spconnolly007 Posted 30 November , 2012 Author Share Posted 30 November , 2012 Agree TT, Croix De Gurre as the Croix Du Combattants have square crosses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Holstein Posted 1 December , 2012 Share Posted 1 December , 2012 It's not uncommon to see the Croix de Guerre on the top of shells like that. It's a fairly common symbol in French war memorials. Carrier pigeon from Verdun tells me that not only were the flags recently torn down but that someone has cut out and removed the relief map to be seen in Ft. Douaumont. That's a really terrible loss. It was a wonderful map for explaining the ground to visitors. The map in Fort Vaux isn't nearly so good. Will they replace it, I wonder? Christina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spconnolly007 Posted 1 December , 2012 Author Share Posted 1 December , 2012 Lets hope so! What is wrong with these people? Sean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seadog Posted 1 December , 2012 Share Posted 1 December , 2012 Sean, if Christina is referring to the German flag flying at Fort Douaumont as in post 218 then frankly I can completely understand the attitude of some French people towards such action. We must remember that the German name for the battle was “Gericht” meaning a tribunal, or judgment or more rarely, an execution place. The intended aim of the German Chief of the General Staff was to “Bleed the French Army White at Verdun”. I also understand that the whole battlefield is sacred to the French with Fort Douaumont being particularly revered. Whilst of course nobody would suggest that the following generations of the combatants have any responsibility for the slaughter that ensued, surely we must pay respect to history and be aware that even today the Great War still casts a long shadow and the past is still the past and we cannot see what happened then though the eyes of those who suffered here. I hope that this excellent thread will not dissolve into an acrimonious discussion for I believe that it is important that we can debate such issues in a calm and measured fashion. Regards Norman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Holstein Posted 1 December , 2012 Share Posted 1 December , 2012 There is a distinction to be made between the theft of the map from Fort Douaumont and the action of tearing down the German and European flags. I remember from the arguments at the time - and there were many - that the only way the Powers That Be got the German flag accepted at all was by putting a European gloss on it. It's difficult to argue with the European flag at a place like Verdun but it didn't seem to make the German flag any more popular. Without getting in politics and incurring the Wrath of the Mods, I personally wonder whether tearing the flags down could be a political statement rather than a historical one. Christina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spconnolly007 Posted 1 December , 2012 Author Share Posted 1 December , 2012 Norman, I was actually refering to the stolen map, and like yourself, I would rather not pass judgement on what the French do in France. Although I should imagine that most tourists would be touched by such a gesture (i.e. the flag), I can fully understand why the French would not. Christina, I think you may well be correct regarding it removal though! Sean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seadog Posted 1 December , 2012 Share Posted 1 December , 2012 Hi Sean I do understand that the two instances may not be connected and the vandalism of the map is more likely down to the crass ignorance of some half-baked moron who has little or no understanding of what happened here and the suffering of the soldiers. Regards Norman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin14 Posted 1 December , 2012 Share Posted 1 December , 2012 I personally wonder whether tearing the flags down could be a political statement rather than a historical one.Christina I would tend to think both politics and history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
free1954 Posted 2 December , 2012 Share Posted 2 December , 2012 what a great read. thank you THE SHINY SEVENTH and thanks to all who contributed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie knight Posted 13 December , 2012 Share Posted 13 December , 2012 I HAVE ONLY BEEN A MEMBER FOR A FEW WEEKS....AND THIS FORUM JUST GETS BETTER BY THE DAY...SO MUCH TO READ AND LOOK AT..... THIS THREAD ALONE IS FANTASTIC ..WELL DONE...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spconnolly007 Posted 13 December , 2012 Author Share Posted 13 December , 2012 Cheers robbie, glad you enjoyed it and welcome to the forum. Regards, Sean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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