Postcards

[aodhdubh]

2 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

I think it’s a dock somewhere.  If you look at the rope at bottom right it’s fixed through a huge steel securing ring on a pivot.

Yes...a dock had been my first guess, but a curious one. I expect a drydock is a likely explanation. I'll have to peruse the war diaries more closely to hopefully surmise where it might have been.

[6RRF]

The absence of weed certainly suggests a drydock

[FROGSMILE]

7 minutes ago, 6RRF said:

The absence of weed certainly suggests a drydock

Yes it’s not tidal is it.  I don’t know much about the docks that allow water in and out so that ships can be launched, or worked upon depending on water in, or water out.  You raise a good point that even without weed would there be any kind of visible watermark?

Edited 31 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[gunnerwalker]

Men of 'D' Company, 8th (Reserve) Battalion, Wiltshire Regiment. The battalion did not go overseas and remained a training battalion throughout the war.

[Pat Atkins]

Some very expressive faces, nice photo. Quite a range of apparent ages there; I wonder how the older men felt about younger NCOs? I seem to recall the old sweat Pte Edward Roe being fairly critical of "19-year-old lance jacks" in his memoirs (might have slightly misquoted him, but the sentiment was clear).

[gunnerwalker]

17 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said:

Some very expressive faces, nice photo. Quite a range of apparent ages there; I wonder how the older men felt about younger NCOs? I seem to recall the old sweat Pte Edward Roe being fairly critical of "19-year-old lance jacks" in his memoirs (might have slightly misquoted him, but the sentiment was clear).

Can't have imagined many would be too thrilled. The two at either end of the front row are probably old enough to be father and son.

[gunnerwalker]

6th Battalion Territorials, Essex Regiment.

 

Divisional Ammunition Column (Small Arms Ammunition Section) football team, 61st (2nd South Midland) Division. The Royal Field Artillery supplied the men for the DAC.

Edited 31 October , 2023 by gunnerwalker

[6RRF]

6 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

Yes it’s not tidal is it.  I don’t know much about the docks that allow water in and out so that ships can be launched, or worked upon depending on water in, or water out.  You raise a good point that even without weed would there be any kind of visible watermark?

In a properly managed dock - and especially in one so deep as this -  dock walls should be scrubbed clean for the safety of those working inside, who would otherwise be slipping and sliding on the weed

[FROGSMILE]

33 minutes ago, 6RRF said:

In a properly managed dock - and especially in one so deep as this -  dock walls should be scrubbed clean for the safety of those working inside, who would otherwise be slipping and sliding on the weed

Thank you, now that you explain that I have had a ‘duh’ moment, and realise that that should have been self evident to me. 

Edited 31 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[Bob Davies]

31 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said:

Thank you, now that you explain that I have had a ‘duh’ moment, and realise that that should have been self evident to me. 

If I may add my two pence worth, I would say it is a dry dock. They are massive, to contain and float warships in. Over time I have seen a few styles as it were. The attached picture is courtesy of the IWM.

Entitled; HMS Vampire in a dry dock in Rosyth Dockyard Not the same place but it gives us an idea. The OP could be anywhere in the UK of France? ..link here; https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205318643

[FROGSMILE]

22 minutes ago, Bob Davies said:

If I may add my two pence worth, I would say it is a dry dock. They are massive, to contain and float warships in. Over time I have seen a few styles as it were. The attached picture is courtesy of the IWM.

Entitled; HMS Vampire in a dry dock in Rosyth Dockyard Not the same place but it gives us an idea. The OP could be anywhere in the UK of France? ..link here; https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205318643

Thank you Bob, I feel better seeing that I got it right at first look.  That’s a particularly good photograph as it also shows the adjustable gate at the end that lets the water and the ship in and out as and when needed. 

Edited 31 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[Bob Davies]

On 30/10/2023 at 20:38, aodhdubh said:

Another photograph of Bermudian soldiers...a bit more often reproduced. I have pondered if this is a dockface, but it seems a mite too high, and there's no obvious reason for it to be stepped. Members of the Bermuda Contingent of the Royal Garrison Artillery and other personnel.

Just reposting the OP here. The steps in the dry docks as seen here are usually at the inland end and curve round to match the shape of the ship as it were. I have a feeling there is a slight curve on the steps in this picture. 

Most pictures of dry docks have been taken from this end facing the gates that face the sea or river, so on most pics it is not clear how the steps have been made, as you cant see them. So it is difficult to pin a location down. The attached screen shot hopefully sows a bit of what I am on about. @FROGSMILE  

[aodhdubh]

6 hours ago, Bob Davies said:

If I may add my two pence worth, I would say it is a dry dock. They are massive, to contain and float warships in. Over time I have seen a few styles as it were. The attached picture is courtesy of the IWM.

Entitled; HMS Vampire in a dry dock in Rosyth Dockyard Not the same place but it gives us an idea. The OP could be anywhere in the UK of France? ..link here; https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205318643

Thanks all. War Diaries show the Bermuda Contingent RGA from 01/01/1917 to 03/04/1917 at Bassin de Radoub (French for "dry dock", evidently), Marseilles, "employed at No. 6 Base Supply Depot, and on discharging cargo, care and ? of boatswain's stores under R.N., some artificers, plumbers, painters etc employed permanently by R.E." That would seem likely to be the place and occasion of the photograph. A dock was my first thought. I should have realised a drydock immediately after. Bermuda's coat of arms was briefly one depicting a conventional drydock, which had to be a reference to the North America and West Indies Station's Royal Naval Dockyard there...though that is an oddity...as mentioned above, Bermuda's porous limestone, riddled with caves, prevented construction of a conventional "hole in the ground" drydock and it had been equipped since 1869 with a floating drydock (from the Second World War, two). The stamp on this 1907 dated card (on the reverse of a photograph of the troopship "Soudan"...a hospital ship during the First World War) shows that coat of arms. HMD Bermuda's 1869 "Floating Dock Bermuda" was replaced about 1903 with "Admiralty Floating Dock No. 1", which is shown on the second card from 1914.

Edited 1 November , 2023 by aodhdubh

[FROGSMILE]

4 hours ago, aodhdubh said:

Thanks all. War Diaries show the Bermuda Contingent RGA from 01/01/1917 to 03/04/1917 at Bassin de Radoub (French for "dry dock", evidently), Marseilles, "employed at No. 6 Base Supply Depot, and on discharging cargo, care and ? of boatswain's stores under R.N., some artificers, plumbers, painters etc employed permanently by R.E." That would seem likely to be the place and occasion of the photograph. A dock was my first thought. I should have realised a drydock immediately after. Bermuda's coat of arms was briefly one depicting a conventional drydock, which had to be a reference to the North America and West Indies Station's Royal Naval Dockyard there...though that is an oddity...as mentioned above, Bermuda's porous limestone, riddled with caves, prevented construction of a conventional "hole in the ground" drydock and it had been equipped since 1869 with a floating drydock (from the Second World War, two). The stamp on this 1907 dated card (on the reverse of a photograph of the troopship "Soudan"...a hospital ship during the First World War) shows that coat of arms. HMD Bermuda's 1869 "Floating Dock Bermuda" was replaced about 1903 with "Admiralty Floating Dock No. 1", which is shown on the second card from 1914.

Fascinating and good to have the answer of location confirmed.  You really must write that book!

[aodhdubh]

On 01/11/2023 at 05:55, FROGSMILE said:

Fascinating and good to have the answer of location confirmed.  You really must write that book!

Thanks. Half-way written, but won't be finished soon.

[aodhdubh]

On 30/10/2023 at 20:08, FROGSMILE said:

The more traditional purpose of the service record was to count attributable service that reckoned towards things like promotion and beneficial terms including a military pension.  Cadets and other youth service did not count towards these and so were not accounted for.

Going back to John Trimingham Trimingham. I've looked a bit deeper into his service history. Picking out the key dates: He was a (cadet) Sergeant in the Saltus Grammar School Cadet Corps (which would expand to other schools to become the Bermuda Cadet Corps) on 20th July, 1901. He appears to have finished school in 1902 with a Cambridge Certificate and entered the civil service as a clerk in the Colonial Secretary's office.

Extracts from General Orders, Headquarters, Prospect, 1 June, 1904: It is notified for information that Mr J. T. Trimingham has been appointed to a Second Lieutenancy in the Bermuda Militia Artillery Authority W. O. Letter, dated 4th May, 1904, No. 064/873 A. M. S. (A).

28th June, 1906 2 Lieut. J. T. Trimingham resigned his commission. Authority W.O. Letter No. 069/944 M. S. (Art.) d/ 30-5-'06

6 July, 1917 - SUPPLEMENT TO THE LONDON GAZETTE, 9 JULY, 1917. 6849
R.G.A.—
The undermentioned to be temp. 2nd. Lts.: — 2nd Lt. John Trimingham Trimingham, Bermuda Mila. Art. 6th May 1917

9 April, 1920 - SUPPLEMENT TO THE LONDON GAZETTE, 12 APRIL, 1920. 4333
REGULAR FORCES.
ROYAL REGIMENT OF ARTILLERY.
R.G.A.
Temp. Lt. J. T. Trimingham (2nd Lt., Bermuda Mila.) relinquishes his temp. commn. on ceasing to be empld. 18th July 1919.

Edited 3 November , 2023 by aodhdubh

[GWF1967]

Gnr. A/Sgt. Frederick Charles Hyden. 23545.  15th Divisional Heavy Battery, Royal Garrison Artillery.   1915.     Re-Enlisted - Artificer S/Sgt. 1402632.    Died Egypt.  19/11927.

 

Gnr. S.Harrison.  R.G.A.  1915.     Both photographs were taken at the same studio.

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, GWF1967 said:

Gnr. A/Sgt. Frederick Charles Hyden. 23545.  15th Divisional Heavy Battery, Royal Garrison Artillery.   1915.     Re-Enlisted - Artificer S/Sgt. 1402632.    Died Egypt.  19/11927.

 

Gnr. S.Harrison.  R.G.A.  1915.     Both photographs were taken at the same studio.

Gunner Hayden was doubly qualified as both a Rangetaker and Artificer (metal worker of some kind, there were several trades that wore the same hammer and pincers badge).  I wonder what caused his subsequent death as an SNCO artificer. 

 

Edited 5 November , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[Alan24]

This postcard was taken by a Tenby photographer in around 1906, 7 or 1908. 

It's of the Pembroke Imperial Yeomanry.

To me this has a 'Boer War' look about it but it is definitely in Wales. It's the headdress that I find strange having not seen anything like this before.  

[FROGSMILE]

11 hours ago, Alan24 said:

This postcard was taken by a Tenby photographer in around 1906, 7 or 1908. 

It's of the Pembroke Imperial Yeomanry.

To me this has a 'Boer War' look about it but it is definitely in Wales. It's the headdress that I find strange having not seen anything like this before.  

It’s a slouch hat Alan and the field headdress that made its debut during the 2nd Anglo/Boer War.  After the war it was decided that the Yeomanry en masse should be converted into a form of mounted infantry that was felt to be a tactical lesson learned from the war and something that gave the auxiliary cavalry a specific role different to that of their regular counterparts.

As such it was to be given the title “Imperial Yeomanry” to mark its conversion.  As a further change it was to move away from the old fashioned brightly coloured uniforms it had still been wearing before the war.  It was felt too much though to go to the drab uniforms, completely devoid of colour, worn during the war, and a compromise was chosen with drab coloured jackets and breeches with coloured facings and matching piping down the outer welt of the breeches.  This was still felt important for attracting the recruitment of young civilians and so the new uniforms were to be purchased gradually by the county associations.

However, in 1908 a further transformation took place, when the auxiliary Territorial Force (TF) was formed and the Yeomanry obliged to join it as the cavalry arm.  As part of this change the Imperial Yeomanry distinction was abandoned, along with the new uniforms, and instead the entire TF gradually adopted the drab khaki service dress uniform already worn since 1902 by their regular army counterparts.

Edited 7 November , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[Alan24]

Thank you Frogsmile. 

I have a few postcards of Hampshire Carabiniers Imperial Yeomanry at 1907 summer camp, Winchester, wearing a more standard khaki dress. One of the cards dated May 1907, the sender writes on the back "being issued the new peak cap". The headdress being exchanged is more like a broderick style cap but it's not a broderick as previously advised by Toby on this forum.

[FROGSMILE]

45 minutes ago, Alan24 said:

Thank you Frogsmile. 

I have a few postcards of Hampshire Carabiniers Imperial Yeomanry at 1907 summer camp, Winchester, wearing a more standard khaki dress. One of the cards dated May 1907, the sender writes on the back "being issued the new peak cap". The headdress being exchanged is more like a broderick style cap but it's not a broderick as previously advised by Toby on this forum.

Each of the Yeomanry regiments received their new uniforms at slightly different times because unlike the regulars they relied upon the funding from the individual county associations.  The interim uniform that I described often has a peaked cap introduced towards the end of the Imperial Yeomanry’s existence (1906-07) and some of the units had a more drab style of uniform than others with just a few elements of colour.  It was the widespread issued of 02 universal service dress that gradually saw an end to the regimental patterns, although some units were still wearing them for walking-out-dress at annual camps in 1914.  If the headdress being exchanged for the peaked forage cap wasn’t a Brodrick then for Yeomanry cavalry it was most likely a pillbox cap.

Edited 7 November , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[gunnerwalker]

A very nice family group photo with two soldiers of the Gloucestershire Regiment. The corporal on the left is a territorial and appears to have a medal ribbon on his uniform but I can't quite make out what it could be.

[Andrew Upton]

2 hours ago, gunnerwalker said:

...The corporal on the left is a territorial and appears to have a medal ribbon on his uniform but I can't quite make out what it could be...

It looks like the QSA ribbon as rendered by orthochromatic film, eg:

 

[gunnerwalker]

9 minutes ago, Andrew Upton said:

It looks like the QSA ribbon as rendered by orthochromatic film, eg:

 

For me it was between that and the 1895-1902 India General Service Medal - which I considered mostly because the ribbon in the photo looked to only have two colour tones. But your example with the QSA shows the red and orange as the same colour tone and it’s probably the more likely award. Many thanks Andrew.

Edited 7 November , 2023 by gunnerwalker