The Plummed Goose Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 Pals, If this is a silly question ... you'll forgive me. I have been 4 times to the summit of Kireçtepe in the last 2 weeks, have lost 3 kilo's, shared lunch with a shepherd of Small Anafarta and had a a GREAT TIME !! But I am still not sure WHERE the actual frontline is. At the summit (Jephson's Post) it is clear. When you look down the hill (towards Azmak-to the east) one can clearly see the trenches but it looks strange to me because they are nearly at the bottom of the reverse slope of a rather high "elevation" that runs down from the summit towards Azmak. (In other words from west to East). I know there was a "new" rule introducted in July to have trenches on the reverse slope -artillery- but this seems a bit too much. Thanks for any advice eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krithia Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 I have a trench map somewhere that shows the trenches in this area, from 'The Boot' in the north, up over Kiretch tepe at Jephsons and down again onto the Suvla plain. Give me a little time to find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 I may be off the mark here but, I have studied the final advance made along the ridge (10th Irish Div & 162 Bgde of the 54th Div) 15 August 1915. It may be that they didnt get to the top basically. The Bedfords made the farthest progress during the battle (Kidney Hill, on the Eastern flank of the advance), yet were withdrawn to "straighten out the line" 16th / 17th August, as the commanders felt that no further headway could be made. Hence, I wander if that was the proverbial "tide mark" of their progress basically? As I said, not an expert in the tactics of that area but praps thats why? If its not too cheky to ask, would you happen to have any pics of Kidney Hill / Green Hill / the area that you wouldnt mind sharing with me? Havent been to Gallipoli so far, so havent seen it with my own eyes. Scuse me asking, but you dont know unless you do, do you?!!! Cheers Eric Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ypres1418 Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 Steve I have a picture of the cemetery and the ground in front of it from the gate will gladly send an e-mail of them to if you want. e-mail me with your address, mandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 Steve I have a picture of the cemetery and the ground in front of it from the gate will gladly send an e-mail of them to if you want. e-mail me with your address, mandy <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks Mandy, will pm it to ya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Plummed Goose Posted 6 June , 2005 Author Share Posted 6 June , 2005 Dear Steve, Please find attached a picture of the front taken near Jephson's Post, looking down to Azmak (taken to South-East). On this pictures you cannot see the "elevation" I mentioned which is left of the picture. eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 6 June , 2005 Share Posted 6 June , 2005 Thanks very much Eric. So, the flat plain below must have been where they formed up & started their advance? No wonder they got ripped to shreds by artillery ... Much appreciated Eric, thanks again Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Plummed Goose Posted 10 June , 2005 Author Share Posted 10 June , 2005 Dear Steve, I am further exploring Kireçtepe and I now realise I have reacted to quickly. The picture I posted are the TURKISH trenches ... Forgive me but when making my way up from Azmak through these trenches I found at 2 different locations rumjar pieces which for me was a "proove". Now I realise that I was wrong ... The picture is NOT taken from J-Post !! But still shows the Turkish trenches eric PS : Steve would you be interested to have a closer look at this together. You with your reseach, I with the field experience. If yes send me as much as possible written info and we'll build up a data and photobase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 PS : Steve would you be interested to have a closer look at this together. You with your reseach, I with the field experience. If yes send me as much as possible written info and we'll build up a data and photobase. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Absolutely Eric. I have only looked at the Bedfords part in the action in detail as my GG was there & managed to survive that one, but others on forum have also researched the 10th irish as I understand it, so have prob looked into their part in it. There are also people here with relatives in the London Btns in the 162nd from memory (the Northants hadnt landed by 15th August so "missed this one" - lucky them) ... Do you have a particular interest in the ridge, for you to ask about it? What unit etc are you exploring? Will keep an eye out for special notes on them as I go through. Will put together what I have over the weekend & mail ot to you if you like? Mail me (stevefuller7@yahoo.co.uk) & will know where to send it!! Cheers for now Eric, speak again soon Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Eric & Steve, This is not a part of the battlefield which I know any too well And therefore I hesitate to get involved here [step forward that man who said that’s never stopped you before ] But I wonder if the following map & sketch may be of some sort of help to you The Map: Is clipped from that in the British O.H., Vol. II, facing page 459 and titled ‘Sketch No.32, The Evacuation of Suvla – Retirement of the rear parties, night 19th/20th Dec’ For Steve; please see that ‘Green Knoll’ is on the N extremity of our line while ‘Green Hill’ lies at the S of the Suvla sector, between Scimitar Hill [in the E] and Chocolate Hill [in the W]. Sorry Steve, but it was not clear to me, to which you were referring Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 (edited) The Sketch: It and its gazetteer appear as Chapter XXIX in “With a B-P Scout in Gallipoli” by E. Y. Priestman. The book is in fact a collection of letters, verses, sketches, etc by Edmund Yerbury Priestman who was KiA on the night of 18th-19th Nov 1915, aged 25 years. He was serving with the 6th (Service) Batt. the York and Lancaster Regiment The sketch is dated 28th Sept 1915 and per Ray Westlake’s ‘British Regiments at Gallipoli’ the battalion’s September was served thus: “Relieved by 8th Northumberland Fusiliers and to rest camp (4th Sept). Began fatigues at ‘A’ Beach 9%th Sept). To right section Jephson’s Post (11th Sept). Relieved by 9th West Yorkshire (23rd Sept). and to support jug outs at Karakol Dagh. Moved to reserve are Karakol Dagh (30th). Best regards Michael D.R. If I'm not mistaken its not far off matching Eric's earlier photograph Edited 11 June , 2005 by michaeldr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Thats brill Michael, thanks mate!! The area was probably Green Knoll, youre right. My apologies to eric too, as I too made an error. I have seen it suggested that Green Knoll was the first objective taken with relatively light casualties, although dont think Ive seen any official documents to confirm. Thing is, that according to the sketch, its too far north for the bedfords to have passed over it, so I wander if it was Jephsons post or a similar area? If I understand it correctly, didnt they name many of the areas AFTER the war, to give them a reference point for the actions that happened in 1915? Maybe thats why Green Knoll isnt formally identified by the Bedfords? So, after all that bloodshed, Kidney Hill ws relinquished? Ill bet they were happy about that? Fitting really, considering the campaign as a whole ... Once again, thanks Michael, really heplful mate & please dont let it stop you from suggesting anything else!!! I wont say anything, promise!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Is this any use? (From the O.H.) Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Cor, is it ever michael!!!! More detailed than anything I have at the moment i must say! Exremely rude to ask, but would the OH have the same for the Sandbag Ridge area too at all? Across to Taylors Hollow would be perfect if possible? That would cover the ground that the bedfords held whilst in the trenches for the rest of their tour in Gallipoli AND their departure point. Thanks for all your efforts Michael, its appreciated no end! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Cor, is it ever michael!!!! More detailed than anything I have at the moment i must say! ... ...Thanks for all your efforts Michael, its appreciated no end! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Please don't call me "Michael"! dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Plummed Goose Posted 11 June , 2005 Author Share Posted 11 June , 2005 gentlemen ... and ladies ... You have given me a reason to go back on "top of the hill" ... I'll "report" within a weeks time eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Exremely rude to ask, but would the OH have the same for the Sandbag Ridge area too at all? Across to Taylors Hollow would be perfect if possible? That would cover the ground that the bedfords held whilst in the trenches for the rest of their tour in Gallipoli AND their departure point. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not too sure of the locations of the places you mention, but I assume this section of the map covers it? (If it doesn't, don't worry, I've got the whole Gallipoli frontage covered in similar detail) Dave (PS. the date of this map is December 1915) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 11 June , 2005 Share Posted 11 June , 2005 Sorry Dave - blushing now. Got a name stuck in my head - extremely rude of me mate & I apologise. Once again, thank for your efforts - looks like the area to me, so will do very nicely. Cheers again!! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 12 June , 2005 Share Posted 12 June , 2005 Quote from Dave ; I've got the whole Gallipoli frontage covered in similar detail Dave, Are these maps of yours from the CD which is available from N & M? And do you recommend it? Thanks for any advice Michael D.R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 12 June , 2005 Share Posted 12 June , 2005 Michael, It looks like one of the maps from the CD (Suvla and Anzac - Opposing Trenches. Dec 1915). The CD's maps are excellent and allow you to zoom way in to see details. I'm not sure they're worth the price, but they are good maps, just not enough of them. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 12 June , 2005 Share Posted 12 June , 2005 Quote from Dave ; I've got the whole Gallipoli frontage covered in similar detail Are these maps of yours from the CD which is available from N & M? And do you recommend it? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The CD contains the same maps as these for a lot less than I paid for them. These are from the Gallipoli appendixes and maps volume (a "box" volume) of the British Official History. I'm considering buying the CD myself to be honest as, even though my set is in almost pristine condition, they won't last forever under a scanner/copier. I'd say that the CD is excellent value, especially seeing as it also contains the maps volumes for other O.H. "other theatres" which, to my knowledge, have never been re-printed. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 12 June , 2005 Share Posted 12 June , 2005 just not enough of them. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But doesn't the CD include all of the maps to be found in the map volumes of the OH? Not the CD's fault if there's not enough - surely that is down to the original compilers of the OH. (It's the maps in the N&MP/IWM's reprint of the actual OH books (the whole lot of them!) that let it down. The monochrome reprint lets them down somewhat, as do the scaled down "fold-outs" (also in B+W) which are relegated to 1 pagers) Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWills Posted 12 June , 2005 Share Posted 12 June , 2005 Some of the Battery Press/IWM reprints for other theatres include B&W reproductions of some of the maps - eg Italy, Mespot etc. Not always a full set, often reduced and in B&W. Overall the CD is worth it if you use the maps for reference. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 12 June , 2005 Share Posted 12 June , 2005 Battery Press/IWM <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Whoops! I got that one wrong! - I meant Battery Press/IWM reprints that are available from the N&MP !!!! The older, Shearer, reprints from the 70's and 80's(?) were far superior, with fold out maps and colour maps included. Did they ever reproduce the full set? Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 13 June , 2005 Share Posted 13 June , 2005 Dave, Mike & Martin, Many thanks for the input The help is really appreciated Saving pennies starts now Regards Michael D.R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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