The battlefields?

[armourersergeant]

this is probably a stupid question but please indulge me.

What is it that 'grabs' the visitor to the battlefield, is it the feeling of being there in some way sharing the experience or even contemplating the horror, or perhaps the strategic value to understand what the men went through and how it happened?

I realise this does sound a bit strange but i am wondering why many people travel to these places and what they get out of it

I have never been to a WW1 battlefield but i guess when ( dont tell the wife she doesnt know it yet) i do, it will be to get an appreciation of what the men did and what the generals had to try to contend with.

Please post with what you have got out of it and if the first time you went did you get something you did not expect?

Arm.

[Staffsyeoman]

To try and explain....

Seeing that this tranquil, 'undisturbed' farmland -which much of it still is - which looks so peaceful, beautiful - holds stories of so much horror we can hardly comprehend, however well schooled, read or trained we are. Even as one trained to 'appreciate' ground, and trained in 'mobile' warfare - to see the actual distances involved as objectives is breathtaking.

I could go on....

[Neil Mackenzie]

For me seeing the 'lie of the land' gives you a better appreciation of the difficulties the Allies often faced. Especially, in the Salient where just a few yards height advantage was so important. I personally did not realise what a difference this could make until I went there.

I think it also makes a big difference if you go with an experienced guide like Paul Reed or Clive Harris as they can bring the thing to life with the personal stories they have gleaned from veterans/research etc. If you go on your own without having done at least some research beforehand all you will see are a load of fields.

Neil

[Ralph J. Whitehead]

I have made two trips to Flanders and the Somme and in between. I found that just reading about the war does not provide the personal experience of standing where the soldiers fought. It also does give you a much better understanding of why certain points were fought over so often. I stood along the German lines near Thiepval for instance and saw how the Ulstermen and 32nd Division men had to come literally uphill against points that dominated the entire area.

Stand at the Leipzig Redoubt on Hill 141 and see how this point overlooked everything to the west, south and north. The quiet fields are a strange sight considering what happened so many years back and just a quick scan of the area with the rifle casings, bullets, shrapnel and shell splinters, etc. vividly demonstrate the effect of the war some 87 years later.

You will understand more once you have visited the areas.

Ralph

[garyem1]

I was in ypres back in the cold month of febuary 2003 with my wife (she was not amused) visiting war graves.

My first time abroad and I want to spend three days walking around graveyards (have I gone mad she thinks) No I have not, at the age of 46 I know that if it was not for the men of the first and second world war I would not have enjoyed the last 46 years of my life in peace. And so I owe these men. And the thing for me is these men never came home, so its up to us to go and see them. Hope this makes some sence.

garyem1

[armourersergeant]

Gary,

YES.

Arm.

[Tim Birch]

We took our cycles with us the first time we visited the Somme. The overriding first impression was just how hilly it was, and how much the German defences overlooked the British lines. Until then I had not fully appreciated the problems facing the British in having to attack uphill in the majority of sectors.

In a few places the attack was initially downhill on horribly exposed slopes. Seeing the Tara Usna Hills from the Lochnagar mine crater emphasised how exposed the Tyneside Scottish and Tyneside Irish were as they advanced downhill from their start point well behind the British front. Similarly you need to see the trenches at Beaumont Hamel to really understand why the Newfoundlanders were so exposed when they left the support trench to reach their own front line.

On a later visit to the Aubers/Fromelles Ridge I looked out from it over the flat marshy land below which is the view the Germans had over the British lines. On seeing this it becomes obvious why this was such a black spot for deaths from German snipers, and why the Germans so successfully decimated the attempts by the British to attack their formidable line of concrete bunkers on and behind the crest, when setting out from the British marshy breastwork lines.

You can read all the books in the world, but as the others say, until you have seen the terrain it is virtually impossible to understand fully how and why various actions developed the way they did. Seeing the topograpy emphasises that trench warfare was not an equal struggle. For the majority of the front the Germans used geography to their advantage putting the British and French at a distinct disadvantage.

Tim

[ianw]

I find the contrast between then and now so extraordinary.

When you stand on one of these battlefields only an accident of time allows you to listen to the birds and the wind rather than shell and machine gun. The occasional find of a relic only serves to heighten that feeling of having just arrived late for a great event.

The cemeteries are great repositories of remembrance and memory . They sit like ever open reference libraries with their tragic story waiting for any passing reader. And , of course, they are often actually on the ground where the men fell - in no-mansland, on the trench lines , on the objectives captured.

We are so lucky in this time of cheap, comfortable travel to be able to make our pilgrimages at our ease. When we do so , let's remember those who could never come despite a daily yearning to do so .

[Mike Steele]

I would heartily agree with the sentiments expressed in the above postings. Being on the actual site of the battles gives you a 'contact' with that event that no book in the world could ever express.

To see the topography gives you a new perspective on what it could have been like, especially with some good quality research and a touch of imagination.

But much more than that, personally speaking, I find a strange connection being at a certain place knowing what took place there. Its very hard to describe but its almost a kind of spiritual or emotional bond.

I think an added factor is also the ability to visit the cemetaries. To pay your respects to the fallen and to have the scale of losses laid out in front of you in rows of headstones brings it all home to you.

In short, get out there, you won't regret it.

[Guest Ian Bowbrick]

Going to a place and standing near to where members of your family made the ultimate sacrifice at a very young age.

Ian

[Garde Grenadier]

That's what I felt too: standing on the burial-ground where people are resting whom I never had the chance to get to know. I could not ask them what it was like to go to war at the early age of 18 or 20, not having lived their life at all, then experiencing all the horrors, being wounded and going to die. I stood at the Chemin des Dames, where one my great-uncles fought, what a peaceful landscape, I could hardly understand that human beings could destroy that beauty to an extent which old photographs are showing. What a waste! The human sacrifice was the biggest waste. I do agree that going to these places gives you a contact or a touch of the events which no pictures, films or books can create.

The cemeteries should be kept at all cost, as a permanent reminder to each coming generation what war does cost regards lives of all nations.

Best wishes

Daniel

[gem22]

I've visited many areas of the Western front from the Belgian coast right down to Villers-Brettoneux and each trip gives me some new insight into how horrifying it must have been. There is a bunker on Hill 60 that gives a perfect view down a valley and you have to wonder at the courage of the men who dared to attack it. Stand on Vimy ridge and marvel at the achievements of the Canadian Corps. Walk into Mametz wood and see all the 'debris' of war lying there still, and tell me that a chill doesn't run through your bones.

The battlefields will give something different to all of us, but I can have nothing but admiration for the men who had the courage to stick it and fight it out

Garth

[Graham-McAdam]

Just walk through the Thiepval Memorial, round the graves on the other side and look at the view and you won't need anyone to put into words what its about.

[Guest Hill 60]

I had been reading books on the Great War for a few years, mainly those connected with the battle of the Somme in 1916.

In my minds-eye I tried to imagine the areas mentioned in the books but, even though the books had photographs, I could never quite get the 'feel' of the places.

When I took my first trip to the battlefields it was, naturally, to the Somme. To stand inside Delville Wood, on a warm afternoon in July, and read passages from those books brought the place 'to life'.

I am not a religeous man (except when the lottery is being drawn) but I felt an almost spiritual moment.

A trip to Ypres was equally spiritual. To stand on almost the exact spot where my great uncle was hit at Sanctuary Wood and then to go and stand by his grave on the Menin Road was overwhelming.

In November I plan to visit the exact spot my other great uncle's body was recovered in 1919 and then visit his 'new' grave.

So, a visit to the battlefield for me is the only way that I can truly understand the greater picture.

This probably doesn't make much sense, but it's hard to type when the ol' eyes are moist after thinking of my great uncles, both so far from home and family.

[Cynthia]

I don't want to repeat what has been said, only to say that I, too, had read extensively before my first visit, but never understood the bravery of these soldiers until I saw all that uphill terrain. Reading about it and then actually seeing it are really far different.

But how well I recall the trip down the motorway, seeing the names of the different places emerge on the signs. I think of them as battles and horrible places, but in reality, they are villages and places where people still live. The hair on my neck rose as I viewed them, almost feeling a spiritual communion with those who knew them also as killing places. We were listening to some songs from the era, but we became quiet and turned off the music and just contemplated where we were.

We first went to the area around the Thiepval Memorial, walking down from the Ulster Tower toward Connaught Cemetery. I did not say much, as my companions had visited before, but I was already overwhelmed by seeing so many white stones. When I walked through, touching each one as if I could touch each boy beneath, I began to cry -- softly at first, but by the time I reached the last row I was weeping outright.

I did not want to be a 'silly girl' in front of my male companions, but I could see that they were also moved and did not see my reaction as silly in any way. Thinking about that and then going to Thiepval and seeing the name of the boy I had researched and come to know as a vibrant human being was the culmination of the first day of my first trip. Even as I write this, I, too, am crying as I remember. The feelings I had then will be imprinted on my memory forever.

On the ferry back I thought, as ianw does, how lucky I am to be able to make this trip back to Blighty, and I held the memories of all of those who did not get to make the trip back in my heart. I promised them that I would never forget them, and that if it was in my power to bring them back with me, I would have. In some small way I think that is what we as Baker's Pals do -- bring them back with us by keeping their memories alive.

Cynthia

[john w.]

I cant add a great deal here except to say that on my last trip I did what some might call something perverse or at least strange.

In chasing across Belgium I was looking for places which according to Piet Chielens and Julian Putkowksis book Unquiet graves were the locations of executions that took place in the Salient. I have on video a number of rather sad locations where a soldier or soldiers were executed.

But that was not the perverse moment of my trip.... Like all said before the tranquility of the place and being in some isolated cemetry is mindblowing. I ended up at Poperinghe New military cemetery, where I believe there is the greatest concentration of executed soldiers buried. I sat by the grave of Herbert Morris and reflected on why a 17 year old Jamaican had come so far and had been shot for desertion... what a way to go....

I returmed to my car and actually dug out the trial papers for Herbert, and by his graveside I read through them again. There I was by his graveside reading the notes that ended with him resting where he is now.... a vain attempt to understand in just one case why. Why did he do it? It was an eerie feeling but I felt it had to be done. To the casual observer I must have appeared very strange, but it was what went on in my mind at the time that was important to me.

Just for the record I have been working on trying to find Herbert as regular Forum users will note, and have had some good response from Jamaica and may have some news soon

John

[Guest Steve Seaman]

I agree with everything already posted. To visit the battlefields is a must . I have visted countless battlefield cemetaries and each time I get a lump in my throat and all to often a tear in my eye when reading some of the comments in the book of rememberance.

Enjoy your visit you will not regret it.

Steve S

[KIRKY]

As per other writers it is a sense of overwhelming grief and sacrifice that draws me back.

It is so hard to believe what went on again and again in such a lovely area, I only really visit the Somme area and it always reminds me of rural Shropshire.

Like Cynthia I was moved to tears the first time I saw Thiepval and how so many soldiers could disappear in a few months over a small area. I have been going back for 4 years now and still well-up when visiting a cemetry

I am always amazed as to how much debris is also left and how it must have been at the time. Bomb after bomb.

I look up towards High Wood and wonder high they could move out of a trench and up towards that forest fortress without passing out!

We will never forget and my 12 year old Danny will not be able to forget he is already a part of the scene.

Tony

[Guest Nicholas Hemming]

Try getting 'off the beaten track' at Verdun. After the desolation and incomprehensible horror of that battle, Nature has returned to re-assert her rights. To sit amidst the returned beauty and peace makes me feel very reflective, but optimistic. Fleury, although busier, is particulary poignant. I don't think you can ever appreciate it fully without visiting - preferably alone.

[Charles Fair]

I would echo the points others have made. The only way to really start to understand what happened is to go there and walk the ground.

If you can can trace the footsteps of a relative then so much the better. I had no idea that my first visit to do just that in 1991 would have such a deep impact on me. To stand on the spot where my grandmothers first fiancee died at Contalmaison in July 1916, and later find his grave, was a profoundly moving moment - after all, if he had survived the war she would have married him in late 1916, instead of my grandfather whom she married in late 1917. It was at that moment that I realised that my very existence was the result of a seemingly random death on a battlefield 50 years before I was born. An upper-lipp wobbling moment indeed.

For a different perspective try the French battlefields. After trips to the Marne and Verdun I really began to appreciate what the war meant to France - why she had to defeat Germany, and why the terms of Versailles were so harsh. (See some articles I wrote when I lived in France are at Hellfire Corner http://www.fylde.demon.co.uk/charles.htm)

Go - you wont regret it.

[CROONAERT]

My "grab" actually came with a visit to some of the Battlefields of the Franco-Prussian war of 1870-71 (the forerunner of 1914?) many moons ago.Though I had visited the Salient as a small child in the '70s, it was these battlefields that brought home the human side (and the horror!).

Any visitors to Verdun, take a little detour (towards Metz) and stand in the lay-by near to Moscou farm (on the plateau above Gravelotte) and look around you. You'll see what I mean!

Battlefields of 3 (modernish) European wars over 75 years lie within the vicinity of where you're standing, scars of one on the monuments of another.Here, you can really feel the futility of it all.

As an afterthought, I'd like to pass on what the "custodian" of Bedford House cemetery said to me back in the early '80s : "Don't see the headstones.Imagine each stone in front of you is an actual person standing there" (or something along those lines).

Dave.

[uncle bill]

It's all about walking in the path of great deeds, the word pilgrimage comes to mind. I read a lot of personal accounts before I visited my first battlefield. Pulling off the busy motorway I stopped a little further on, there it was at last, the Somme. I can't put into words what I felt, strange I suppose. Later on in cemeteries I met some of the men I 'd read about, Hodgson in the Devon's resting place overlooking Mametz for example. In retrospect it all seems so normal now, despite my relative youth, my past that linked me to this place. Gran's talks about, how, as a young girl she saw the flashes of the offensives from the Kent coastline, the ambulance trains and relatives talking in hushed tones of a favourite cousin who would never come back.

The pull is still there, I'll never take the battlefields for granted despite numerous visits, the "grab" will always be there. It's a second home.

[Theo]

I vividly remember standing on the banks of the Ors Canal, where Wilfred Owen and the Manchesters attacked in the last week of the war. I re-read his last letter to his mother, talking about sitting in 'The smoky cellar of the forester's house' with his men before the battle, and was stunned at the thought of them trying to cross that small stretch of water whilst virtually looking down the barrels of the machine guns on the opposite bank. I then walked back to the memorial plaque erected by the WFA on the site and visited his grave. Although Owen is visited regularly, I thought of all the other ranks who died alongside him that day, whose graves do not attract the floral tributes and attention.

Just some thoughts

[Guest Hussar]

It's very difficult to explain the 'grab' as such. I imagine people have many

different reasons for visiting and, therefore, many different emotions.

Personally, I feel awe and great sadness . I remember, on my first visit to Ypres,

standing under the Menin Gate with tears rolling down my cheeks as I looked at

all the names.

[Guest lynsey1]

After reading many books about the first world war and trying to understand the whole thing,i agree with a lot of what has prieviously been said,i dont think i will fully understand what happened,the tragedy and the loss until i have stood on the ground where these events took place,i imagine its like making some kind of connection with the past and hopefully to gain some understanding of what it must have been like for all those brave men.Even though i have read about the battles that took place i find it hard to visualise the landscape and the impact this had.I am planning to go to the 85th anniversary of armistace in ypres,it will be my first visit but not hopefully my last,and i will be paying my respects to all the men who lost their lives and of course my great grandfather

lynsey