In From the Cold

[chrisharley9]

SHELDRAKE, HARRY WILLIAM

Rank:

Private

Service No:

CH/17702

Date of Death:

26/01/1916

Age:

22

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Screen Wall.

Cemetery:

NUNHEAD (ALL SAINTS) CEMETERY

Additional Information:

Son of J.H. Sheldrake, of 42, Sturgeon Road, Walworth.

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Sheldrake is buried in this cemetery. The Commission is in the process of adding his name to the 1914-1918 screen wall to commemorate him as it is not possible to mark his actual grave. Please contact the Commission before planning a visit, for more information.

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

[chrisharley9]

HAMMANT, WILLIAM HENRY LEWIS

Rank:

Private

Service No:

CH/7090

Date of Death:

02/10/1917

Age:

45

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Cemetery:

NUNHEAD (ALL SAINTS) CEMETERY

Additional Information:

Brother of J Hammant,of 18 Major Road, Bermondsey.

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Hammant is buried in this cemetery. The Commission is actively working to commemorate him at this location.

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

[chrisharley9]

ELLIS, THOMAS GEORGE

Rank:PrivateService No:CH/12002Date of Death:04/12/1917Age:36Regiment/Service:Royal Marine Light InfantryGrave Reference:S.E. Div. Grave 297.Cemetery:BALDOCK CEMETERYAdditional Information:Husband of Emily Louisa Ellis of Baldock, Herts.

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Ellis is buried here. The Commission is in the process of producing a headstone to mark his grave.

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

[chrisharley9]

PENNIKET, ARTHUR CECIL

Rank:

Private

Service No:

CH/21028

Date of Death:

24/09/1918

Age:

19

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Screen Wall. 127. 88.

Cemetery:

MANOR PARK CEMETERY

Additional Information:

Son of Caroline Penniket, of 399, Wick Road, Hackney Wick, London.

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Penniket is buried here. The Commission is in the process of adding his name to a screen wall to commemorate him as it is not possible to mark his actual grave.

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

[chrisharley9]

CLAY, HENRY JOHN

Rank:

Private

Service No:

CH/15000

Date of Death:

06/04/1917

Age:

37

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Screen Wall. 339. 42505.

Cemetery:

CITY OF LONDON CEMETERY AND CREMATORIUM, MANOR PARK

 

Additional Information:

Son of Thomas and Christiana Clay of London Fields.

 

 

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Clay is buried here. The Commission is in the process of adding his name to a screen wall to commemorate him as it is not possible to mark his actual grave.

 

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

[chrisharley9]

HAMMOND, HENRY WILLIAM

Rank:

Private

Service No:

PO/14603

Date of Death:

12/09/1918

Age:

26

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Special Memorial (C. 44A).

Cemetery:

HITHER GREEN CEMETERY

 

Additional Information:

Brother of A E L Upton, of 43 Uplands Road, South Croydon.

 

 

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Hammond is buried here. The Commission is in the process of alternatively commemorating him within the cemetery as it is not possible to mark his actual grave.

 

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

[Phil Evans]

On 20/12/2016 at 19:33, chrisharley9 said:

HAMMOND, HENRY WILLIAM

Rank:

Private

Service No:

PO/14603

Date of Death:

12/09/1918

Age:

26

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Special Memorial (C. 44A).

Cemetery:

HITHER GREEN CEMETERY

 

Additional Information:

Brother of A E L Upton, of 43 Uplands Road, South Croydon.

 

 

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Private Hammond is buried here. The Commission is in the process of alternatively commemorating him within the cemetery as it is not possible to mark his actual grave.

 

Commemoration Moved From UK BOR.

 

Chris,

Do you know why the CWGC are not able to mark the actual grave?

If they, or Lewisham made the same initial mistake that I did several years ago, then there is a good possibility that it is not necessary.

I'm working on another two possible non-commemorations in Hither Green at the moment and Deceased Online certainly has a major inaccuracy in its database.

Phil

[Guest]

   Chris - Could you give any tips on how to proceed with checking out a possible "In From the Cold". I have 2 locally whose trail I am working down:

AYLOTT

SIDNEY

S

28

03/07/1920

Lance Cor

Army Service Corps

Home

B22537

 

 (Suspect he is in City of London) Died of TB contracted on war service

 

MAY

CLACY WILLIAM PATRICK

24

27/01/1920

Second Lieutenant

Royal Air Force

=

(Suspect Hadley Common, Barnet)  TB contracted on war service-officers file confirms this-RAF paid for sanatorium treatment, where he died in Banchory, Aberdeenshire)

 

In time, I also have:

CRAIG

ROBERT POLLOCK

P.P.

43

06/04/1920

Private

Royal Garrison Artillery

United Kingdom

134512

 

(Possibly City of London- TB again)

 

TRUE

GEORGE FRED

G.F.

16/01/1920

 

     (ASC- also TB on war service, discharged)

 

   What level of documentation is required? Is there anyone with special knowledge of City of London?? The roll I work on is for Wanstead and City of London is at the southern end of Wanstead. Only other likely place is St Marys, Wanstead and I have worked through the cemetery registers to no avail.

   I suspect Cof L has generated a number of queries, so if there is an expert,please point me at him or her

 

              Best wishes

                        Mike

 

[Phil Evans]

Mile,

 

Is your first one Thomas Sidney Aylott, CMT/3106?

Provided that his death certificate confirms that the primary cause of death was TB, then he looks a strong case.

 

Robert P Craig looks more complicated.

 

I have run all four through Deceased Online, but couldn't find a burial for any of them. Coverage is very limited though.

 

Phil

[CGM]

CLACY WILLIAM PATRICK

24

27/01/1920

Second Lieutenant

Royal Air Force

=

(Suspect Hadley Common, Barnet)  TB contracted on war service-officers file confirms this-RAF paid for sanatorium treatment, where he died in Banchory, Aberdeenshire)

__

 

His Scottish Death Certificate should be available through ScotlandsPeople but they have totally re-designed their website and it is refusing to recognise me and my old password.

I have requested a new one and when it is working I will look him up.

____________

____________

 

It is possible IFCP has some of these names already in the pipeline.

I'm sure someone who can check will be along soon (seasonal festivities allowing).

 

CGM

Mike, It's probably a good idea to ask a MOD to move your post and all the replies to a new thread because at the moment they are tacked onto a 2006 thread of Royal Marine Light Infantry cases.

Edited 27 December , 2016 by CGM
Additional information

[Phil Evans]

I have just managed to update my ScotlandsPeople login.

His death is on there, but it took me a bit of time to find it:

 

MAY

CLANCY W PATRIC

Age: 23    Year: 1920    Ref: 252/6     RD: Banchory Ternan

 

Phil

[Guest]

  CGM- Thanks for the heads up- Following your previous help re. Cof L registers, I was summoning up the energy to hit Aylott there.

   For May, we have the Scottish certificate courtesy of a Forum member in North Britain- May's service file leaves no doubts about his fatal illness being contracted on service

   I will move this stuff to another thread. I have one RMLI casualty for Wanstead- as it is buried not too far from Nunhead,which seems to be a popular scene for In From the Cold. Mine is Arthur James Pamplin.

 

Phil- Thanks for the Heads Up that effectively tells me that Death Certificate is needed. When I have located the graves of Aylott and May, then I will be back to pick your brains. That they should be commemorated is something I am keen on and all available service records give factual data on illness being contracted on service. I hope we can get May done quite quickly- his father, who predeceased him, was Goods Manager for the Great Eastern Railway and his mother died in Barnet in 1963. So I am expecting a headstone for him. If correct, I already have a Guard of Honour lined up!!

   Craig and George Fred True are also illness on war service, from the records. Again, tracking their graves is the main concern.

[John_Hartley]

3 hours ago, voltaire60 said:

Could you give any tips on how to proceed with checking out a possible "In From the Cold"

Basically there are two criteria for commemoration.

 

First is that the man died between 4/8/14 and 31/8/21 and was still serving in the forces at the time of death. Documentary evidence of death/date is required, together with evidence of the "serving" status. Often a UK issued death certificate will include both elements. If a man died overseas, In From The Cold probably already has the case in hand as we have crosschecked the overseas military deaths register and Soldiers Died in the Great War against CWGC records (about 1.5 million listings)

 

And, second, that a man died between the due dates, having been discharged from the services due to wounds/illness contracted or aggravated by service. These are trickier to substantiate as you need to provide evidence that the cause of discharge was due to service and you also need a death certificate that makes the link between cause of death adn cause of discharge.

 

If you think you may have a case, we'll be happy to submit it to CWGC on your behalf - please contact us  through our website to discuss it further (see link in my signature)

[Guest]

John Hartley- Thanks for the info.  I will try them one at a time and go through them one at a time. The In From the Cold project is one that commands my wholehearted respect. Those I have named are all illness on war service-documented.

    I have a personal if tangential interest in this matter- My father's mother and sister, Edna Buchan Thompson and Amy Thompson were both killed in the big German raid on Devonport on 21st March 1941-a bomb hit the shelter they were in at Blockhouse Park, Devonport. They are listed as civilian war dead by CWGC- but,as with all, no burial locations, only the reporting authority. Both are buried in the small churchyard at Rame, close to Rame Head on the Cornish side of Plymouth Sound in unmarked graves. 

    That those who render good service to their country at the cost of their own lives go unrecorded is something that is getting the remedy its deserves for the Great War.

[CGM]

12 hours ago, Phil Evans said:

 

Chris,

Do you know why the CWGC are not able to mark the actual grave?

If they, or Lewisham made the same initial mistake that I did several years ago, then there is a good possibility that it is not necessary.

I'm working on another two possible non-commemorations in Hither Green at the moment and Deceased Online certainly has a major inaccuracy in its database.

Phil

 

HAMMOND, HENRY WILLIAM

 

Isn't it true that as HAMMOND is buried in a common grave that is why his grave cannot be marked by the CWGC?

 

CGM

[John_Hartley]

Burial in a common grave is certainly a reason why the Commission couldnt erect a headstone.

[chrisharley9]

15 hours ago, Phil Evans said:

 

Chris,

Do you know why the CWGC are not able to mark the actual grave?

If they, or Lewisham made the same initial mistake that I did several years ago, then there is a good possibility that it is not necessary.

I'm working on another two possible non-commemorations in Hither Green at the moment and Deceased Online certainly has a major inaccuracy in its database.

Phil

Phil,

 

I believe that his grave is in common ground with several other unrelated burials with him. Therefor an alternative commemoration is the way forward as normally the burial authority will not allow the graves to be marked.

 

Chris  

[chrisharley9]

13 hours ago, voltaire60 said:

  CGM- Thanks for the heads up- Following your previous help re. Cof L registers, I was summoning up the energy to hit Aylott there.

   For May, we have the Scottish certificate courtesy of a Forum member in North Britain- May's service file leaves no doubts about his fatal illness being contracted on service

   I will move this stuff to another thread. I have one RMLI casualty for Wanstead- as it is buried not too far from Nunhead,which seems to be a popular scene for In From the Cold. Mine is Arthur James Pamplin.

 

Phil- Thanks for the Heads Up that effectively tells me that Death Certificate is needed. When I have located the graves of Aylott and May, then I will be back to pick your brains. That they should be commemorated is something I am keen on and all available service records give factual data on illness being contracted on service. I hope we can get May done quite quickly- his father, who predeceased him, was Goods Manager for the Great Eastern Railway and his mother died in Barnet in 1963. So I am expecting a headstone for him. If correct, I already have a Guard of Honour lined up!!

   Craig and George Fred True are also illness on war service, from the records. Again, tracking their graves is the main concern.

I have the GER staff magazine at home for the whole of the Great War so this may help

[Guest]

   Thanks Chris -local libraries have the GER magazine-and a friend has the CD of it-as well as the technical knowledge to get the photos off if all else fails!!  Aylott's brother was also a casualty and is well commemorated, so that is hopeful- Think there are still some family in the area (But havent got the research up to 1918+ in detail). I'll move queries to another thread-I picked up on an entry and didnt realise it was an RM thread (Coming from Plymouth, my dear old Dad knew one of Cockleshell casualties of 1942-so anything RM or RN gets a clear run with me)

 

     On a slightly wider note, a large local hospital, Claybury, was used for a number of mental health cases during the war. Although not certain, deaths in the hospital seemd to be at quite a high rate, as the totals were reported in the local Medical Officer of Health reports each year. I have a memory that one such service death was interred in South Weald/Warley as a matter of routine. dont know if Warley has been covered as yet

    

 

 

 

[chrisharley9]

Best speak to CGM with regard to Warley.

 

Chris 

[Phil Evans]

4 hours ago, chrisharley9 said:

Phil,

 

I believe that his grave is in common ground with several other unrelated burials with him. Therefor an alternative commemoration is the way forward as normally the burial authority will not allow the graves to be marked.

 

Chris  

 

Chris,

 

I don't know if you remember, but I photographed what I thought was C.17 for you several years ago. Since having DO, I have studied it closer, in amongst other Hither Green research and found that he is not buried there. It is a private grave. He is buried in C.17*, which is a common grave and stands at the edge of the original cemetery. In the same area are a number of CWGC headstones, which, if you look at the GRRF, are marked as (RCB Rudd, for example) C.44 Φ. To commemorate him at C.44A in the private section, if that is the intention, seems odd.

See below for a photo of the common grave section.

 

Phil

[chrisharley9]

Phil 

 

Will ask some questions 

 

Chris

[Phil Evans]

Thanks Chris,

 

Feel free to contact me off-Forum if you want any more info. I don't want to clutter up this thread with my ramblings.

 

Phil

[chrisharley9]

COLLINS, GEORGE JAMES

Rank:

Sergeant

Service No:

CH/7879

Date of Death:

20/03/1919

Age:

42

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Panel Reference:

Panel 4

Memorial:

BROOKWOOD 1914-1918 MEMORIAL

 

Additional Information:

Husband of F M Collins, 4 Tough Road, Stratford.

 

Grave Found Woodgrange Park Cemetery, London - with thanks to CGM. 

[chrisharley9]

COLLINS, GEORGE JAMES

Rank:

Sergeant

Service No:

CH/7879

Date of Death:

20/03/1919

Age:

42

Regiment/Service:

Royal Marine Light Infantry

Grave Reference:

Screen Wall (Addenda Panel).

Cemetery:

WOODGRANGE PARK CEMETERY, EAST HAM

 

Additional Information:

Husband of F M Collins, 4 Gough Road, Stratford.

 

 

N.B.

Recent research has shown that Sergeant Collins is buried here. The Commission is in the process of adding his name to a screen wall to commemorate him as it is not possible to mark his actual grave.

 

Commemoration Moved From Brookwood 1914-18 Memorial.