AndyHollinger Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 While you've all hinted at differences ... is there anything that stands out to tell us about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 Phil, I think Arm is referring to a Bachelor of something. The higher degree will be an MA. Brum does indeed run one in First World War Studies. Chester College runs one with lectures on Tuesday or Wednesdays in Military Studies, 2-year part-time taught degree, including a 18000 word thesis. Salford do a part time MA, their department is biased towards intelligence. Wolverhampton has a War Studies course, but not sure if they run a part time MA. They took me without a degree, Arm! And if they took me.............!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 [ What would constitute a "lower degree" Arm? Phil B A higher degree is a Masters or PhD. A lower degree is a BA or BSc . Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 Birmingham uni runs a world war one degree but the level requires a lower degree Thanks, folks. Arm didn`t mention that it was an MA, so I assumed it was a BA! Phil B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 A higher degree is a Masters or PhD. A lower degree is a BA or BSc . Robbie Rather depends from where and in what subject? (Only joking, Robbie!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 A higher degree is a Masters or PhD. A lower degree is a BA or BSc . Robbie Rather depends from where and in what subject? (Only joking, Robbie!) ooooooooo..you'll keep, Phil. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 27 February , 2005 Share Posted 27 February , 2005 Sorry for the confusion folks, but as usual its been sorted out ion my absence. Arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris basey Posted 12 March , 2005 Share Posted 12 March , 2005 (edited) Getting back to the original topic! The W.H.Smith web site are doing the book at £12.50 - for collection from one of their branches. (Which I have now ordered and been advised that publication date is 24th March 2005) Edited 13 March , 2005 by chris basey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMESOLDIER Posted 22 March , 2005 Share Posted 22 March , 2005 Hi There, Got my copy this morning from Amazon. Will let you know what I think when I've finished it. Just 100 pages in, but think it is excellent so far ! Cheers Tim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 22 March , 2005 Share Posted 22 March , 2005 Very easy to order from W H Smith for £12.50 to pick up from your local shop post free ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Hornby Posted 22 March , 2005 Share Posted 22 March , 2005 A few interesting lines on this one. I am about half way through the book, I received a copy from Amazon yesterday. So far I can only say this book is going to be a classic. The 'Donkey Floggers' and 'Welsh Wizard' lovers are going to hate it! But what's new there then. Maybe at long last the 'Butchers and Bunglers' myths will be laid to rest, possibly a vain hope. It will be interesting to see how the Press review the book. One just hopes that a few of the more popular Reviewers have the courage to start dispelling the myths on Douglas Haig. It's about time that society recognised just what a good job he did. After all we won! Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 22 March , 2005 Share Posted 22 March , 2005 Weep weep, Ordered mine along with something else that has skipped out and will take a week or so to come through so will not get until next week at earlest. regards Arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dunlop Posted 24 March , 2005 Share Posted 24 March , 2005 Its a great book. I am thoroughly enjoying it. It was particularly helpful to have the difference between the two versions of Haig's diaries explained. The book mostly uses the manuscript version, with the typescript version being clearly indicated when added to the text. The potted histories of various generals is also very interesting. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 24 March , 2005 Share Posted 24 March , 2005 Arm I'm still waiting for my copy to arrive from Amazon. I ordered it on the Free Delivery option...cannot wait to get into it. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 26 March , 2005 Share Posted 26 March , 2005 Pleased to advise that the WH Smith website duly delivered the book to my local WH Smith branch where I collected it today. Quite a bargain at half price - £12.50 with no delivery costs. Does make me wonder how WH Smith make this pay i.e internet prices but with all their branch costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muerrisch Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 Review in today's Sunday Telegraph: reviewer clearly sitting on fence in the Donkey Derby: beside me, I think. He who sits on fence gets sore. A mugwump Mug on one side of fence, wump on the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 It will be interesting to see how the Press review the book. One just hopes that a few of the more popular Reviewers have the courage to start dispelling the myths on Douglas Haig. It's about time that society recognised just what a good job he did. After all we won! Martin <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Did we expect to find anything anti-Haig in Haig`s diary? Phil B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dunlop Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 The editors make some comments, positive and negative, about Haig in the introduction. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 Did we expect to find anything anti-Haig in Haig`s diary? Phil B <{POST_SNAPBACK}> In his diary i think( yet to get my copy) his own words do sometimes condem him if you choose to read it that way. Both authors do not i beleive sell Haig as another Wellington or Marlborough. But more try to point out the hurdles he had to over come and the learning he did whilst in the job. So by the wars end he was a better commander than when he started it! regards Arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 So by the wars end he was a better commander than when he started it! regards Arm. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not an unreasonable expectation, Arm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 27 March , 2005 Share Posted 27 March , 2005 Phil, Just had a chance to read the review in the telegraph by Max Hastings it makes interesting reading, in that it says that the authors do not disguise the fact that Haig said and did things in his diary that made him look bad and perhaps a bad leader! He (Hastings) seems to be non sympathetic to Haig. Yes of course he should be a better commander by the end, but there are many that say he was not! I am a Haig on the fence man myself, yet to make my mind up completely and probably never will but I do feel that a butcher and bungler fullstop is too easy a verdict. regards Arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 30 March , 2005 Share Posted 30 March , 2005 Oh baby, Amazon have just delivered. I could crush a grape. Arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 31 March , 2005 Share Posted 31 March , 2005 I am a Haig on the fence man myself, yet to make my mind up completely and probably never will but I do feel that a butcher and bungler fullstop is too easy a verdict. regards Arm. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Me, too, Arm. We will never reach a definitive assessment of Haig. There are two main reasons for this for me. Firstly, we have no yardstick to measure him against and secondly, we don`t know how anyone else would have performed in the same job. The description "pretty good" doesn`t tell us much about a man whose performance would ideally be described as outstanding! Phil B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyHollinger Posted 31 March , 2005 Share Posted 31 March , 2005 I doubt we ever will - come to a generally accepted conclusion - not here nor anywhere. The historical world does't allow that nor does the human condition. Recently, a historian stopped into my office and remarked about the pictures of Lee in my office (all out of uniform so it might be PC) saying "How can you revere the man who lost the war for the confederacy?" Perhaps you felt the tremors or the weather service reported the small atomic blast? She was dead serious ... there is a school of thought, nowadays, that Lee bled the Confederacy white and that if they'd listen to Longstreet the Yankees would continue to attack in order and allow themselves to be defeated piecemeal by a less audacious commander like Joe Johnston. The fact that Lee took over with Union forces 5 miles from downtown Richmond is totally forgotten ... All this to say is that where there are two informed historians there will be four opinions heavily footnoted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Dunlop Posted 31 March , 2005 Share Posted 31 March , 2005 Firstly, we have no yardstick to measure him against Phil Can you clarify this? I know that you are aware of Sir John French and the array of C-in-C's from all the other countries that lined up in the war. I would have regarded these contemporaries as yardsticks so I am interested in what additional thinking lies behind your comment. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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