HMS Dreel Castle, Falmouth

[nickynoo65]

Good evening. I have finally found my great grandfathers name after DNA and a paper trail. During WW1 he was in Falmouth on the HMS Dreel Castle with Lizette in brackets.

 I wonder if anyone more knowledgeable can give anymore info please. For instance, was it an actual ship or more of a base. 

Thanks 

 

 

[KizmeRD]

DREEL CASTLE was the name of the auxiliary patrol base established at Falmouth to which a large number of auxiliary patrol craft were attached. The ship he actually served on is the one named in brackets. (Possibly HMD Lizzie Flett?)

Perhaps if you care to name your GGF and provide whatever other info you have (e.g. date & place of birth, rank, service no.) we might be able to tell you at lot more.

MB

[nickynoo65]

Thank you so much, that would be amazing. 

 His name was Matthew Ernest Guest, born 1884, (although it says 1886 on the document I found with his service number,) in Barrow-in-Furness.  MB1512 RNVR Division. He appears to have served on several ships. 

I don't know much else as like I said, I've only just discovered who he was. 

Thanks for any more information you can give me. 

Nicky 

[horatio2]

He served as a Chief Motor Mechanic RNVR. The "LIZETTE" entry in his ADM 337 RNVR record is probably a clerical error for LISETTE.  - 

LISETTE, hired yacht. Built 1873, 116grt. Armament: 3-6pdr. Q-ship 4.6.16-26.6.18, also known as HESTER.

In his "Q Ships and their Story" Chatterton notes: "Even a private yacht was taken up for this work in June [1917]. This was the 115-ton topsail schooner LISETTE, which had formerly belonged to the Duke of Sutherland. She had been built as far back as 1873 with a standing bowsprit and jibboom. She was taken from Cowes to Falnouth, where she was commissioned in August and armed with 6-pounders. But this old yacht was found to leak so much through her seams, and her construction was so light, that she was never a success, and was paid off the following spring [1918]."

The above narrative ties in with your GGF's 'LIZETTE' dates recorded as 18 August 1917 to 7 May 1918.

@KizmeRD suggested the drifter LIZZIE FLETT but she was never based at Falmouth.

Edited 26 April , 2023 by horatio2

[horatio2]

HMS HERMIONE, in which your GGF spent much of his service, was an old cruiser which was based at Southampton where she acted as the depot ship for boats of the Motor Boat Reserve.

[nickynoo65]

43 minutes ago, horatio2 said:

HMS HERMIONE, in which your GGF spent much of his service, was an old cruiser which was based at Southampton where she acted as the depot ship for boats of the Motor Boat Reserve.

Thank you so much for all the info. Him serving on HMS HERMIONE which was based in Southampton, ties him with him marrying his wife there in late 1918. She was a Falmouth girl. By this time he had already made my great gran pregnant as my gran was born in November 1918. He most probably never knew. My great gran was working in Falmouth at the time . 

  I had never known the name of him and by using DNA, the Leeds method and building out several trees, I finally found the surname. It was then trying to figure out who was in and around Cornwall at the time was my gran was conceived. 

 Thank you again.  

[KizmeRD]

Were you aware that he was from Manitoba, Canada?

MB

[nickynoo65]

1 minute ago, KizmeRD said:

Were you aware that he was from Manitoba, Canada?

MB

He was born in Barrow-in-Furness but moved to Manitiba and died there in 1972. 

[JanaB]

Came across this entry looking for Dreel Castle and thought it was worth a shot in case someone could help. Researching my daughter-in-laws Great Great Grandfather and hit a brick wall until I found his service papers on National Archives, very hard to read but it did give me parents unknown which explains why I couldn't find him but did give me date of birth 14/02/1882 and addresses, but still couldn't find a marriage! His name is George Day DA517, joined the merchant on the 8th August 1914 in Grimsby. I can work out that he was with Dreel Castle 11/10/1916, Victoria 1 and 2, Halcyon and Halcyon 2. HM Ganton, Pembrooke, Lingfield and can't work out the rest.

[kenf48]

@JanaB Welcome to the GWF

@horatio2 and @KizmeRD are active members of the forum and my tag should alert them to your post which has been approved.

[KizmeRD]

Welcome to the forum - your man served as a Second Hand in the Royal Naval Reserve (Trawler Section) right from the beginning of the war through to the very end, and a wee bit beyond (mine clearance service). He was station at various places on various small auxiliaries and was even awarded a medal for services in North Russia. h2 will be along soon with full chapter and verse I am sure, so I won’t anything more until you see his expert analysis, and perhaps you will then have some further questions arising therefrom.

MB

[horatio2]

Yet another dreadful, low-res, digital scan by TNA.  I am afraid I can make out very little of the full details of his drafts.

2 hours ago, JanaB said:

joined the merchant on the 8th August 1914 in Grimsby.

Not exactly. This was the date on which he enrolled in the Royal Naval Reserve as a Deck Hand and Second Hand.

I think he served in the following boats: 

MANX PRINCE, hired trawler, Adty No 311. Built 1910, 220grt, Grimsby-reg GY.542. Armament: 1-6pdr. In service 8.14-1919 as minesweeper. She was based on HMS HALCYON the Lowestoft base.

GANTON, hired trawler, Admiralty No 1524. Built 1914, 330grt, Hull-reg H.110. Armament: 1-12pdr. In service 5.15-1919 as minesweeper. She was based on HMS BOMBARDIER in the White Sea. He was possibly awarded a "silver medal" by the Russians for this service.

ANN MELVILLE, hired trawler, Adty No 1596. Built 1909, 201grt, Aberdeen-reg A.254. Armament: 1-6pdr. In service 6.15-1919 as minesweeper.  She was based on HMS VITTORY at Portsmouth.

ANIMATE, hired drifter, Adty No 3076. Built 1917, 88grt, Yarmouth-reg YH.622. Armament: 1-6pdr. In service 12.17-1919. She was based at Holyhead from 15/12/17

.LINGFIELD, paddle minesweeper, Ascot or Racecourse-class, ordered 9.15, based on design of successful hired paddle minesweeper GLEN USK, Adty No. 896, T.24 (9.18). Launched 29.4.16 Fleming & Ferguson. 810 tons, 245(oa), 235(pp)x29(58oa)x7ft. Diagonal Compound engines 1500ihp, 14.5kts. Armament: 2-6pdr, 2-2pdr. Served with Auxiliary Patrol, carried Fishery flag superior pendant. Based on HMS ATTENTIVE at Dover from where she took part in the Zeebrugge action. Later (1919) based on HMS MAIDSTONE at Devonport. LINGFIELD was very likely employed in the post-war Mine Clearance Service  during 1919.

Finally based in Chatham Barracks (HMS PEMBROKE) from where he was demobilised.

I regret that there may be some errors in the above listing. A very detailed record but very poorly scanned. For a better, full-colour, high-res scan you could approach the Fleet Air Arm Museum (National Museum of the Royal Navy), They hold the original RNR Record Card.

 

 

 

[horatio2]

I failed to mention that he appears to have been attached to the Falmouth base (HMS DREEL CASTLE) from October 1916. No boat is named for this period and ANNE MELVILLE was never based at Falmouth. He may have been temporarily (?) employed at Falmouth as a Spare Crew Second Hand. A bit of a puzzle.

[JanaB]

Thank you, much more than I had hoped for

He was awarded  a silver medal. any idea in what capacity he was working as?

[JanaB]

Sorry just read previous post! In 1920 he was in Swansea as a ship breaker but can find nothing more so this goes a long way to to explain some of his life.

[MerchantOldSalt]

1 hour ago, horatio2 said:

Yet another dreadful, low-res, digital scan by TNA.  I am afraid I can make out very little of the full details of his drafts.

 

Think I can see trawler SESOSTRIS 1998 GY 894 and drifter WHITE OAK 2101 FR558 Horatio2 what do you think?

Tony

[horatio2]

Good spot, Tony. I buy into the trawler-   SESOSTRIS, hired trawler, Adty No 1998. Built 1916, 293grt, Grimsby-reg GY.894. Armament: 1-12pdr, 1-3.5in BT. In service 5.16-1919 as minesweeper, then hydrophone vessel. She was based at Portsmouth (VICTORY II) from3/5/16 until 9/7/16 on which date she moved to Orkney. This is the same date on which our man was drafted out of SESOSTRIS to VICTORY II, en route to ANNE MELVILLE.

WHITE OAK was the nominal parent ship for drifters at Poole, Dorset ANIMATE has fitted-out there 15/12/17 to 17/2/18 before moving north to Holyhead. It looks as though our 2nd Hand was time-limited in ANIMATE and may have remined at the WHITE OAK Poole base for a few while after ANIMATE left for Holyhead. He was with that drifter from 2/12/17, when she entered service at Lowestoft (HALCYON).

 

Edited 4 April by horatio2

[MerchantOldSalt]

2 hours ago, JanaB said:

Sorry just read previous post! In 1920 he was in Swansea as a ship breaker but can find nothing more so this goes a long way to to explain some of his life.

Whilst outside the timescale for this forum, but may help in your continued search, he signs on the British Tanker Co.Ltd. BRITISH SCOUT on 17 Oct 1929 as an AB (Sailor) according to a CR1 Identity Card available from findmypast.  There is also a CR2 Card which doesn't really tell you anything else except confirms his Discharge Book No. R76157.  He gets a bit confused about the year of his birth but it is definitely him.  

Tony

 

Edited 4 April by MerchantOldSalt

[KizmeRD]

2 hours ago, JanaB said:

He was awarded  a silver medal. any idea in what capacity he was working as?

The German minelayer METEOR laid mines in the White Sea in the Spring of 1915 to interfere with British supplies being shipped to the Russian army (fighting on the side of the Allies). In response the Royal Navy sent a group of minesweeping trawlers to the White Sea (GRANTON being one of these) and they were engaged in minesweeping activities during the summer and autumn of 1915. 

2nd Hand Day received the Silver St. Anne Medal (for foreigners) in appreciation of what the British trawler crews did for the Russians.

MB

 

 

[KizmeRD]

Here ‘s what the medal would have looked like (to the best of my knowledge)…

Worn to the left of his British WW1 trio.

MB

[ForeignGong]

This is the Silver Medal of Zeal with St Anne Ribbon

[KizmeRD]

Thank you, I stand corrected.

MB

[JanaB]

Wow thank you, brilliant :))

[JanaB]

I am with Ancestry and can not find his Identity cards, not related I know but what was his birth date on the CR2 card, I am wondering if he didn't really know when he was born as his parents were not known

[MerchantOldSalt]

One just says 1883. The other 14.2.1885

Tony