Lancashire Fusilier Posted 25 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 25 February , 2014 With reference to post # 1305 - The ' Mack ' Armoured Car. Attached is a period coloured photograph of the American ' Mack ' Armoured Car of the 1st Armoured Motor Battery of the National Guard of New York State and its crew, which gives us the colours of the armoured car and the National Guardmen's uniforms. Note the hand operated ' Siren ' fitted above the driver's compartment. LF This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 25 February , 2014 Share Posted 25 February , 2014 Also the treaded tyres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scalyback Posted 25 February , 2014 Share Posted 25 February , 2014 We could produce a tank from noting and adapt it, yet the simple matter of tyres and even sand ladders missed by the boffins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 26 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 26 February , 2014 The Americans were more advanced with their tyre designs, and there was some experimentation with wheel devices to try to counter ' wheel sinkage '. Attached is a photograph of such a device fitted to the wheels of a Pierce-Arrow Armoured Car supplied to the RMA ( Royal Marine Artillery ), which was designed to prevent wheel sinkage and give the armoured car better traction on soft ground. LF This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 27 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 27 February , 2014 Sometimes, even the mighty tracked Holt 75 Tractor had trouble dealing with the quagmire of the Western Front. LF IWM4423 This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockdoc Posted 27 February , 2014 Share Posted 27 February , 2014 Ye Gods! I'll bet that took some shifting! Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 27 February , 2014 Share Posted 27 February , 2014 Looks like driver error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 27 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 27 February , 2014 Ye Gods! I'll bet that took some shifting! Keith Keith, The Holt 75 had a 4-cylinder 75 hp engine with 2 forward and 1 reverse gears, and weighed some 24,100 lbs. Would probably have taken another Holt to pull it out of the mud. Regards, LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockdoc Posted 28 February , 2014 Share Posted 28 February , 2014 It makes you realise how effective those tracks were at spreading the 11 tons or so on the bad roads of the era. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 28 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 28 February , 2014 More muddy problems, this time a Despatch Rider/Signaller with a bogged down motorcycle, is given a helping push from a German prisoner. LF IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 28 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 28 February , 2014 Update to post # 1434 The motorcycle looks to have also lost its rear tyre ? LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRANVILLE Posted 28 February , 2014 Share Posted 28 February , 2014 Not sure what is being done with the rear wheel, but if you look closely the wheel has a belt passed around the rim and back towards in the engine - possibly driving it? The only other scenario I can think of is that the tyre has punctured, can't be repaired so a belt has been wrapped round the wheel rim and bound tight round an appropriate part of the engine casing effectively bracing the rear wheel so it won't go round and thus the bike becomes easier to slide along, actually riding to a large extent on the belt. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 28 February , 2014 Share Posted 28 February , 2014 I think the rear tyre is so caked in mud that it is 'invisible'. I also thought that motorcycle drive systems, belt or chain was normally on the right hand side? It could of had a drive belt on both sides giving two 'gear ratios' instead of a gearbox, the system used on the early Morgan 3 wheelers (which had chain drive). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 28 February , 2014 Author Share Posted 28 February , 2014 In my post # 1139 - 11th January, 2014, there is an Army Despatch Rider riding a Triumph 550 motorcycle with a rear-wheel belt drive ( photo attached ), also Triumph made several versions of rear wheel belt drive motorcycles at that time ( photos attached ), including the 1916 Type H. As Phil has said, the motorcycle's rear wheel has sunk so far into the mud as to become ' invisible ' leaving only the drive wheel showing, giving the impression that the motorcycle is running on the belt drive wheel rim. The actual rear wheel of the motorcycle, is hidden from view to the right of the drive wheel. The motorcycle, shown in post # 1434 is a Triumph 550 with a rear wheel belt drive. LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 1 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 1 March , 2014 Triumph rear wheel belt drive motorcycles. LF These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil@basildon Posted 1 March , 2014 Share Posted 1 March , 2014 The first one (1908) doesn't even have a gearbox! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 1 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 1 March , 2014 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 1 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 1 March , 2014 Posted Today, 07:56 AM Other motorcycle manufacturers were also producing rear-wheel belt drive motorcycles during WW1, here we see an officer in the Tank Corps ( along with his pet dog ) on his ' Douglas ' motorcycle which has a rear-wheel belt drive. On his ' Douglas ', the drive wheel for the rear-wheel belt drive is on the opposite side to that on the ' Triumph ' motorcycle. On the back of his motorcycle are several ' rings ', I am guessing these are spare belts for the rear wheel belt drive ? LF This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 1 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 1 March , 2014 During WW1, as well as the rear-wheel belt drive motorcycles, there were rear-wheel chain drive motorcycles as shown in the 2 attached photos of a 1908, and a 1914 ' Scott ' motorcycle. LF These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockdoc Posted 1 March , 2014 Share Posted 1 March , 2014 I think it's just one spare belt on the Triumph. I'd guess they'd be at least 6ft long before fitting. They were prone to stretching so part of routine maintenance was to take out a short length and rejoin the belt.Looks like the front tyre's got a puncture, too! Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 1 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 1 March , 2014 I think it's just one spare belt on the Triumph. I'd guess they'd be at least 6ft long before fitting. I can see that it is all part of the same long belt just looped around, and looking at several other photographs of motorcyclists riding belt drive motorcycles, I can see it was standard to carry a spare belt on the back of the motorcycle. LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 2 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 2 March , 2014 Not too sure of the purpose of these 2 staged photographs of Despatch Riders from the 293rd Siege Battery RGA ( Royal Garrison Artillery ), shown resting somewhere in Italy. In the second photograph, which is clearly of the same two Despatch Riders, again shown resting, a sentry has been added. Whatever the reason, the first photograph gives us some excellent details of the ' Triumph 550 ' rear-wheel belt drive motorcycles being ridden by the Despatch Riders. LF IWM These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick Eggs Posted 3 March , 2014 Share Posted 3 March , 2014 Good subject motor cycles, glad the question of the motor cycle , with no tyre has been solved , if you enlarge the area of the back wheel on a touch screen PC you can just about see the tyre ,it would have a hard stretch to get the drive belt on the wheel rim, but it did look odd. Just come across another interesting shot of a Harley. Crimson Rambler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 3 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 3 March , 2014 Just come across another interesting shot of a Harley. Crimson Rambler Thanks for the Harley Davidson photograph. That is an interesting photograph which shows an American Army Corporal, Roy Holtz of Chippewa Falls, Wisconsin, riding a Harley Davidson motorcycle sidecar combination and supposedly being " the first Yank to enter Germany after WW1 ". In the photograph, the German troops shown on the right are returning to Germany after the Armistice, and Roy Holz is actually leaving Germany, not entering Germany. On November 8, 1918, Ray Holtz was stationed with his Unit in Northern Belgium, near Spa, close to the German border, and as a Despatch Rider, Holtz was ordered to take an American Captain on a night reconnoitering mission, the weather was bad and in the pouring rain they took a wrong turn and got lost. In the distance they could see the lights from a farmhouse, and decided to get direction from the farmer. Without knowing, they had actually crossed the German border, and the farmhouse was occupied by German officers of the 5th Bavarian Division, who were as surprised to see the Americans, as the Americans were to see the Germans. Ray Holzt and his Captain were treated as guests of the German officers, and were then held prisoner for just 3 days, and as soon as the Armistice was announced on November 11, they were released by the Germans and their Harley Davidson motorcycle combination was returned to them. Shortly after, Corporal Holzt and his Captain found their way back to their Unit, which had reported them missing. In the days following the Armistice, Corporal Holtz and his Unit crossed the border with Germany back and forth many times, and Ray Holtz thinks that is when the photograph was probably taken. Corporal Holtz was unaware of the photograph, until it was shown to him by an American newspaper reporter in June 1943. LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick Eggs Posted 3 March , 2014 Share Posted 3 March , 2014 Thanks for the detail on Roy Holtz LF. Crimson Rambler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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