GreyC Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 2nd coy, 2nd Bavarian Jäger Bataillon (Ersatz-Btl) Aschaffenburg. GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 20 hours ago, The Prussian said: It's a wartime rank of higher NCOs. They are between a Feldwebel and a Leutnant to support the officers. Thank you, that’s interesting. I’ve thought for a long time how pragmatic and flexible the German Army NCO system was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 20 hours ago, AOK4 said: Hello, It was not a pure wartime rank, it was a peacetime rank for long serving NCOs of the reserve. See https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feldwebelleutnant (the info on wikipedia seems correct from what I have read elsewhere). Jan Thank you, no wonder it seemed so obscure given it’s niche usage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 (edited) Hi Frogsmile and all, I don´t know if your´re interested enough in such a peripheral topic to dig deeper into it, but if you are, you might find the following worth reading. Jan is right in so far as the rank of FELDWEBELLEUTNANT was introduced before WW1. However the topic is more complex as it may seem. You can speak (as Ledebur does in his definite tome on Die Geschichte des deutschen Unteroffiziers p427/8) of FELDWEBELLEUTNANT old style and new style. The FELDWEBELLEUTNANT old style was already in use in the early 19th century. They were meant to - and did fill - positions in the Schloßgarde-Kompanie, a unit guarding the Prussian castle. The lowest rank in it was that of Unteroffizier. FELDWEBELLEUTNANT was also a rank with the stemformation of the Kadetten-Häuser (cadett-corps) and Invalid-formation which served at garisons. In 1877 a new style of FELDWEBELLEUTNANT was devised that was introduced as a means to relieve officers from certain duties in case of a mobilisation of the troops. They were to be taken over from long-serving Unteroffiziere in the Landsturm that had declared their willingness to be reactivated in case of mobilisation. Their duty was to train the recruits at the home-depots originally. They had new signs of rank that symbolised their status between NCO and officers, best compared maybe, to the Warrent-officer in GB. See photo attached. In 1880 their number was enlarged - on paper. There were even lists of elligible names - on paper, because nobody was ACTUALLY promoted to this rank for the NEW FUNCTION as described above before WW1. Ledebur stated clearly that the FELDWEBELLEUTNANT new style was only introduced as a rank that was to be activated AFTER mobilisation. This is supported by the fact that you will find no promotion-notices in the MWBs etc. for these new style FELDWEBELLEUTNANT rank. Notwithstanding, the old rank style FELDWEBELLEUTNANT promotions for the units mentioned above can be found. Only with the mobilisation in 1914 the preparations were now put into practice and the positions for the FELDWEBELLEUTNANTe new style were paired with the personnel which were then promoted to FELDWEBELLEUTNANT at the outbreak of WW1. Here is a photo from my collection showing the rank insignia of a FELDWEBELLEUTNANT of Füsilier Regiment 73 new style, uniform of a Vizefeldwebel with officers hat and Leutnants Schulterstücke. Thank you to an English colleague for providing the relevant pages from Ledebur and his insight into these matters at large. GreyC Edited 25 June , 2021 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 Thanks for the clarification, GreyC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 Thank you GreyC, you have explained the criteria very clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 25 June , 2021 Share Posted 25 June , 2021 Thank you Jan and Frogsmile! It was a pleasure to find out more about this rank and its history. GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 26 June , 2021 Author Share Posted 26 June , 2021 This is quite a nice image - not sure what the pencil lines along the top are intended to be! And some nice detail on the reverse also: Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 6 hours ago, 4thGordons said: This is quite a nice image - not sure what the pencil lines along the top are intended to be! And some nice detail on the reverse also: Chris Peters, Rgt. 124, z. Zt. Jägersturmbataillon 3, Deutsche Feldpost 40. This man was temporarily serving inJäger-(Sturm)-Bataillon 3 for stormtroop training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 (edited) Hi, Jan transcribed correctly, but to my knowledge there was no Jäger Sturmbataillon 3. The stamp on the back signifying the unit simply says Brandenburgisches Jäger Bataillion No 3. I think the sender was part of IR 124 within which he belonged to a Sturmabt. of this Regiment and he was delegated to the Jäger Btl. to help form a similar sub-unit, or to reinforce it. The 124 th Regiment was Württembergisch, the 3rd Jäger Prussian. GreyC Here is the regimental history: https://portal.dnb.de/bookviewer/view/1032164417#page/n0/mode/1up Edited 27 June , 2021 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prussian Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Hello! The Jäger-Bataillon 3 was often used as a Sturm-unit. In order of the line-ups of regular Sturm-Bataillons in 1916 the JB3 was called Jäger-(Sturm)-Bataillon Nr.3 since July 8, 1916. Like other Sturmbataillone it offered different Sturm-courses. Mostly volunteers from other regiments joined those courses. The fieldpost-number 40 was located in Le Nouvion (35km south of Maubeuge) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 31 minutes ago, The Prussian said: Hello! The Jäger-Bataillon 3 was often used as a Sturm-unit. In order of the line-ups of regular Sturm-Bataillons in 1916 the JB3 was called Jäger-(Sturm)-Bataillon Nr.3 since July 8, 1916. Like other Sturmbataillone it offered different Sturm-courses. Mostly volunteers from other regiments joined those courses. The fieldpost-number 40 was located in Le Nouvion (35km south of Maubeuge) Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Courses of 5 days duration were held for „senior“ Officers and courses of 3 weeks duration for junior Officers and NCOs. The Regimental history of JB 3 has an interesting chapter regarding its redesignation as a Sturm - Bataillon starting on page 49 https://portal.dnb.de/bookviewer/view/1032164417#page/49/mode/1up Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 (edited) It’s an interesting photo and the aura of highly trained competence is palpable. On appearance alone I would rate them as formidable young soldiers. I assume that the cloth bags slung around their necks are the hand grenade carriers that I’ve seen before in artworks? Edited 27 June , 2021 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prussian Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Hello! unknown Sturmbataillon with grenade-launcher patch (left arm of left man): Sturmbataillon 16 "Circus Breuning" with one Telegraph-buckle. (Breuning was the Bataillon-Commander) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prussian Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Sturmkompagnie 13 with shoulder strap "MW 13", stands for Minenwerfer-Zug (Trench-Mortar-Platoon) of Sturmkompagnie 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 27 June , 2021 Author Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Thank you for all that excellent information. The lot of photos I am going through has a number of interesting groups including some with searchights, trench mortars and what appears to be communications equipment(as well as lots of standard more formal group pics). I will scan a couple more today. Thanks again- fascinating detail. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 1914. Reserve Artillerie unit Cnock Personnel first aid bunker Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Soldier with Damag trench knife and extra large magazine for rifle Cnock IR 172 at Menin Road 1915 Hair brush handgrenades Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Jäger with Ersatz Felt shakos. Cnock Reserve Jäger Bataillon 23 (Flanders) Cnock Hussars in the trenches Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Uhlans exchanged their horses for bicycles. Cnock Hussar 1915. Cnock Officers and MG 08 in lowest position Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 RIR 213 (Flanders) and older type of carriage for MG Cnock Moorslede Flanders, Reserve Jäger Bataillo 25 Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 27 June , 2021 Share Posted 27 June , 2021 Essenträger, the man who carried the proviand to the first line troops. Cnock Menen (Menin) in Flanders. RIR 215 Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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