Carina Brackett Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January I am the daughter of a WW1 veteran and am interested in learning how many of us there are alive. My father was in the Duke of Devonshire’s Regiment although he lived in Poplar, East London. When WW2 broke out he was too old to be enlisted and was an Air Raid Warden which is how he met my mother whose house was obliterated during the Blitz. Her husband was a Japanese Prisoner of War who never came home having died due to the appalling cruelty of the Japanese. My Dad was 56 when I was born having been born himself into the Victorian Era, he was an honourable man with values that sadly are a thing of the past. He passed away in 1980 and there are so many things I wish I had asked him about his time in The Great War, but I am proud to have been his daughter. I owe my existence to the fact that one man came back from a war and another did not. The sacrifices made were too great for us to imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) 11 minutes ago, Carina Brackett said: I am the daughter of a WW1 veteran and am interested in learning how many of us there are alive. My father was in the Duke of Devonshire’s Regiment although he lived in Poplar, East London. When WW2 broke out he was too old to be enlisted and was an Air Raid Warden which is how he met my mother whose house was obliterated during the Blitz. Her husband was a Japanese Prisoner of War who never came home having died due to the appalling cruelty of the Japanese. My Dad was 56 when I was born having been born himself into the Victorian Era, he was an honourable man with values that sadly are a thing of the past. He passed away in 1980 and there are so many things I wish I had asked him about his time in The Great War, but I am proud to have been his daughter. I owe my existence to the fact that one man came back from a war and another did not. The sacrifices made were too great for us to imagine. Welcome to GWF. Amazing! I can't answer your query about being a child of a GW veteran / how many ... but should you wish for the GWF 'hive mind' to look into your father's GW experience then you only have to post his name and what details you might have [military & genealogical can help] All the best. M Edited 27 January by Matlock1418 add Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chesterboy Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January What is your fathers name and are you sure of his regiment as there in no regiment by the name of Duke of Devonshire regiment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January My mother is the daughter of a WW1 veteran of the Manchester Regiment. She’s 96yrs old and showing no signs of either giving up or falling apart! My Dad was the son of an original Manchester Pal though unfortunately he no longer qualifies as sadly he passed away some 20 months ago. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gardenerbill Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January Not me, but my 93 year old Mum is the daughter of a WW1 veteran and she is still with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carina Brackett Posted 27 January Author Share Posted 27 January In reply to Chesterboy’s post, having looked at my Dad’s Certificate of Transfer to Reserve, his regiment was The Devonshire Regiment. Please see attached the certificate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) 33 minutes ago, Carina Brackett said: James Thomas SHAUGHNESSY Thanks for posting this - very handy, and important that you have shared it - I haven't found any other records for him so far [but admittedly I only have limited resources] Devonshire Regiment Duke of Cornwall's Light Infantry Labour Corps Might be indicative of a lower class of fitness thus ending up in the LC - that 94010 LC number rather seems to have been issued early in the LC, c. April/May 1917 [See: Starling & Lee - 'No Labour, No Battle' - a history of the LC]. - Yet still considered to be fit enough to be transferred to the Army Z Reserve after the war. Rather looks like he might have only served in the UK before the end of the war, as showing Nil Medals, and then overseas afterwards - but regardless to be commended for his service [finally clearing/salvaging from the battlefield it would seem]. M Edit: Hmm? There are two lots of Service Records for a James Thomas SHAUGHNESSY, DCLI [aged 18] showing up on Ancestry [presumably also at Find My Past] but I cannot access [also showing Anne Jane SHAUGHNESSY] = ??? If born 1898 and enlisting in 1916 then 18 would be about the right age = Hopefully another member(s) can access to have a look. Edited 27 January by Matlock1418 Edit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawhiri Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) 20 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said: Rather looks like he might have only served in the UK before the end of the war, as showing Nil Medals, and then overseas afterwards - but regardless to be commended for his service [finally clearing/salvaging from the battlefield it would seem]. He must have served in a theatre of war because he does have a medal index card showing service with both the Duke of Cornwell's Light Infantry and the Labour Corps, and entitlement to the British War and Victory Medals. No mention of the Devonshire Regiment. Can I ask when and where he was born, because there is a James Thomas Shaughnessy who was born in Poplar in 1899 who was also entitled to the Mercantile Marine ribbon and I'm just wondering if this is the same man. Image sourced from Ancestry: Edited 27 January by Tawhiri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) 16 minutes ago, Tawhiri said: He must have served in a theatre of war because he does have a medal index card showing service with both the Duke of Cornwell's Light Infantry and the Labour Corps, and entitlement to the British War and Victory Medals. No mention of the Devonshire Regiment As SHAUGNESSY That's interesting as he didn't show at WFA/Fold3 or TNA when I searched under 94010, SHAUGHNESSY [I gave up and didn't look at Ancestry! Edit: actually I did look and he didn't turn up, nor does he now ... neither under SHAUGHNESSY, nor SHAUGNESSY!!??] Can you see the SR I mentioned above? M Edited 27 January by Matlock1418 edit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawhiri Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) 7 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said: Can you see the SR I mentioned above? Unfortunately no, only the collections that are free to view. See above for my edit about a James Thomas Shaughnessy born in Poplar in 1899 who was also entitled to the Mercentile Marine ribbon. I'm wondering if this is the same man as well. https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D8091917 I think the associated medal index card is indicating that his British War Medal was awarded by the Army, which would mean he enlisted in the Army and served in a theatre of war at some point. Edited 27 January by Tawhiri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January 18 minutes ago, Tawhiri said: Can I ask when and where he was born, The Z.21 Transfer to Reserve document records, as SHAUGHNESSY, born 1898 M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) Birth ... Puzzling ... GRO have a birth registration that might just possibly be him as not massively different year [and no others thereabouts in E & W] - but Poplar is given as the Mother's Maiden Surname = ??? SHAUGHNESSY, JAMES THOMAS POPLAR GRO Reference: 1897 S Quarter in MILE END OLD TOWN Volume 01C Page 458 Might perhaps be an Irish birth with that surname ??? [My apologies if I seem to be stereotyping] - unfortunately https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en is down for maintenance tonight M Edited 27 January by Matlock1418 irish genealogy link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawhiri Posted 27 January Share Posted 27 January (edited) 3 hours ago, Carina Brackett said: My father was in the Duke of Devonshire’s Regiment although he lived in Poplar, East London. Given the above statement in the OP's opening post, I think we are circling around the same man. It looks as though he had possible service on a ship in some capacity during WW1, before enlisting in the British Army or being conscripted once he turned 18 late in the war. It does rather look as though he has a surviving service record, or at least parts of one based on what I can see on Ancestry and as noted by Matlock1418 above. The search results are showing his next of kin as Anne Jane Shaughnessy, and this is consistent with his mother's name recorded in both the 1901 and 1911 England and Wales censuses. 1901 census - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X94P-QBW 1911 census - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWP8-DM3 From the census details, his father was born in Ireland, but his mother and all the children were London born and bred. Edited 27 January by Tawhiri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carina Brackett Posted 27 January Author Share Posted 27 January Thank you everyone for giving me so much information, it’s quite overwhelming! My grandmother was Anne Shaughnessy and my Dad was born on 24/07/1898. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January (edited) 6 hours ago, Matlock1418 said: Rather looks like he might have only served in the UK before the end of the war, as showing Nil Medals, Image thanks to Ancestry The MIC also posted earlier by Tawhiri [under SHAUGNESSY rather than SHAUGHNESSY] suggests he did get medals so my original interpretation from the Z.21 Transfer Certificate was incorrect and that the Z.21 'Nil' therefore would seem to be referring only to his final time with No.3, Salvage Section, Labour Corps. Under which spelling of his surname I can only guess ... though the MIC, which was issued to the Medal Office factory, rather suggests likely his medals were impressed/stamped & issued as as SHAUGNESSY on the rims [and there is no suggestion there of a return for correction and no sign of non-delivery either] ... I was was going to suggest looking at the associated LC Medal Roll [since they recorded for issue his medals] for more details on the DCLI but I think the LC were not particularly good at recording other unit(s)'s details at a lower level. Others may be able to assist with determining the MR details. Russ has provided a Service Record abstract anyway [You really do need to try and get a full look at the SR] I don't know the availability of such documents for Poplar but Absent Voters Lists for 1918 and 1919 may offer his 'home' address(es) then, and hopefully his LC unit, perhaps to match what Russ has uncovered from his Service Record. Other members may perhaps be able to help with this/these AVL. The 1921 Census [taken during the official war period ending 31 August 1921] would likely also offer his address then - available via Find My Past - might this be him?? https://www.findmypast.co.uk/search/results?firstname=james&firstname_variants=true&lastname=shaughnessy&keywordsplace=poplar%2c (london%2c middlesex)%2c england&keywordsplace_proximity=5&datasetname=1921 census of england %26 wales&sid=21 First name(s) Last name Birth year Birth place Parish Registration district County James Shaughnessy 1897 Bromley by Bow, London, England Poplar Borough Poplar London, Middlesex Or am I looking at the wrong man? [again?] The 1939 Register is a bit out of period but is quite likely to be of interest to you and will have his date of birth amongst other details [My veteran GF was an ARP warden then and is recorded as such on the Register]. As we are going 'off piste' so as to not upset the GWF moderators any more than I have done [which hopefully will only be slightly at the moment!] to further discuss WW2 you could try WW2Talk https://ww2talk.com/index.php?categories/main-ww2-talk-forum.157 All the best M Edited 28 January by Matlock1418 typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barbara Fruth Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January Carina, I was wondering the same thing, which is why I joined the forum. My dad was Pvt. 1st Class Frank Lees of Findleyville, Pennsylvania, USA, who joined the USMC Aug. 7, 1917. He served in the 4th Brigade 2nd Division of the AEF, & was in combat at Verdun, Chateau Thierry, & in the Belleau Wood. He was wounded in the Wood. I think he was one of those ordered to take it, "At any cost," & ran through a wheat field toward the Germans who were entrenched among the trees with their mortars & machine guns. It cost him most of his left leg. Two machine gun bullets went through flesh below his knee, & he kept on going, but the 3rd bullet broke his leg. An ambulance took him into Paris where his leg was amputated, more than once to stop the gangrene. By that time he was left with 1/2 a thigh. Born Jan. 31, 1894, he had been a coal miner before enlisting. There was no going back into the mine with a heavy wooden prosthesis, so he used the GI Bill passed after the war to go to business college. I think he considered it almost a fair trade - a leg for a new, above ground career. ( He had an 8th-grade education. Plenty for the time.) He had a number of jobs, longest with the post office, best & last as Manager of Ad Servicing for the Pittsburgh Sun Telegraph. I am his only child, born when he was 54. He died Feb. 12th, 1974 shortly after his 80th birthday. Do you have any pictures/memorabilia of your dad's service? A few months ago, I finally finished putting what I have in a couple of albums that will go to a big WWI museum in Kansas City, Missouri when I die. Do you know how many of us there are - the increasingly elderly children of WWI vets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January 6 hours ago, Tawhiri said: there is a James Thomas Shaughnessy who was born in Poplar in 1899 who was also entitled to the Mercantile Marine ribbon and I'm just wondering if this is the same man. 5 hours ago, RussT said: He had seen service in the Mercantile Marine Image thanks to TNA Address seems to be 194 St Leonard's Rd, Poplar E14 - I wonder if this matches or links to his Army SR?? M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Atkins Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January Can’t add anything to the excellent research on this thread, but re your original request Carina: my father, aged 94, is also the son of a man who served in WW1. John Atkins served 1906-27, and again 1939-40; he was an Old Contemptible who in all probability owed his life to being made PoW early in the war (though he did not enjoy the experience, obviously). He died in 1951, aged 63. You’re a member of a rather exclusive club! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Strawbridge Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January 15 hours ago, Carina Brackett said: I am the daughter of a WW1 veteran and am interested in learning how many of us there are alive. My 99 year-old father (still alive) told me once that he met someone who fought in the Crimean War (1853 - 1856). Seems impossible but true. My father was born and brought up on a farm in Devon. When he was very young tramps were commonplace. Although homeless, they had a "circuit" where they would come back around the same route and see the same people maybe six/twelve months later. His mother used to provide bread and cheese and they would sit on the outside step to eat it then move on. One old boy was a regular visitor and he must have been approaching 90 years of age. He said that he had fought in the Crimea and there was no reason to disbelieve him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January 9 hours ago, Matlock1418 said: I don't know the availability of such documents for Poplar but Absent Voters Lists for 1918 and 1919 may offer his 'home' address(es) Tower Hamlets have a part list for 1920 only, and a quick search for surname 'SHAUG*' shows nothing. https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61320/ 9 hours ago, Matlock1418 said: I was was going to suggest looking at the associated LC Medal Roll [since they recorded for issue his medals] for more details on the DCLI but I think the LC were not particularly good at recording other unit(s)'s details at a lower level. Quite right. Nothing more than ' 34317 Pte. D. of Corn.L.I. ' As mentioned upthread, all the men in this Labour Corps number sequence were transferred from the DCLI. https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/4230237:5119?tid=&pid=&queryId=50ea5d0e-02e2-4ba7-8bd2-4579d76dd1cc&_phsrc=bDw1707&_phstart=successSource Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January (edited) Hs attestation papers on Ancestry begin here, under the number 34317 (DCLI). A few pages in, on the copy form, the number is 41625.(Devonshire) It looks as though the pages are out of order.He was in the Devons first 29/9/1916, and transferred to DCLI on 9/11/1916 https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/1761199:1219?tid=&pid=&queryId=33523cc0-e5dd-47f3-9408-232442a48b14&_phsrc=bDw1708&_phstart=successSource Edited 28 January by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williywonker Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January My maiden aunt is 108 years old and the daughter of an RFC veteran. She was the twin sister of my father who sadly passed away at the age of 95. Mal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January 9 hours ago, Barbara Fruth said: Carina, I was wondering the same thing, which is why I joined the forum. My dad was Pvt. 1st Class Frank Lees of Findleyville, Pennsylvania, USA, who joined the USMC Aug. 7, 1917. He served in the 4th Brigade 2nd Division of the AEF, & was in combat at Verdun, Chateau Thierry, & in the Belleau Wood. He was wounded in the Wood. I think he was one of those ordered to take it, "At any cost," & ran through a wheat field toward the Germans who were entrenched among the trees with their mortars & machine guns. It cost him most of his left leg. Two machine gun bullets went through flesh below his knee, & he kept on going, but the 3rd bullet broke his leg. An ambulance took him into Paris where his leg was amputated, more than once to stop the gangrene. By that time he was left with 1/2 a thigh. Born Jan. 31, 1894, he had been a coal miner before enlisting. There was no going back into the mine with a heavy wooden prosthesis, so he used the GI Bill passed after the war to go to business college. I think he considered it almost a fair trade - a leg for a new, above ground career. ( He had an 8th-grade education. Plenty for the time.) He had a number of jobs, longest with the post office, best & last as Manager of Ad Servicing for the Pittsburgh Sun Telegraph. I am his only child, born when he was 54. He died Feb. 12th, 1974 shortly after his 80th birthday. Do you have any pictures/memorabilia of your dad's service? A few months ago, I finally finished putting what I have in a couple of albums that will go to a big WWI museum in Kansas City, Missouri when I die. Do you know how many of us there are - the increasingly elderly children of WWI vets? Barbara, Welcome to GWF and for your interesting post about your father in Carina's thread - appreciated. Glad he made the best of things. No worries about your post, but ... Should you wish to tap GWF for any more possible info about your dad [though it seems you have a lot to hand] then please start a new thread in his name [and add the above too] since it makes it so much easier and less confusing if we try to have one man per thread. [Links can always be added to link related men/threads. All the best. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January To get the order of things 1897 Jul 28 Born Poplar (not 1898 as in OP info). it is 1897 in 1939 reg and death record 1900 Oct 29 admitted tol Marner Road School birth as 27 Jul 1897 1911 census living at St Leonards Road, with his widowed mother and siblings 1915 MAr (circa) served in Mercatile Marine with Natal line 1916 May 16 Attested to Devonshire Regt. 194 St Leonards Rd, Poplar 1916 May 16 Applied for temp exemption from one more voyage 1916 Sep 29 Mobilised to Devonshire Regt as # 41625 1916 Nov 9 Transfer to DCLI as #34317 in 13th (Works) Batn 1916 Nov 10 posted to France 1917 May 9 Transfer Labour Corps as #94010 1919 Jun 3 Discharged 1939 Register He is a shopkeeper living in Stepney with his wife 1980 Aug 21 died Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 28 January Share Posted 28 January 1 minute ago, williywonker said: My maiden aunt is 108 years old and the daughter of an RFC veteran. She was the twin sister of my father who sadly passed away at the age of 95. More amazing info. There's no obligation to cite your grandfather's name but it may be of interest. If you have not already done so ... Should you wish to try for more info on your grandfather then, as suggested, please start a new thread. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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