NEW Manchester London Road Memorial

[warbuff1]

Wayne. Possibly = John Sumner 25630 21st Manchesters dow 26/0/1917 (SDGW) born 1884 age 33 (CWGC) 1911 census born 1884 a`railway porter for the L and YR lived in Liverpool . You think ? Ralph.

Not sure Liverpool far from manchester and he was a stableman at London Road so not 100% I think there

Wayne

edit: Just found that his service record survives on Ancestry lived in Salford. His trade though is a Hawker, ie street seller. Dont think this is the guy

[warbuff1]

Herbert CLARKE 19179 Kings Liverpool Regt kia 16/8/1916 born Beswick Manchester a goods guard - records survive on Ancestry. Ralph.

Blimey some info on there nice letter from LNWR too hes definately our man. Surprised at length war office went to to find next of kin

Wayne

[warbuff1]

William E Brown MAY well be William ELLIS Brown b 1900 at school in 1911 so being a junior clerk would fit (52184 kia 24/4/18)

Yea his dad was a railway inspector soo likely to get a job for his son. Fantastic work yet again Ralph .And his service record survives too

[ralphjd]

Cannot find a war dead for Walter Standford, service record for a Walter Standford pre 1910 with the South Lancs b 1890 son of Rosetta (Atkinson) and William, he was a platelayer , 1891 and 1901 as STAMFORD, not on 1911 under his name BUT under his mothers name, another cock up by Ancestry, thought he may have enlisted under Atkinson but no luck. Keep searching. Ralph.

[ralphjd]

Not sure Liverpool far from manchester and he was a stableman at London Road so not 100% I think there

Wayne

edit: Just found that his service record survives on Ancestry lived in Salford. His trade though is a Hawker, ie street seller. Dont think this is the guy

Agreed put him back on the list. Ralph.

[ralphjd]

Frank TURNER = Francis TURNER 98133 3rd Batt RWF died 5/3/1919 bronchial pneumonia he was a capstan hand. Lived Hulme M/cr. Yes/no. Please delete as required Ralph.

[warbuff1]

Frank TURNER = Francis TURNER 98133 3rd Batt RWF died 5/3/1919 bronchial pneumonia he was a capstan hand. Lived Hulme M/cr. Yes/no. Please delete as required Ralph.

Sounds very plausible. Guess he died fromSpanish flu epedemic? He was a Capstanman soo everything sounds right

Wayne

[warbuff1]

Well a very productive meeting today re the memorial. Agreed site with Network Rail, they finally seem to be behind it. Talked designs, stone, engraving etc with Designer who will return next week with few different options for us. Hopefully be within our budget .

So in all a very good day

Wayne

[warbuff1]

So finally out of 115 names there are now only 12 that will be going on the memorial with just a Surname & Initial . Original 87 men on memorial obviously already knew their Surname & First name and out of 28 additional men we found 16 positively identifield with first names. Think it pretty good going that. Remaining 12 men are too vague to 100% name so we dont want to make the mistake of adding a name just because it sounds right or because they lived in Manchester etc.

Men not positively identified are as follows:-

Booth P

Down W

Fanning A

Griffiths J

Massey T

Moran J

Pearson J

Pennington P

Phillips E

Swindells W

Waring E

Wedge A

Awaiting memorial designs and costing options in next couple days then hopefully after meeting next week will be able to reveal more details etc

Wayne

[ralphjd]

Wayne. Make that 11 . PERCY BOOTH 46860 Lancs Fusiliers 1-6-1918 son of Harriett Booth lived 17 Padstow Street Miles Platting Manchester employed as a nipper carman (1911 Census) born c 1895. Ralph.

[warbuff1]

BOOM! . You come up trumps again Ralph!! Marvellous piece of work. you should be a private detective...or maybe you are

Wayne

[ralphjd]

Wayne. Down to 10. EDWARD Wareing (note letter E) 4271 Manchester Regt 18-2-1916. Husband of Sarah Jane married 1910 son of John and Amelia. He is on the 1911 census as an Ostler Railway Company and his name is listed as Warring. Several public member trees have him listed as a relative. Ralph.

[ralphjd]

Strike off another. THOMAS Massey 20997 Royal Scots Lothian Regt 28-4-1917 son of Ada 57 South St Longsight a railway porter. Ralph.

[ralphjd]

Distinct possibility I think. EDWARD Phillips 1925 1/7th Manchesters 4/6/1915 born and enlisted Manchester SDGW

EDWARD Phillips born 1898 Manchester 48 Woodward St Ancoats M/cr son of Joseph and Mary a railway nipper 1911 Census.

Ralph.

[ralphjd]

Swindells : Only 5 listed on CWGC : William b1885 killed 28-10-1918 he was a restaurant proprietor;

William b 1883 killed 29-8-1918 he was a wages clerk Manchester Corpn

William b 1893 killed 27-5-1916 he was a printworks labourer

William b 1897 killed 21-9-1918 no employment

William b 11-11-1901(W on CWGC) killed 26-10-1918 no employment - at school.Lived 35 Union Street Lower Broughton Salford in 1911.

I reckon your man is one of the last two named. Ralph.

[warbuff1]

Hi Ralph brilliant detective work once again. Agree with you on swindells thought that too.

Been soo busy lately with work lately so will update shortly when have time

Wayne

[ralphjd]

Think this is your man :- Joseph PEARSON born Ancoats enlisted Ancoats resided Openshaw 1743 kia 8/3/1916 (SDGW).

Ancestry :- born c1894 resided 42 Tuley Street Openshaw in 1911 employed as a van nipper - railway son of Sidney and Mary Ellen married Emily in 1913. Ralph.

[ralphjd]

Another likely candidate :- James MORAN 17433 20th Manchesters kia 3-6-1916 born Chorlton-on-Medlock enlisted Manchester resided Salford (SDGW)

James MORAN born 1896 lived Manchester in 1911 (Ancestry 1911 under James Jones) a nipper railway company 1901 census = father Patrick sister Mary married a J W JONES and he is listed as "wifes brother in 1911. Born Hulme a cock stride away from C-O-M. Ralph.

[warbuff1]

Heading off to Somme on Sunday for few days. Will be laying a wreath at Thiepval for all our men of LNWR London Road. We have around 15 on memorial itself. Others being visited too in their respective cemeteries. Virgin Trains kindly funded the wreath. Will post pictures next week for anyone to see

Wayne

[Glen]

Apologies if this info has already been posted, I have only just seen this post and have skip read through it.
Some details from the St Pauls Service in memory of Railwaymen

P Booth – 2 listed under LNWR – Both Privates, 1 a Yardman, 1 a Porter
W Down – Private – Van boy
A Fanning – Private – Parcel Porter
J Griffiths – 3 Listed under LNWR, Private- Porter, Sapper – Carriage Cleaner, Private – Parcel Van Boy
T Massey – Private – Clerk

J Moran – Private – Vanman
J Pearson - Private – Vanman
P Pennington – Not listed
E Phillips – Private – Vanboy (Also EA Phillips – Private – Clerk)
W Swindells – Private – Leading Parcels Porter
E Waring – Private – Badge Porter
A Wedge – Private – Policeman
I have no further info in my database on any of these

A Wedge – only 3 on CWGC, 7424 has probate records showing he was living in Walsall, Albert Edward (L9068) has surviving records and lists trade as “Footman” unfortunately I can't find any more details on the other.

If you need the grades of the full list, let me know and I'll look them up I will follow this post to see any replies

Glen

[warbuff1]

Hi Glen,

Thanks for info. What was the St Pauls Service? When did it happen? Any info always appreciated

Wayne

[warbuff1]

Ok latest update is a meeting taking place on 29th April with relevant parties interested. Going to be a eventful one I think as the old saying "Too many cooks" is starting to creep in with sadly people with their own agendas.

But will not be broken on this. These men deserve more and I and Andy will fight for their memory to be preserved and not forgotten in all ways that we possibly can

Wayne

[Glen]

Wayne,

On Wednesday, May 14th, 1919 at 2.30 p.m. a memorial service was held at St. Paul's Cathedral, in memory of the railwaymen of Great Britain and Ireland who have died in the service of their country during the War, 1914-1918. Simultaneous services were held at other Cathedrals (including Manchester) Within the service book was a list of those known to have lost their lives listed by Railway company.

IWM have reprinted the service book and if you search for "St Paul's Cathedral Service in Memory of Railway Men" you'll easilly find a copy

If you want a full list of LNW staff let me know (My email address is in your message box)

Glen

[warbuff1]

My apologies to one and all for no recent updates. Been snowed under at work so had little time.

*Update*

Several things were decided at the last meeting we had. Time wise we realise the date of 2014 is a too little timeframe for us to accomplish our dream so the date for dedication of the new memorial will now be around April/May 2015.

Also with regard to the additional 28 men we have decided to just go with the 87 names that were on the original London Road Goods Depot memorial as we cant positively identify all the additional 28 with first names and also could leave us open to people coming along and saying basically " I know someone else who should be on there, Or that's not his right name etc etc.

Funding is well in place now and we have all moneys needed to design, build, install the memorial and also for a fitting ceremony on the unveiling day.

We've secured the support of Duke of Lancaster's Regiment who will be sending a senior officer for the ceremony as many men from Manchester Regiment & Kings Liverpool and others who now form the Lancaster's. Hopefully soldiers, buglers & regimental association will be involved as well.

.The Royal British Legion are aware and again give their full support with hopefully some of the old boys with standards attending.

Were now just at the stage of finalising the inscription wording for the memorial then agreeing that we are all happy with the design of the memorial then we can plough ahead and get the designer to order the stone, get his architect team to produce detailed drawings etc

We now have the full support of Virgin Trains, Railway Heritage Trust & Network Rail in this so this project is going to be fulfilled. On another note its also making my hair go greyer by the day

Hope that keeps you all in the picture. As ever anymore news I will post here time permitting

Regards

Wayne

[ralphjd]

Can understand your reasoning, but all in all a waste of time searching the "others" then ? Ralph.