WW1 Cap Badges

[trenchtrotter]

I have examples of each of the Bham battalion badges. They are all genuine and all on sliders. The 2nd Batt badge cane with the chaps medals. Never seen a Bham pals badge on a slider though have seen loads of fakes out there.

TT

[Sparky53]

Mmm I'm looking for cap badges to commemerate my rellies but have a feeling this ISN'T the right one for GT Uncle Dick:-

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...ADME:B:EF:UK:11

Or is it ..................

Jane

[max7474]

The fake's slider is often (but not always) JR Gaunt.London marked whereas the correct ones were always blank.

Alan

I was in touch by email with a Warwicks collector who said he had several genuine Birm badges on loops, with only a couple on sliders, anyone know anything about the Birm. Battalions having badges with loops? I have never been able to find a 2nd Batt. badge, are they the most rare?

Bill.

Bill,

I have never seen any B'ham Pals badge either fake or real on loops. 2nd Bn are ararer than the 1st Bn but not as scacre as the 3rd Bn (who were disbanded before the war ended) and priced accordingly.

Alan

[Staffsyeoman]

Bill,

I have never seen any B'ham Pals badge either fake or real on loops. 2nd Bn are ararer than the 1st Bn but not as scacre as the 3rd Bn (who were disbanded before the war ended) and priced accordingly.

Alan

Alan,

I agree on the loops - my genuine ones are sliders. But as to the sliding scale of scarcity, I've never bought into that, and have refused to pay huge markups based on it. The Battalions were formed at the same time, were of roughly equivalent strength throughout the war, were mainly brigaded together and weren't they all disbanded before the war's end? The pricing scale has always struck me more as 'dealer talk' than a reflection of reality - no that you can do anything about that; once one ups the price the others tend to follow.

[max7474]

Phil,

I unfortunately agree with you on that but the scarcity reflects the number on dealers lists and hence prices than the number made. The sliding scale is reflected in Bosley's auction prices as well but there is a bit of chicken and egg here as bidders will pay more if they have seen the dealers' prices beforehand.

Alan

[pbrydon]

I see that if you now buy a rare cap badge on E bay from one dealer,you get a second free !!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.B.

[7t2ndswinger]

I see that if you now buy a rare cap badge on E bay from one dealer,you get a second free !!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.B.

Fantastic badges too Peter, made out of an unknown base metal. Solder!! I once had one of these from a similar seller from this country, an officers 10th Middlesex. It looked superb at the front and being an officers smooth backed badge totally convincing at the rear. It was only when I dropped it and it bent that I realised it wasn't bronze!

Keith

[MBrockway]

Just as (yet) another example of eBay idiocy, I today came across a KRRC badge up for auction, which is described thus:

"Cap? badge from The King's Royal Rifle Corps. Looks quite old. Made of brass or bronze, it is in the shape of a Maltese Cross, with 'CELER ET AUDAX' at the top. On each arm of the cross is a roll of engagements such as Peninsula Dehli, Punjab, Relief of Ladysmith and Alamanca. Approx. 5.5cm high. Quite good condition.

Just needs a clean

. "

I hope this particular one is a reproduction - that's the only way I can bear the thought of the eager new buyer energetically removing all the rifle regiment blackening with Brasso until it positively gleams!

Cheers,

Mark

[tynesideirish]

Fakes are a blight but...

I was RHA, my capbadge that I still have in my beret was made by Ammo & Co and bought at the PRI. I've seen Smooth brass virtually silouettes being worn alongside Collar dog capbadges held in place with matches. If in 60 years some collector has these berets and badges, which will be the fakes?

Many years ago I was given the actual wartime 1st issue keepsafe capbadge of a family friend who was a 14th RIR YCV 1st Day Somme vet. I cherish this badge, but I showed it to a dealer and he said Oh its a restrike the base of the Shamrocks too fat! Should I believe my now long dead friend who carried the 'lucky' badge throughout his service or the dealer. Hmmmm lets see.

[pbrydon]

Collectors seem obsessed that badges should be in pristine with all the correct fittings in place, there are a couple of things worth mentioning.

I remember being told by a serving officer that his father,when he was serving in the family regiment,knew a fellow officer whos cap badge had the gilt title scroll missing,but rather than get a replacement,he just continued to wear the badge which appeared to be all silver but with a couple of small holes where the gilt scroll had been attached.

My father gave me his WW2 Royal Signals cap badge which was issued to him abroad,it is cast brass and anyone seeing it ,without knowing its provenance, would be sure it was a repro.

An ex Royal Marine told me that when he was serving they used to buff their cap badges on a abrasive wheel to remove most of the detail,it was then much easier to polish the badges to a shine before parades ( and nowhere for brasso to get trapped before drying to a white powder ) I have a post 1926 Kings cap badge where this has been done to the scroll and torse. "Kings" has then been engraved onto the brass scroll with the soldiers initials engraved ,on at each end,but if it was done to personalise the badge or make it easier to clean ,or a mixture of both,I dont know.

Other than blackened brass and bronze badges,wouldnt you expect that brass and/or white metal badges would show some signs of having been ( lovingly ) cleaned over a period of time ? I dont mean traces of dryed on polish on the rear,but some wear on the highpoints.

I cant remember which author it was who said something on the lines of " collectors will be happy to have a poor example of a scarce badge,untill a better example comes along".

In my opinion it is far better to have a poor example that you know is 100% than one you have your suspicions about.

A fellow collector once showed me a cap he had been given by a former Home Guard officer,who ,when he was commissioned got some bronze paint and painted his bi metal cap badge rather than go to the trouble of obtaining an officers service dress example. without the provenance anyone seeing the cap and badge might think the item highly suspect.

P.B.

P.S. one dealer on a well know auction web site who has a feedback of over 1500 has 2 badges for sale which he describes as unknown.One is Royal Artillery and the other The Gloucesters !!!!!!!

[MBrockway]

On 19/06/2007 at 21:33, MBrockway said:

<snip>

In 1917, the CLB Cadets as an organisation decided to affiliate themselves to the KRRC. At this point the CLB Cadets switched to the new badge based on that of the KRRC:

which is Badge D over in our KRRC Cap Badge topic.

As far as we can tell , this badge did not exist before 1917, and was only worn officially by the CLB Cadets back in Blighty, who by now were heavily involved in war work on the Home Front and wearing a khaki Army cadet uniform.

Some examples of this KRRC-style badge have been found on The Somme and at Gallipoli, but these were probably being carried as personal items and not worn as service dress.

Despite frequently mentioning the supposed discovery of KRRC-style maltese cross CLB Cadet cap badges at Gallipoli where no KRRC unit ever served, I have only now spotted the obvious paradox between the introduction of the new badge in 1917 and the final evacuation of Allied forces from Gallipoli in January 1916 ... at least a year earlier.

I've been trawling for my source on this obviously dubious fact, but with no luck.

My best guess is that any badge found at Gallipoli must have been the original oval CLB cap badge.

Apologies Pals 

Mark