SPotter Posted 27 March , 2007 Share Posted 27 March , 2007 An original VC is shown below...... Les. One you randomly picked out of your VC collection, your Lordship ??? !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltaxman Posted 27 March , 2007 Share Posted 27 March , 2007 One you randomly picked out of your VC collection, your Lordship ??? !!! Just one I had rattling around in a drawer This particular VC is held by Bristol Museum and not on public display. It's part of a small collection built up by a chap who bought medals from Crimea "vets" and loaned them back (at a charge!!) to the men for parades etc. Les. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Marshall Posted 28 March , 2007 Share Posted 28 March , 2007 Just going back to the King's South Africa Medal, as has been pointed out, it could not be awarded on it's own, but it is also virtually unknown without the two Clasps (South Africa 1901 & South Africa 1902) unless awarded to nursing sisters. Soldiers like Private Knight would have recieved the bars. It looks like this particular medal has not only lost its other half, but also its bars. Is it me or is the VC in Easily's photo a touch on the small size when seen next to the MM? Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 28 March , 2007 Share Posted 28 March , 2007 As about 4 of the medals appear to be copies I think its a fair chance the "VC" just may be one as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Marshall Posted 28 March , 2007 Share Posted 28 March , 2007 Just had another look at the GVR MM...... The bar is wrong, wrong wrong! Too deep from top to bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebie9173 Posted 28 March , 2007 Share Posted 28 March , 2007 No sign of a MM and/or Bar to 5719 Pte G Ryan during 1916 or 1917. Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liverpool annie Posted 28 March , 2007 Share Posted 28 March , 2007 I wonder if it could be this Ryan ?? RYAN, C Cappawhite Royal Irish Regiment Military Medal http://homepage.eircom.net/~tipperaryfame/medals.htm Annie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD60 Posted 28 March , 2007 Share Posted 28 March , 2007 I wonder if is there any connection between the G.Ryan and the two possibles J.Ryan or Miles Ryan ( his VC seems not to be located. ) http://www.answers.com/topic/john-ryan-vc http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_Ryan Maybe a relative and a replica was made in the family ? It may explain why it is alone in the box. Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 "I wonder if it could be this Ryan ?? RYAN, C Cappawhite Royal Irish Regiment Military Medal " C Ryan RIR was 11053 so the numbers dont match. infact the 3 even remotely possibles are I think the first one was a DCM . Medal card of Ryan, C Corps: Royal Irish Regiment Regiment No: 8872 Rank: Corporal 1914-1920 WO 372/23 Medal card of Ryan, J Corps: Royal Irish Regiment Regiment No: 4944 Rank: Private 1914-1920 WO 372/23 Medal card of Ryan, C Corps: Royal Irish Regiment Regiment No: 11053 Rank: Lance Corporal 1914-1920 WO 372/23 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltaxman Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 The problem we've got here, I think, is that there were many many men "put up" for the VC but never received it and got the DSO, DCM, MC etc instead. I've looked again at the photo supplied and as previously mentioned, the VC does look a tad smaller than the MM, but I think this may be an optical illusion. My reasoning behind this is that the ribbon appears to be narrower then normal thus the appearance of being smaller. I've sized up a VC and MM and most, if not all, my VC copies have slightly wider ribbon than the MM, even both medals are approx. 36mm wide. Les. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltaxman Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Here's a photo of 3 VC & an MM. The 3 VC are shades of brown, dark brown and almost black. The black one is a museum quality display version (and cost an arm & a leg), where as the brown ones are your normal £20-£30 heavy weight copies. The VC & MM are the same size, but note the difference in ribbon sizes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltaxman Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 and here's one showing the difference in ribbon size - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Les, is there such a thing as an unnamed genuine and presented VC , In context with the other copy medals etc is it likely to be genuine??. There is a possible family history/myths who knows but the medals do not fit anything official that anyone on the forum can find. GAreth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 And as you point out the ribbon is smaller on the VC than the MM , but we know the MM is not genuine . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltaxman Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 And as you point out the ribbon is smaller on the VC than the MM , but we know the MM is not genuine . Like the VC & MM in my photos unfortunately As far as I am aware, there have been a handful of copies produced for the families of the recipient, but they are named etc in the usual manner, but also marked as a replacement. This is when the original has been lost/stolen and the man in question is no longer around. Replacements to living recipients are identical to the "lost" medal. I've never actually seen either version of a "replacement", but having spoken to several VC holders and museum curators, there's a mark added to the bottom of the reverse. Les Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Way, way back, in the deepest depths of time that was post #50, I suggested to "easily confused" that if she thought this might be genuine she should contact Hancocks, that day. Until she comes back and tells us that they confirmed it was genuine and that it's now in a very secure place, we don't we just make the obvious assumption that it ain't genuine? And that, presumably, an ancestor of hers was "having a laff" at some point when the cabinet was made. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staffsreg Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Where's she gone? last entry post #69. Ivan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Where's she gone? Ivan Just because a member doesnt constantly post on their own thread, doesnt mean they've "gone" anywhere. As a quick check on confused's profile confirmed to me. I'm sure she appreciates the helpful contribution you made in post #57, though. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Given the way this thread has gone, why should she post anything more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 I think by in large the posters on this thread have been fair and gave the benefit of the doubt also have spent considerable time trying to confirm entitlement. The fact that apart from the service numbers of the 2 Ryans and their 1915 star and 1945 star respectively nothing else holds up to scrutiny, so why should we not say so. If the original post is genuine then its a shame for them to be let down by the facts but so be it. Yes there have been a few comments but this reflects previous experiences of tall stories on the forum. gareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_Hazell_Great_Grandson Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Given the way this thread has gone, why should she post anything more? Exactly. Roland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
easily_confused Posted 29 March , 2007 Author Share Posted 29 March , 2007 Hi all So sorry I haven't replied at all today but I have been at work all day. I must say a huge THANK YOU to everyone who has taken the time and trouble in helping me in my search I have been totally blown away. I must say i'm not sure where to go now with my research, I have got hold of a newspaper report that was written when my grandad died listing the medals he won, but now i'm begining to wonder maybe where the story came from. I think I will try and send for his service records thats if I can, to see if they will tell me anymore and also those of my great grandads. I don't know where to start in this but I will look it up. I have to say this has been quite a turbulent journey, I wonder sometimes if family history is better left alone, was the family better off with the "family legend" or now not knowing what was going on lots of whys are being asked. John Hartley regarding the VC I have suggested contacting Hancocks but as the medal has no names or anything inscribed we have taken the advice given on here and believe it to be a copy and at the end of the day it does not matter to us that it was a copy, grandad might not have earnt it but it was something he thought alot of. Thanks again for all the trouble you have all gone to I am very grateful it's a great service that you offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 29 March , 2007 Share Posted 29 March , 2007 grandad might not have earnt it but it was something he thought alot of. Yep, and that'll do nicely. Been a pleasure to watch from the sidelines and, although its a shame we didnt get to see one of the famous "lost" ones surface, Im glad it settled where it has. Best of luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD60 Posted 30 March , 2007 Share Posted 30 March , 2007 I wonder if is there any connection between the G.Ryan and the two possibles J.Ryan or Miles Ryan ( his VC seems not to be located. ) http://www.answers.com/topic/john-ryan-vc http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_Ryan Maybe a relative and a replica was made in the family ? It may explain why it is alone in the box. Regards Do you think this hypothesis is plausible ? It may explain why the familiy considers it as important. Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 30 March , 2007 Share Posted 30 March , 2007 Thanks again for all the trouble you have all gone to I am very grateful it's a great service that you offer. Glad to have contributed - even if a couple of my posts have been firmly tongue in cheek. I hope we've been able to do a bit of sorting wheat from chaff for you that will allow your research to focus more clearly. I think I'd have liked grandad. He must have had a great story to tell abou the VC - perhaps he knew someone who had won one and he bought the copy to remember a mate or a relative (as TD60 suggests). If not, and he was just having a laugh, what a lot of bottle. Good luck with whatever you decide to do with the information John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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