Machine Gun Corp

[Steve Roberts]

Looking for information on my grandfather Walter Percival Hughes machine gun corp I believe this his his army number 44965

thanks in advance 

Steve Roberts

[charlie962]

Welcome to the forum, Steve.

Why do you believe your GF's number was 44965?

Can you tell us his date of birth (or year) and where he was from, please.

Charlie

[Steve Roberts]

Hiya Charlie … I was browsing a record on another site and there is a Walter P Hughes listed with that army number it’s the letter P that caught my eye as he was from Herefordshire , Percival was his middle name and he was a corporal he survived the war and came home … I believe he is buried at Hay on Wye ?

Thanks for asking just need to see if I have the right man ?

Steve

[charlie962]

5 minutes ago, Steve Roberts said:

I was browsing a record on another site and there is a Walter P Hughes listed with that army number

Steve, the Medal Roll on Ancestry has his full name- It is indeed Walter Percival Hughes.

[Steve Roberts]

Charlie thanks very much for that , does it say where he is from ?  How do I access that information?

Steve

[charlie962]

1 minute ago, Steve Roberts said:

does it say where he is from

No

1 minute ago, Steve Roberts said:

 How do I access that information?

The Medal Roll is on Ancestry-a subscription site so I cannot give you a copy. But it doesn't tell us any more, except confirming that he started Private and finished Corporal. The fact that he was entitled only to British War and Victory Medals means he will not have gone overseas until after 1/1/1916. But to where and with which unit of the MGC I cannot say.

Charlie

[charlie962]

His number 44965 was probably issued in July 1916.

We don't know if Hughes volunteered or was conscripted. He could possibly have started with another unit in the UK but as he never served overseas with them it wouldn't appear on the Medal Roll or Medal index card.

Do you know his year of birth?

Charlie

[Steve Roberts]

Thanks again Charlie ,my mum must have been given misinformation as she believed he was in France , where would I need to look for his military record ? Does ancestry confirm is service number?

[charlie962]

4 minutes ago, Steve Roberts said:

hanks again Charlie ,my mum must have been given misinformation as she believed he was in France , where would I need to look for his military record ? Does ancestry confirm is service number?

You've misunderstood, Steve. He served overseas with the Machine Gun Corps because that is noted on the Medal Roll- under service number 44965. The point I was making was that the Medal Roll only records units with which he served overseas. So he could have started off in Uk with another outfit and transferred to MGC whilst still in UK. Quite possible.

I note the only Walter Percival Hughes that seems to come up in Herefordshire was born 5th jan 1897. Would this be him ? Wife Violet.

Charlie

[Steve Roberts]

Hiya Charlie not sure on his birth year my mum born in Tarrington Herefordshire in 1930, he may have been in the Herefordshire regiment or the Worcestershire regiment but that’s a guess ? 

[charlie962]

The Census returns for 1901 and 1911 show a Walter Percy Hughes living at Tarrington. Born c 1897, son of Frederick and Jane Hughes

[Steve Roberts]

Does it give the maiden name Curtis ? Violet maud ?

[Steve Roberts]

Or could be Beatrice? Sorry 

[charlie962]

There's a 1922 marriage Hereford of Walter P Hughes to Lily Beatrice Curtis

[Steve Roberts]

Thanks Very much for your help Charlie, I think Iam on the right path ? 

Steve

That’s it Charlie you r spot on 👍

[Steve Roberts]

Violet is a sister I believe 

[charlie962]

2 minutes ago, Steve Roberts said:

Violet is a sister I believe 

Ah- that will explain why the 1939 Register shows Walter and Violet but no Lily Beatrice. (Did Lily Beatrice die young?)  I suggest needs more work to confirm properly but looks like we are on the right track.

Signing off.

Charlie

[Steve Roberts]

Yes she did my grandfather went on and married again ,violet became my grandmother as she raised my mum after her sister died , my mum said her dad was the gardener at tarrington manor , but believes he died in the seventies and is buried at hay on why but it may be speculation ?

[Steve Roberts]

Thanks again ... great how much I have learnt by asking a question 

signing off 

Steve

[charlie962]

12 hours ago, Steve Roberts said:

Yes she did my grandfather went on and married again ,violet became my grandmother as she raised my mum after her sister died , my mum said her dad was the gardener at tarrington manor , but believes he died in the seventies and is buried at hay on why but it may be speculation ?

Steve, just recapping.

1. We have identified the correct family for the civilian side. Walter Percival Hughes of Tarrington, born 5/1/1897.

2.I presume the reference to his Military Service came from your mother, who knew he was in the Machine Gun Corps in France. On that basis there is only one Walter Percival Holmes in the MGC and that is 44965.

3. I have not found any Military record proving in the other direction that 44965 came from Tarrington or was born 1897 but maybe someone else can. It would be useful to have this extra confirmation.

 

I see from the General Record Office Index the death of Walter Percival Hughes was registered in the first quarter of 1981 in Brecknock, Breconshire. It quotes his birth date. I haven't seen a burials record.

Ancestry have a fairly detailed family tree for him but there are several obvious errors. For example whoever prepared that tree has attached a Naval Pension record that has nothing to do with him but relates to a welshman of the same name and age who died in 1915 whilst serving in the Navy! Again there is an error with the details of his railway service. The record has been transposed with that of a Harold Edmund Highes (who was Walter's brother) lower down on the source record. -ie ALL 'facts' NEED DOUBLE CHECKING BY YOU. Walter seems to have left the railway in Jan 1915 voluntarily, having just turned 18.

There is a photo of Walter's father Frederick, gamekeeper at Tarrington. You might want to contact the creator of that tree but you will have to subscribe to Ancestry. You could always try your local library who may be able to let you have access for free.

 

Walter P Hughes's marriage to Violet Sarah Hill Mellin was recorded in Ledbury in 1937.  Violet has same maiden name as Walter's mother. All very confusing.

Hope all this is of interest

Charlie

[Michelle Young]

Looks like @Steve Roberts has left the building, judging by his last post. 

[charlie962]

2 minutes ago, Michelle Young said:

Looks like @Steve Roberts has left the building, judging by his last post. 

he might come back on your prompt. I'd made the same statement last night!

Edited 20 October , 2021 by charlie962

[Steve Roberts]

1 hour ago, charlie962 said:

Steve, just recapping.

1. We have identified the correct family for the civilian side. Walter Percival Hughes of Tarrington, born 5/1/1897.

2.I presume the reference to his Military Service came from your mother, who knew he was in the Machine Gun Corps in France. On that basis there is only one Walter Percival Holmes in the MGC and that is 44965.

3. I have not found any Military record proving in the other direction that 44965 came from Tarrington or was born 1897 but maybe someone else can. It would be useful to have this extra confirmation.

 

I see from the General Record Office Index the death of Walter Percival Hughes was registered in the first quarter of 1981 in Brecknock, Breconshire. It quotes his birth date. I haven't seen a burials record.

Ancestry have a fairly detailed family tree for him but there are several obvious errors. For example whoever prepared that tree has attached a Naval Pension record that has nothing to do with him but relates to a welshman of the same name and age who died in 1915 whilst serving in the Navy! Again there is an error with the details of his railway service. The record has been transposed with that of a Harold Edmund Highes (who was Walter's brother) lower down on the source record. -ie ALL 'facts' NEED DOUBLE CHECKING BY YOU. Walter seems to have left the railway in Jan 1915 voluntarily, having just turned 18.

There is a photo of Walter's father Frederick, gamekeeper at Tarrington. You might want to contact the creator of that tree but you will have to subscribe to Ancestry. You could always try your local library who may be able to let you have access for free.

 

Walter P Hughes's marriage to Violet Sarah Hill Mellin was recorded in Ledbury in 1937.  Violet has same maiden name as Walter's mother. All very confusing.

Hope all this is of interest

Charlie

Hiya Charlie that’s great it’s definitely the right direction, and family thanks so much for your information very helpful 

Steve

[AndrewSid]

Looking at a previous thread its likely we can tie his joining date down  to the two or three days in late July 1916 as per below.  Understanding his MGC unit and thus his experience in France will require another clue.  

 

44556 - 25/07/1916

44938 - 26/07/1916

45348 - 28/07/1916

[charlie962]

27 minutes ago, AndrewSid said:

Looking at a previous thread

A thread i started and which has been added to successively by forum members to give an extremely helpful database and to which I referred when I gave the July 1916 date earlier. But as to tracking which unit ??

charlie