteria I entered. It's system generated and shows on links for other men (I suspect it's to do with some sort of filtering or display issues). Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Did you just enter griffin,5008? George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 I should add that I noticed a peculiarity in that the full stop after the service number had been indexed as part of the number. This means that the number didn't show on Ancestry but a name search does. (It shows OK on fold3, which has a better search engine). I had to search on Ancestry by name - I tend to use Ancestry first to see if date of death brings up any records (as Fold3 doesn't sort search well by date of death). Of course, with the service number the search straight on Fold3 should work but habits... Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Hm. I just get the dependants pension on Ancestry. Moving on!! George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 1 minute ago, George Rayner said: Hm. I just get the dependants pension on Ancestry. Moving on!! George That is one of the flaws of going via Ancestry - it lets you search by date of death but only takes you to one card/ledger so a further search of Fold3 might then be needed once you've confirmed the details - probably works best when you don't have the service number in advance. Do the DoD search on Ancestry, find the record to get the service number then search using the service number. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Brilliant stuff lads, just what was needed. I sent him off to Terry straight away. Fantastic work. Thanks again lads, I'll let you know as soon as there is word. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Griffin has been accepted just now. Well done to all! Thanks again for the leads. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Could be https://www.fold3.com/image/645011034 Discharged 24/9/1919. TB attributable. 14452 MGC Address on card 4 Lowerver Gardener St Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 It does not get any better than that does it? Thanks Mark, that brilliant. Is there any FMP link i could use please? Or NOK? Kind regards. Tom. There is nothing on FMP not even a MIC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Number according to MIC is 144452. FMP appears only to have an MIC record Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Thank you Mark, with that number I accessed the MIC. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Is there any NOK please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 2 May , 2020 Share Posted 2 May , 2020 https://www.fold3.com/image/645809047?xid=1022 This card shows Pension claim by aunt, Mrs Julia May. Her address is the one on the Death Certificate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Thank you mark, I appreciate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 2 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 2 May , 2020 Nope its not a goer. 'No. No evidence of service related' So I says that Folder3 says TB attrib and await the reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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