ss002d6252 Posted 24 August , 2015 Author Share Posted 24 August , 2015 Absolutely Craig, many thanks to everyone whose had a hand in this. Going to have a good look through all the soldiers effects I already have to see what it dates it throws up. A couple of them have service records so it can be checked against the dates on them. Marvellous. Any issues then just post here or send me a msg and I'll see what I can do. You may see some odd ones on the basis my calculator cannot cover every circumstance but I can usually talk you through those ones. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 27 August , 2015 Author Share Posted 27 August , 2015 I have now obtained a copy of the relevant Army Order for the gratuity and it's clarified and added to a few points raised - I shall post an update later. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 27 August , 2015 Author Share Posted 27 August , 2015 Squadron Quartermaster-Corporal (Household Cavalry) orSquadron, Battery Troop or Company Quartermaster-Serjeant, Staff Corporal (Household Cavalry), Staff Serjeant or Colour-Serjeant £10 A study of AO17 reveals an extra level of gratuity which I had suspected as per some of the earlier posts showing evidence of it but I couldn't be sure until I could get my hands on the actual order. A new version of my calculator will be updated for this and I'm going to tweak my article and website to update it. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 28 August , 2015 Author Share Posted 28 August , 2015 A link to both parts of Army Order 17 of 1919 - https://wargratuity.wordpress.com/2015/08/27/army-order-17-of-1919-schedule/and https://wargratuity.wordpress.com/2015/08/27/army-order-17-of-1919-army-council-instructions/ Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 28 August , 2015 Share Posted 28 August , 2015 Thanks Craig, It's going to take me a bit of time to digest properly though!! Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 28 August , 2015 Author Share Posted 28 August , 2015 Thanks Craig, It's going to take me a bit of time to digest properly though!! Regards Chris It will - there may be a couple of typos as I typed it up quickly and need to go back and fully proof read it. There's also another document I have which mentions a couple of later amendments ! Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 15 September , 2015 Share Posted 15 September , 2015 Charles Marshall had been a pre war regular enlisting in March 1900 (I think still a soldier in 1911) Entered theatre 21/9/1914, Killed in action 27/10/1914 (21 days in France) , received gratuity of £3 13s 0d plus war gratuity payment of £5 (given in red?) Total £8 13s, Estimated WW1 enlistment date August 1914William Waddell. Entered theatre 3/8/1915, killed in action 3/3/1916, (213 days in France) received gratuity of £8 7s 10d plus war gratuity of £4 0s 0d Estimated enlistment Feb 1915Does this tell us anything about Marshall's pre-war service, if Marshall receives a higher gratuity (£5.00) than Waddell (£4.00) for less service? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 15 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 15 September , 2015 Tells you nothing about prewar service, only war service counts. Marshall has less than 12 months service so received the basic £5 war gratuity (gross) . Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 15 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 15 September , 2015 Waddell had 14 months service which gives a gross war gratuity of £6. This was paid less the £2 service gratuity giving the £4 net payout. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 15 September , 2015 Share Posted 15 September , 2015 Thanks Craig, maybe one day I will get to grips with it. I need to study your site further. Cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 15 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 15 September , 2015 To be fair, Marshall's gratuity entry is an odd one compared to most. His gratuity entry shows he was paid £5 gross. Normally it would be adjusted for the service gratuity but because he must have been a regular enlistment his war gratuity was not reduced and he received both gratuities in full. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Cove Posted 15 September , 2015 Share Posted 15 September , 2015 Craig, Do you happen to know whether officers who joined up after the war started had their service gratuity deducted from their war gratuity in the same way that Other Ranks did? (And if so how much the service gratuity was for an army lieutenant - I have found the war gratuity rates for officers on the internet but I can't seem to find anything about the service gratuity.) Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 15 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 15 September , 2015 Craig, Do you happen to know whether officers who joined up after the war started had their service gratuity deducted from their war gratuity in the same way that Other Ranks did? (And if so how much the service gratuity was for an army lieutenant - I have found the war gratuity rates for officers on the internet but I can't seem to find anything about the service gratuity.) Roger I've not come across any reference so far to officers and service gratuity but it wasn't something I looked at as the officer gratuities are pretty much non-calculatable compared to the men's and they're easier to find dates with via the LG. I suspect they didn't receive the service gratuity but don't quote me on that. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Cove Posted 15 September , 2015 Share Posted 15 September , 2015 and they're easier to find dates with via the LG. LG? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 15 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 15 September , 2015 LG? London Gazette. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 16 September , 2015 Share Posted 16 September , 2015 (edited) Craig, tried to pm you, but inbox must be full. I was looking at this soldier, and he seems to have received quite a sum, as did others on this page Click Is this unusual? Mike Edited 4 March , 2018 by Skipman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 16 September , 2015 Thank Mike, cleared now. They are what I call 'Type 2' entries - these are entries created only after the introduction of the war gratuity and so they didn't need to be corrected for the service gratuity which had been paid. They've effectively been paid gross where as the 'Type 1 entries' have been paid net to account for the service gratuity. They're actually the easiest to work with as all you have to do is to take of the basic 12 month gratuity and then double the remaining figure. In the example above the basic is £5 for 12 months so deduct the £5 from the £13. You can then double the £8 to get 16 months. Add the basic 12 months back on to this and you get 28 months service (assuming he had overseas service). Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 16 September , 2015 Share Posted 16 September , 2015 Thanks again Craig. I kind of get it. The penny will drop eventually. If nothing else, it's a good example of a Type 2 entry? Cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 16 September , 2015 Thanks again Craig. I kind of get it. The penny will drop eventually. If nothing else, it's a good example of a Type 2 entry? Cheers Mike It's a perfect example - once I clocked them it made life so much easier for me to figure them out. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 16 September , 2015 Share Posted 16 September , 2015 Have I read this type 2 correctly? ie I have a Pte in Worcestershires died 31.8.18 and Soldiers Effects gives only 'incl War Grat £10'. So 10 less 5 equals 5; times 2 equals 10 mths plus original 12 equals 22 mths thus enlistment c. Oct/Nov 1916 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 September , 2015 Author Share Posted 16 September , 2015 Without seeing the original record then yes, that looks right assuming he had overseas service and no periods where he wasn't eligible to accrue service towards a gratuity. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 16 September , 2015 Share Posted 16 September , 2015 thanks and very well done for opening up this avenue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 5 October , 2015 Author Share Posted 5 October , 2015 I have now come across a draft of the original war office plans for the war gratuity which were approved by the war cabinetand which morphed in to the final scheme. I will add it to my website in due course. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 5 October , 2015 Share Posted 5 October , 2015 That's tremendous Craig. Thanks for your efforts, I'm sure they'll be invaluable to anyone else who is searching for information, without the luxury of a service record for a man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 5 October , 2015 Author Share Posted 5 October , 2015 That's tremendous Craig. Thanks for your efforts, I'm sure they'll be invaluable to anyone else who is searching for information, without the luxury of a service record for a man. Hopefully so. I'm just adding more as I find it. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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