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Remembered Today:

21st Lancers Cecil 1916 long-shot anyone recognise this chap


arantxa
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1758360F-8BA6-4CD9-858E-25AD642FAFDA.jpeg

Edited by arantxa
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Your right itsCecil   Maybe that’s why I couldn’t find anything !!

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  • arantxa changed the title to 21st Lancers Cecil 1916 long-shot anyone recognise this chap

Such appalling copies of the photograph.  They look like snaps carelessly taken with a mobile phone by someone who wants information, but can’t be bothered to make the effort to provide a decent image.  Idleness on parade, as the sergeant major would say. 

Edited by FROGSMILE
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I was always taught at OTC that  usually there is a reason for things and to find that out first … 

 

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1 hour ago, arantxa said:

I was always taught at OTC that  usually there is a reason for things and to find that out first … 

 

To be fair, I think you know that you are genuinely wished well and when that response was first used by you some months back it was accepted.  I seem to recall that you were to use another family phone until such time as you obtained something better, and that you would take care to ensure that the images improved.  That was especially important given that images are your passion.  It hasn’t materialised and so forgive me, but even with the best will things have worn a bit thin.

Edited by FROGSMILE
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A possible name, Cecil C Lomax ,lieutenant 12th Lancers. Seem to be no other possibles, christian name Cecil,, WW1, 12 Lancers, in National Archives, Is the photograph of a lieutenant?

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I’m going to get a better picture but it may be a few days 

thanks for your help 

 

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Hi This is a bad photo as I’ve tried to enlarge from a bad photo it’s on the top of the frame 

but as said I will get a better picture it’s just to show the number I will post the better pictures when I can 

54C3F5A0-D48A-4F4E-B84B-772306A21E42.png

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So 21st Lancers arantxa. 

Thinking outside the box a little.......there is, perhaps, that old fashioned stuffy trait of referring to oneself by surname alone to consider .......... could we be looking at Lt Col R. E. Cecil DSO of 21st Lancers att 9th Lancers (14/15 Star, BWM, BVM and emblem)?

Sadly not.  Reginald Edward Cecil was at Omduman and this fellow has no associated ribbons.

No clues to his rank on the photo.  Clearly no DSO ribbon on this 1916 image but he didn't get that until 1918/19.  Initial root around shows he appears to have served on the General Staff. 

The plate below is from his rather smart Edwardian, 21st Lancers (Empress of India's) Lance Cap transit case.

R E Cecil.jpeg

Edited by TullochArd
Sadly not.  Reginald Edward Cecil was at Omduman and this fellow has no associated ribbons.
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When I put up a better photo it will show better his age …I guess he has cuff rank 

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Cecil Martin Keppel-Palmer went on to serve with the 17th/21st. No photos in any of the Regimental journals- the obit from the 1974 White Lancer & Vedette may explain why a clear photo not easily available. If you have access to the Times archive, there may be one in his obit.

 

 

Keppel-Palmer.jpg

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8 hours ago, Bordercollie said:

Possibly Cecil Martin Keppel-Palmer

That's a rather more credible suggestion than mine Bordercollie.  C.M. K-P had a brother Stuart Leslie K-P MC killed in 1918.  Here's his photo.  There is certainly a moustache resemblance for arantxa to start with.

S_L_K-P.jpg

Edited by TullochArd
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Yes that gives me a great jump off point

tnank you 

 

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12 hours ago, IRC Kevin said:

If you have access to the Times archive, there may be one in his obit.

Unfortunately not. It's the exact same obituary as you had already discovered.

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3667A4DE-7231-4B02-A1DB-7380EDE7D77D.jpeg.78acd8cb086fc149077605284e84c02f.jpeg

6271F03B-3437-4B21-9ECD-FB3F646CBA5A.jpeg

If this is the same chap I will have to look this up as I know nothing about this skirmish 

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13 minutes ago, arantxa said:

3667A4DE-7231-4B02-A1DB-7380EDE7D77D.jpeg.78acd8cb086fc149077605284e84c02f.jpeg

6271F03B-3437-4B21-9ECD-FB3F646CBA5A.jpeg

If this is the same chap I will have to look this up as I know nothing about this skirmish 

“In 1915 the Mohmand tribe declared a holy war or jihad against the British. The ‘Mohmand blockade’ began after a number of Mohmand raids into Peshawar, during which they sent large numbers of lashkars (In Mughal and Urdu culture the word is used to describe a "swarm like formation in any army") to attack British positions. The most important engagement occurred on 15 November 1916, at Hafiz Kor, when a Mohmand force was defeated. The Mohmand blockade was eventually lifted in July 1917 when the Mohmands finally submitted.“

22C3C872-3AA1-4EF5-9659-0C98AD363840.jpeg

26E8ADA8-CF07-47F0-BA75-DC603D54FB37.jpeg

0ED5E5FD-8880-4D57-A6E8-9EBDC746DC2A.jpeg

Edited by FROGSMILE
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Thats interesting because i didn't know anything about that

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15 hours ago, IRC Kevin said:

No photos in any of the Regimental journals- the obit from the 1974 White Lancer & Vedette may explain why a clear photo not easily available. If you have access to the Times archive, there may be one in his obit.

There's a ton of stuff on Trove for C. M. K-P as ADC in the 20's ranging from marriage, travel, tennis, lost dog ........ with several very poor pictures (but good references to original source). 

The best comparative image for the OP that I could find  is a 1923 one at 07 Apr 1923 - ENTHUSIASTIC SCENES MARKED THE DEPARTURE OF THE GOVERNOR OF VICTORIA (Lord Stradbroke) AND LADY STRADBROKE ON A VISIT TO ENGLAND. (The Narkunda sailed on March 31.) - Trove (nla.gov.au) 

That said, I'm still a long way to committing to this being the OP.

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48 minutes ago, TullochArd said:

That said, I'm still a long way to committing to this being the OP.

No, I wouldn't say so either.

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Thought the name rang a bell.
Might not help, but here is an image of CM Keppell-Palmer (to centre) lifted from a Sandhurst group photo I have (K Coy, December 1914).

48D947E2-EC5D-4212-B1FF-67C53D979C16.jpeg

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So the original photograph doesnt look like it is Cecil Martin Keppel-Palmer.  There was another Cecil serving in the 21st Lancers in 1916; Cecil Dove Horsley but he was commissioned in 1900 and presumably by 1916 he would have been in his mid-thirties and perhaps a little older than the man in the original photograph.  Harts Army list courtesy of Find My Past.

S2_US_MCV_ARMY_HARTSANNUALARMY1915LOND_0208.pdf

 

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15 hours ago, Bordercollie said:

So the original photograph doesnt look like it is Cecil Martin Keppel-Palmer.  There was another Cecil serving in the 21st Lancers in 1916; Cecil Dove Horsley but he was commissioned in 1900 and presumably by 1916 he would have been in his mid-thirties and perhaps a little older than the man in the original photograph.  

 

1.  Cecil Dove Horsley MC Croix de Guerre was born 19 November 1875 - see page 447:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Abx6EqTRfqEC&newbks=0&printsec=frontcover&pg=PA447&dq=Cecil+Dove+Horsley,+Cambridge+University+Alumni&hl=en&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false

2.  Photo here of Cecil's brother  - Wilfrid Palmer Horsley MC - born 18 April 1887 and KIA 02 July 1917 aged 30:

http://www.stanwardine.com/malvernww1/pdf/MalvROHHorsley_WP.pdf

JP

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