Christ's Hospital Rugby XV 1908-09 and a future Lt-Col F. E. Elliot - but who knows the others?

[Tawhiri]

This list might be helpful though in finding the remaining names. I've lost count of who we have found now. A list current as of July 1916 of all the staff and old boys serving in WW1.

https://www.chwarmemorial.org.uk/Filename.ashx?tableName=ta_referencematerials&columnName=filename&recordId=79&page=1&end=30

After this date, names are added in subsequent newsletters, but this issue seems to contain the last complete list of everybody who was serving at the time.

A.E. Bachelor might be the A.A.E. Batchelor who is serving with the Canadian army as a Quartermaster Sergeant, the years he attended the school certainly match the year of the photo.

Edited to add that this appears to be Alfred Albert Edward Batchelor, who was demobbed with the rank of Captain. His full Canadian service record can be found here:

https://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/military-heritage/first-world-war/personnel-records/Pages/item.aspx?IdNumber=28551

A quick look through his service record shows that he was wounded three times, awarded an MC and bar, as well as the Belgian Croix de Guerre.

He died in Victoria, BC, on 5 August 1980 at the age of 89.

Edited 21 September , 2021 by Tawhiri

[Mark1959]

Knight number 2.

See edits to my previous post on him. All fits

https://www.npg.org.uk/collections/search/person/mp142419/sir-john-humphrey-wise

Appintment to Indian Civil Service https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/28961/page/8904

To IARO https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29171/page/5017

Died 21/10/1984 aged 94. 

See also https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/180aeb54-2cc2-4e59-81c9-058e3b150366

 

Edited 20 September , 2021 by Mark1959

[Tawhiri]

Two One to go I think, H.M. Steven and F.L. Shaw. I can find mention of the promotion of an F.L. Shaw to the rank of Acting Captain in the Roll of Service for March 1919, but not having any joy tracing him before this in the school newsletters. A search of the medal rolls produces a Lieutenant F.L. Shaw serving with the Machine Gun Corps, which could be a possibility. H.M Steven seems to be a complete mystery however.

Edited 20 September , 2021 by Tawhiri

[Mark1959]

F L Shaw is found. See earlier posts. Frederic Lloyd Shaw.

[helpjpl]

21 hours ago, Kimberley John Lindsay said:

I will endeavour to find the relevant MC citations...

1.  Reuben Henry Gregory MC - I've just added the LG citation to my post of yesterday.

2.  Cyril Limmer Bryant MC - Link provided for LG citation yesterday.

3.  Douglas Laurel McCready Drew MC - 1919 Birthday Honours. According to wiki awarded For distinguished service in connection with military operations in France and Flanders— Temp Lt. Douglas Laurel McCready Drew, Royal Garrison Artillery.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1919_Birthday_Honours_(MC)

Scroll down to References for links to London Gazettes. He'll be in one of these (!)

4.  Alfred Albert Edward Batchelor MC+Bar, Croix de Guerre

a)  MC - King's 1918 Birthday Honours (Canadian Force):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1918_Birthday_Honours#Military_Cross_(MC)

b) Croix de Guerre

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31275/supplement/4522/data.pdf 

c)  Bar

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31583/supplement/12258/data.pdf

JP

 

Edited 20 September , 2021 by helpjpl
Alfred Albert Edward Batchelor

[Tawhiri]

Sorry about that, I'm losing track of everybody who has been found. Kimberley did pm me to point out that it was A.E. Bachelor, not A.A.E. Batchelor in the photo, although the latter was definitely at school contemporary with the others, from 1902 to 1908, so I'm not going to give up on him as being the A.E. Bachelor just yet. Certainly a search of the Christ's Hospital archives of The Blue doesn't produce mentions of a Bachelor in the right time frame, but there are several mentions of a Batchelor.

[Kimberley John Lindsay]

Dear All, and T.,

A. E. Bachelor (printed under the rugby group photo), should in fact have been A. A. E. Batchelor - as Tawhiri rightly pointed out (Sorry!).

Kindest regards,

Kim.

Edited 20 September , 2021 by Kimberley John Lindsay

[Tawhiri]

I think we're now down to two missing individuals, H.M. Steven and C.J. Davies. Looking through the Old Blues Roll of Service which lists all of those known to have served in WW1, I can find the following two individuals who would be contemporary with the date of the photograph, 1908-09, and who have names that are quite close, but not an exact match. These are:

• C.H. Davies, attended 1904-1909, served as a Second Lieutenant with the Household Cavalry, awarded the MC, and
• H.W. Stevens, attended 1904-1909, served in the Royal Air Force.

I can find an Royal Air Force officer's service record for a Harold Lawrence William Stevens, which I think looks like a distinct possibility for a match. Where it gets interesting is that we seem to have two choices for him, there is a Harold Lawrence William Stevens born on 25 October 1892 in Pyrford, Woking, Surrey, who seems to have ended up working as a mechanical engineer after WW1. We then have a second Harold Lawrence William Stevens born on 25 October 1894(!) in Chertsey, Surrey, who obtained a Royal Aero Club aviator's certificate on 19 February 1918, while serving as a Second Lieutenant with the 7th Battalion of the Royal West Surrey Regiment, who looks to be a better match for the H.W. Stevens who was serving in the Royal Air Force. This Harold Lawrence William Stevens died on 19 November 1993 in Ipswich, Suffolk, so he looks to have be the last surviving member of the team, if it is indeed him. There is also a medal index card for a Harold Lawrence William Stevens serving with the Army Service Corps and then the Royal West Surrey Regiment as a Second Lieutenant, with an initial date of entry into a theatre of war of 28 March 1915, with a full trio of 1915 Star, British War Medal and Victory Medal.

Think I have it sorted, the two Harold Lawrence William Stevens are the one and the same, because the only birth registration I can find is that for the Harold Lawrence William Stevens born in 1894, for some reason when registering as a mechanical engineer in the 1920's he has subtracted two years from his birth year to make himself two years older.

The question is does the man in the aviator's certificate photograph attached below look like an older version of the boy in the photograph posted by Kimberley.

Images sourced from Ancestry:

Edited 21 September , 2021 by Tawhiri

[Kimberley John Lindsay]

Dear Craig,

Brilliant!

Kindest regards,

Kim.

[helpjpl]

9 hours ago, Tawhiri said:

C.H. Davies, attended 1904-1909, served as a Second Lieutenant with the Household Cavalry, awarded the MC

And here he is:

Conrad Hugh Davies MC and OBE

1.  Photos from an extensive tree on ancestry. The first is 'cut' from a photo of No. 3 Company HM Household Battalion, Knightsbridge, 07 November 1916:

    

 

2.  BMD

Born: 02 August 1892. Born in Brazil according to the 1901 Census for a school in Pokesdown where he was a pupil.

Married:  Constance Rule Maudling in 1917

Died:  03 August 1976 in Surrey

 

3.  MIC (from ancestry):

 

4.  Gazetted:

a)  The Household Battalion

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29803/supplement/10399/data.pdf

b)  MC

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/30399/supplement/12318/data.pdf

c)  OBE - page 3482

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/33611/supplement/1

JP

 

Edited 21 September , 2021 by helpjpl

[Tawhiri]

In case anyone is interested, the link below is the full Roll of Honour and Service for Christ's Hospital for 1914-1919, listing all governors, staff, and old boys who were known to have served at the time the roll was compiled at Christmas 1920. For the old boys it helpfully lists the years that they were at the school, so it's very useful when trying to identify old boys appearing in a photograph with a known date.

https://www.chwarmemorial.org.uk/Filename.ashx?tableName=ta_referencematerials&columnName=filename&recordId=1

[Mark1959]

Sir John Humphrey Wise Obit

"Sir John Wise, KCMG, CBE, who died on October 21, aged 94, was with occasional exceptions at Delhi,,on the ICS cadre in Burma and he went right through the anxieties of the period of Japanese invasion and! the reconquest of the country by allied forces. John Humphrey Wise was born on *March 11, 1890, and educated at Christ's Hospital and University College,'Oxford. He joined the ICS and went out to Burma when the 1914-18 War had begun. Almost at once he joined the Indian Army Reserve of Officers and served with the 92nd Punjabis in India, Mesopotamia and Palestine. On several occasions he was mentioned in dispatches. Returning to Burma after leave he was Under Secretary to Government from 1921 to 1923. The following year he was at Delhi in,the,Health Department of the .Government of India. A subsequent appointment outside of Burma was the secretaryship of the Indian Public Service Commission. Wise returned to Burma in 1932 as Secretary of the Revenue Department. Five years later; he was transferred in the. same capacity to the Cormmerce and Industry Department. He was made CBE in 1939 and a few weeks before the outbreak of war in that year he was appointed Controller of Supplies. His cool, steadfast judgment and skill in administration. were of great value under wartime conditions and throughout the period he was Counsellor to the Governor, Sir Reginald Dorman-Smith. When' the Governor remained in war-stricken Rangpoon Wise was at Maymyo organising the evacuation of Government Departments and personnel from Upper Burma. When the civil government was transferred to Simla, Wise was placed in charge of the small secretariat. He was created KCMG in 1943. After the expulsion of the Japanese from Burma, Dorman-Smith returned to Rangoon accompanied by Wise, and continued his efforts to induce the Home Government to announce a date for Burma to attain self-government. In 1946 Wise was appointed an adviser to the Secretary of State for Burma, Lord Listowel, and continued in the office until January 1948 when Burma became a Republic and the Whitehall Office came to an end. In 1948 he headed a trade mission to Brazil which provi-ded for all payments between Brazil and the sterling area to continue to be settled in sterling at that time. From 1949 to 1953 Wise was deputy chairman of the Raw Cotton Commission in Manchester. He married in 1918 Edith Frances Anne, daughter of the Lieutenant-Colonel L. G. Fischer. They had a son and a daughter, now dead. His wife died in 1981. ; SIR J OH.NIN WISE. . Administration in colonial Burma"

Courtesy The Times 26/10/84

Edited 21 September , 2021 by Mark1959

[Kimberley John Lindsay]

Dear All, Craig, Mark, and help,

Many thanks for providing such impeccable research references!

It will be a chore, but the original caption of the  Rugby XV Boys can be suitably up-dated to include their decorations and their Fates: some shortlived, others full...

Kindest regards,

Kim.