Ian Riley Posted 26 November , 2007 Share Posted 26 November , 2007 Colin Unless someone beats me to it, I shall have to await the return of the book. From memory, I think Blakes did pass the VC on, but they are not in business any more, like many motor retailers, faded away. Daggers On the authority of Medals of the King's Regiment: A Handlist of Medals Held by National Museums & Galleries on Merseyside by Simon Jones, the VC of Sjt David Jones is held by the National Museums Liverpool, the current name for NM&GM, ref RHLI94.16 They do not appear to hold the other medals to which he would be entitled. The Introduction says explicitly that the medal is not part of the King's Regiment Collection but 'is on loan to NMGM from the Trustees of J. Blake and Co'. This was the situation in 2002. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bantamforgot Posted 27 November , 2007 Share Posted 27 November , 2007 Many thanks Ian, Great to know the award is not in some private owners collection, one can only hope that the trustees of Blake & Co. will continue the current measures, also that the Liverpool authority will continue to look after their treasures. Thanks again Ian. Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Riley Posted 27 November , 2007 Share Posted 27 November , 2007 Many thanks Ian, Great to know the award is not in some private owners collection, one can only hope that the trustees of Blake & Co. will continue the current measures, also that the Liverpool authority will continue to look after their treasures. Thanks again Ian. Colin Colin, I am not an expert on Museum constitutions but I don't think that National Museum Liverpool is actually a 'Liverpool' authority (the trustees have, I think, a fair degree of Merseyside representation). I think the collections got rescued by the Government in the Militant years of the city's political existence hence the 'National'. http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/about/trustees.asp Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulianB Posted 27 November , 2007 Share Posted 27 November , 2007 Any relevant school records may be with the LRO - though i've just been battling with the online catalogue which gives nothing ! I found some very useful material on schools, churches etc in the 1WW period when I was last there. Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted 27 February , 2008 Share Posted 27 February , 2008 Hi all, You seem to have an interest in David Jones VC. He is my great uncle. His VC was handed over to the Museum of Liverpool Life some years ago by Blake's and is now held in the King's Regiment collection. I too have been hoping to trace his other medals but have drawn a blank. Trisha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Riley Posted 27 February , 2008 Share Posted 27 February , 2008 Trisha, Thanks very much for that information. I presume that you are aware of the work of Bill Sargeant and his committee in raising funds to commemorate all Liverpool VCs Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted 28 February , 2008 Share Posted 28 February , 2008 Hi Ian, Yes, I have copy of "Liverpool Heroes" though I suspect some of the information in the book in respect of David Jones is inaccurate. Nevertheless, the fundraising is very much appreciated. Trisha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bantamforgot Posted 7 March , 2008 Share Posted 7 March , 2008 Hello Liverpool Lou, Regarding David Jones VC, could you enlighten me re. any possible connection between his widow, nee. Doyle & Father Doyle ?? Regards. Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted 8 March , 2008 Share Posted 8 March , 2008 Hello Colin, I don't know the Father Doyle to whom you refer but Elizabeth Doyle did have several brothers. Do you know his christian name? Trisha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bantamforgot Posted 9 March , 2008 Share Posted 9 March , 2008 Hello Trisha, He was Father William Doyle padre to a unit in the 16th. Irish Division, he may well have no connection with David Jones widow, originally named Dorothea Doyle. Probably a coincidence Trisha, I can find no connection myself just another of those intriguing queries like the "man in the trench" I do have transcripts of much of the David Jones data including his memorials etc. Regards. Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted 9 March , 2008 Share Posted 9 March , 2008 Hi Colin, I have just re read the whole thread again and realised that Father Doyle's name appeared on the memorial which I haven't seen. I think you had a attached the wording but it no longer appears. I have checked the census records but there is no William listed as a brother of Elizabeth Dorothea but of course he could have been studying away from home. He may have been her uncle but her parents were born in Ireland so I have no way of checking earlier census records. Trisha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillchadwick Posted 27 March , 2008 Share Posted 27 March , 2008 I have family connections to St Margarets Church and school. Whilst researching my uncle Harold Waterworth 1/5 King's Liverpool (K.I.A. 31st July 1917 aged 22yrs) I discovered amongst water damaged papers held at liverpool record office, a card with the names of the fallen of both Wars which were read out on Remembrance Sunday. St Margarets church was destroyed by fire in 1960 and no Roll of Honour remains apart from this list. As my uncle was a St Margarets 'old boy' I am assuming that some of those listed would also have been old boys? I sincerely hope that this information can be of use Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bantamforgot Posted 27 March , 2008 Share Posted 27 March , 2008 Many thanks Trisha, I apreciate your post, regret delay in replying. regards. colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 4 April , 2008 Share Posted 4 April , 2008 Hello everyone, I am an old boy of Essemmay (1947 - 51) in the days of Messrs Simpson, Appleton, Brophy, Pierce, McLellan, Hunt et al so it was interesting to find reference to it on The Forum. Of course that was when it sat square on the Belmont, Shiel and West Derby cross roads and long before it moved to Aigburth. I can't add a lot to what's gone on but I was reading something some years ago on Eric Bell who served with the RIF and was awarded his VC for actions at Thiepval in 1916. In the article, it said that he attended "St Margaret's in Liverpool". I didn't realise there are two schools with that name in the city area and I wrote several times to the headmaster at the resited school in Aigburth asking him if he was an old boy. He wasn't able to help and I now I think I understand why. Apparently the class lists for that period were lost in the move. More recently, I read somewhere that prior to The Great War Eric lived for a while in Warrington. Can anyone add anything to this. Kind regards, Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillchadwick Posted 7 April , 2008 Share Posted 7 April , 2008 Sorry, he isn't listed on my list Gill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 8 April , 2008 Share Posted 8 April , 2008 Sorry, he isn't listed on my list Gill Thanks Gill, I get the impression from your earlier pst that your list might not be complete. Is that correct? Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillchadwick Posted 8 April , 2008 Share Posted 8 April , 2008 Harry, The list is the one that used to be read out in St Margarets church on Remembrance Sunday and contains names from both Wars. It is complete in that sense, but I can't be sure if all the fallen were 'old boys' of the School . The fact that my uncle was an 'Old Boy' makes me think that some of the others might also have been Gill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 9 April , 2008 Share Posted 9 April , 2008 Harry, The list is the one that used to be read out in St Margarets church on Remembrance Sunday and contains names from both Wars. It is complete in that sense, but I can't be sure if all the fallen were 'old boys' of the School . The fact that my uncle was an 'Old Boy' makes me think that some of the others might also have been Gill Thanks Gill, I can't remember a list being read out but that doesn't mean a great deal believe me. Age and memory don't mix very well. Kind regards, Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillchadwick Posted 10 April , 2008 Share Posted 10 April , 2008 Harry, Perhaps you are right maybe the list wasn't read out in church, it could just have been a copy of the 'Roll of Honour". My Grandmother was caretaker at the School from 1911 unitl 1941, unfortunately there are no family members alive who could verify whether the list was read out or not Sorry, Gill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 11 April , 2008 Share Posted 11 April , 2008 Harry, Perhaps you are right maybe the list wasn't read out in church, it could just have been a copy of the 'Roll of Honour". My Grandmother was caretaker at the School from 1911 unitl 1941, unfortunately there are no family members alive who could verify whether the list was read out or not Sorry, Gill I've emailed two friends who were with me at SMA (Cyril Carroll and Les Coker) to ask them if they can remmember this happening. I'll get back to you with their response. Best wishes, Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 11 April , 2008 Share Posted 11 April , 2008 Hello Gill, The friend who I would anticipate knowing whether or not the list was read out each Remembrance Day has responded. This was his reply: "I was in the choir there, (no Bull) for a couple of years but can't remember it happening". Cyril. I'm pretty sure he would have remembered had it been done each year, Kind regards, Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 14 April , 2008 Share Posted 14 April , 2008 Hello Gill The second of my two friends who was with me at St Margaret's Anfield has responded to my request for information regarding the reading out of the names of those who died during the two world wars. He backs up what Cyril Carroll and I feel was the case at SMA in the four years we were there when he says that: "Having attended numerous Rememrance day also Battle of Britain parades I can never remember any one's name being read out during the church service". Kind regards, Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillchadwick Posted 14 April , 2008 Share Posted 14 April , 2008 Harry, Do you think that it is just a copy of the 'Roll of Honour'? As you can see it states at the top of the page 'For Remembrance Sunday' Best wishes Gill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Geste Posted 14 April , 2008 Share Posted 14 April , 2008 Harry, Do you think that it is just a copy of the 'Roll of Honour'? As you can see it states at the top of the page 'For Remembrance Sunday' Best wishes Gill Absolutely Gill and that's what's confusing me. I can see why you feel that it was something (very worthwhile I might add) that WAS read out on Remembrance Days and the fact that we three septuargenerians can't remember it happening doesn't mean it didn't take place as you've described. On a slightly different tangent, I'm a wee bit disappointed that no one has come forward and commented on the point I made about Capt Eric Bell VC who, according to an article I read some time ago, attended "St Margaret's school in Liverpool". My wife and I visited Enniskillen, Co. Fermanagh in Northern Ireland a few years ago and saw his name on the war memorial there. I'm interested to know if he and his family "crossed the water" and settled in Liverpool sometime prior to The Great War and if he attended a school called St Margarets. Kind regards, Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillchadwick Posted 15 April , 2008 Share Posted 15 April , 2008 Harry, 1901 census, Eric Bell aged 5yrs born in Ireland 1896 is living in Seaforth , he is listed as E.N.F. Bell perhaps the enumerator could have made a spelling mistake ??) On a B.B.C. website a lady has submitted the story of her Grandmother an irish immigrant ,working for a Captain Edward Bell (Eric's father) at Seaforth barracks. Would Eric have attended St Margaret's if they were living in Seaforth? perhaps they moved nearer West Derby before the Great War ? we will have to wait for the 1911 census!!! Amitiés Gill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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