salientpoints Posted 13 July , 2004 Share Posted 13 July , 2004 Thanks for your comments on this David. I am sure we are not alone. Regards Ryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kath Posted 15 July , 2004 Share Posted 15 July , 2004 Re. the previous post from Andy, Wed, 26 Nov 2003, about children sliding through the water. For some reason, & I am an OAP, I have never minded seeing children playing on a War Memorial. I find it difficult to explain. It seems to me the sequel to the sacrifice, that there are youngsters living in a free world. I acknowledge that others on the Forum will disagree. Kath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 I was at the Gate on Saturday night and saw Jacky and his colleagues organise yet another perfect act of remembrance. The ceremony was opened with a intro stating what would happen that evening (reading of names etc) and included a discrete statement that respect would be served better by giving the missing men one's silence rather than by audible means. It was exteremly well done and it worked without upsetting anyone. There were about a thousand people there with many school children and you could have heard a pin drop! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Birch Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 Clapping at a solomn ceremomy does seem very "un-British" and possibly disrespectful, although as has been said the fact that people attend is surely their way of showing respect. The "correct " way to behave (whatever that means), has been changing over the years. I remember as a schoolboy being expected to remove my cap when passing the Cenotaph, and I remember being in a taxi when the cabbie remove his cap as we drove past. The really great change occured, I think, at Princess Diana's funeral when quite a lot of people clapped as the cortege passed them, and later people threw flowers at the passing hearse, something I had never seen before. I have also noticed an increasing tendency for a significant number of the audience to clap now between the Movements at a concert, something unheard of a few decades ago. We live in changing times. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 Having had the misfortune to attend military funerals during my service career (almost too long ago to remember), I take my cue from the format used there. No sound was made after the Last Post until orders were heard for the military units attending to move off. I also think that the Last Post buglers give us a clue. After the Last Post has been played, there is a quiet order, and the buglers move off quietly. But as Tim said, times change. I'm sure people feel that they should contribute somehow, and that just drifting away is not the best thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Buck Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 I noticed at the Cenotaph yesterday a lot of the younger people there kept their baseball caps on throughput the proceedings. It wasn't disrespect (many of them were still singing the National Anthem etc.) I'm sure they just didn't realise it was expected. We attended the Menin Gate ceremony for the first time on 7 July 2003 when Bolton School Choir sung so wonderfully. It remains the most moving event I have attended, only soured at the end by a member of one of the British groups finding it necessary to cross the road to admonish a young man for not removing his hat during the playing of our National Anthem. For me it is enough that our youth continue to remember those who died in the Great War and there was no need for such pomposity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 Couldn't agree more Brian. Anyone one who treats the service with respect can applaud at the end and where whatever style of clothing suits them, as far as i am concerned. I personally don't applaud and almost never wear any headgear but that's my personal choice. Respect is a mutual thing - or at least it must be to mean anything. I also seem to recall people spntaneously clapping as Diana's hearse proceeded out of London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 Anyone one who treats the service with respect can applaud at the end and where whatever style of clothing suits them, as far as i am concerned. I agree. I’ve attended the ceremony several times. Each time, I’ve been so immersed in my own thoughts and reflections that I couldn’t tell you whether anyone clapped, or was wearing headgear, or committed any other perceived errors. I might have been wearing something on my head; if so, I’ve no recollection; though I know I wouldn’t have clapped or chewed gum. The enormity of what the memorial represents is so powerful, demands such concentration and emotional depth, that anyone who is focussing on what neighbouring spectators are doing or wearing is clearly not devoting his whole attention to the significance of where he is. Provided that the spectators are not being disruptive, he could do with rethinking his priorities. Gwyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyHollinger Posted 19 July , 2004 Share Posted 19 July , 2004 Anyone one who treats the service with respect can applaud at the end and where whatever style of clothing suits them, as far as i am concerned. I agree. I’ve attended the ceremony several times. Each time, I’ve been so immersed in my own thoughts and reflections that I couldn’t tell you whether anyone clapped, or was wearing headgear, or committed any other perceived errors. I might have been wearing something on my head; if so, I’ve no recollection; though I know I wouldn’t have clapped or chewed gum. The enormity of what the memorial represents is so powerful, demands such concentration and emotional depth, that anyone who is focussing on what neighbouring spectators are doing or wearing is clearly not devoting his whole attention to the significance of where he is. Provided that the spectators are not being disruptive, he could do with rethinking his priorities. Gwyn Bravo ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salientpoints Posted 12 December , 2004 Share Posted 12 December , 2004 On a very cold Saturday (11th December) a member of the Last Post Association (I am sure Jacky can confirm the name) actually made a point in his introduction to the ceremony that evening to say that 'no one should clap at the end as this is a remembrance service - your silence is the mark of your respect'. (something like that anyway). Was this something required by the participants that evening, has it been growing to become too intrusive to others? This was an interesting observation/change I noted, perhaps one that has been officially endorsed now by the LPA? I am sure we will hear more in due course. Cheers Ryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacky Platteeuw Posted 12 December , 2004 Share Posted 12 December , 2004 Ryan, Sorry I missed you but as you have whitnessed there was a big attendance for mid December. It was the Chairman of the Last Post Association who made the remark. This is done regularly now whenever there is a large crowd present. The message is indeed what you say: emphasising the remembrance thougt and asking not to applaud during the Ceremony. Jacky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat McLachlan Posted 13 December , 2004 Share Posted 13 December , 2004 I think one of the important things to remeber about the Menin Gate ceremony is that by simply being there, you are demonstrating significant respect for the men and the memorial. Ieper is not a major tourist drawcard for anyone without an interest in the war and the Last Post ceremony is not the sort of event that people attend unless they know what it's about. Even though a small number clap (which I don't quite understand) it's rare to see anyone at the ceremony who isn't deeply moved by it. More disturbing is the growing rock concert atmosphere at the Anzac Day ceremonies in Gallipoli - backpackers getting sloshed and singing Cold Chisel songs at the tops of their voices will never be mistaken for 'respect' by me. As for the paper-thin excuse that 'this is what the larrikan Anzacs would have wanted', give me a break. I've never seen a war veteran visit the grave of his mate with a beer in one hand and a hotdog in the other. Sorry, a slightly off-topic tirade there, but I think you get my point. Cheers, Mat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salientpoints Posted 13 December , 2004 Share Posted 13 December , 2004 Ryan, Sorry I missed you but as you have whitnessed there was a big attendance for mid December. It was the Chairman of the Last Post Association who made the remark. This is done regularly now whenever there is a large crowd present. The message is indeed what you say: emphasising the remembrance thougt and asking not to applaud during the Ceremony. Jacky Thanks for the info Jacky - you did look particularly busy when I saw you so I didn't think it best to bother you It was good just to see you all there in force. I thank you for clarifying the situation re clapping - I think when you have such a large crowd, and presumably a lot of them were probably shipped in by coach for the evening from Christmas Market short-breaks in Lille, Ghent etc so pointing out to the public it is a remembrance service is certainly the right thing to do. Pictured below just before the ceremony - a good 600+ people I reckon Cheers Ryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
healdav Posted 13 December , 2004 Share Posted 13 December , 2004 I suppose we should look on the bight side (even though the clapping embarasses me). It's better than booing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul guthrie Posted 13 December , 2004 Share Posted 13 December , 2004 If people meant disrespect by clapping they would not be there; I am however pleased they are being told to refrain, it does bother me though I know they mean no harm it grates upon the ear! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 13 December , 2004 Share Posted 13 December , 2004 Soon the Menin Gate ceremony will only be a tourist attraction pure and simple. But arn't we all tourists in a sense when we visit? Lets be glad that people have the leisure and money to travel more these days and broaden their horizons. Oh yes, I don't like clapping but it does not mean that clappers are setting out to be disrepectful. The main thing is they should listen in silence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcfc1923 Posted 14 December , 2004 Share Posted 14 December , 2004 Hello, I must say I saw people clapping not so long ago at a funeral of a cyclist when the coffin was carried out... I must admit I can't understand that habit... Regards, Jan at the funeral procession of princess Diana, ther was also clapping, one man's meat is another man's etc etc. jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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