Background marks on war index cards and pension cards

[danBww1]

thankyou. Everyone.

I have been a bit full on today, just had a day to work on it, rare I know. 

Will continue on trying to sharpen images and differentiate between layers and hopeful isolate individual stamps, there maybe something in this there may not. I would like to resolve this one way or another just for interests sake. 

 

Sorry got really distracted with this, back to the main topic 124605

any ideas what 3/MW/No.5484 means other ranks survived 

can some please advise what the crossed out number is.

I

[Matlock1418]

31 minutes ago, danBww1 said:

any ideas what 3/MW/No.5484 means other ranks survived 

Its a Ministry of Pensions claim reference [The WFA website has a number of informative articles on pension cards, including this matter - mostly by our forum member mentioned below] Edit: Survived and making a disability pension claim!

3 = Region 3 [North West England]

M = Military claim

W = Letter of surname [Wilkinson]

5484 = claim number in Region 3 [Edit: which would be right for Bolton]

31 minutes ago, danBww1 said:

can some please advise what the crossed out number is.

Which one?

Top image - It looks like another, previous, pension claim number to me [possibly a Chelsea Hospital one Edit: probably an earlier MoP variant??]

Lower image - It looks like a date Edit: looking at the whole card it appears to be a date that has been replaced, in red ink, by 21-10-19 - typical of date of discharge - this is confirmed by the start of pension date of 22-10-19

Forum member @ss002d6252really is the expert on these pension references - this mention should now get his attention.

:-) M

Edited 26 July , 2021 by Matlock1418
edits having looked at the whole pension index card

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

46 minutes ago, danBww1 said:

there maybe something in this there may not.

There isn't.

It is the Ancestry logo.

They appear on the Ancestry image of my grandfather's card, front & back (- although the back is one of the generic backs that Ancestry shows when the original card back was blank), and I can assure you he was never Mentioned in Despatches.

It doesn't appear on the National Archive image.

 

[ss002d6252]

1 hour ago, Matlock1418 said:

Top image - It looks like another, previous, pension claim number to me [possibly a Chelsea Hospital one Edit: probably an earlier MoP variant??]

Lower image - It looks like a date Edit: looking at the whole card it appears to be a date that has been replaced, in red ink, by 21-10-19 - typical of date of discharge - this is confirmed by the start of pension date of 22-10-19

Forum member @ss002d6252really is the expert on these pension references - this mention should now get his attention.

The SES reference is a pension issue office code rather than a pension reference.

Craig

[Matlock1418]

Just now, ss002d6252 said:

The SES reference is a pension issue office code rather than a pension reference.

Thanks for clarifying - knew you would know!

:-) M

[TEW]

A simple Google search for ancestry & leaf should resolve the issue if it hasn't been already. The other clue is that a leaf symbom is used by ancestry to denote a hint. Just logged in and a leaf is present top of screen (no hints for me).

The connection is down to family trees with its branches & roots, a leaf fits quite nicely in that framework and equally well as a watermark.

TEW

[PRC]

4 hours ago, danBww1 said:

I have suspect that my great grandfathers, card is not right for some time and have been picking round the edges of the great war for a couple of years.

Dan,

Personal opinion but I think you may be in danger of disappearing down a rabbit hole - these were cheap index cards produced in hundreds of thousands in various formats to assist the records office clerks keep track of a mans' entry in the various service medal rolls - there is no undiscovered Da Vinci code. Many of us have had cause to look at thousands of these things and they can sometimes tell a bit more than is obvious at first, but thats' through experience, not an image enhancing Enigma machine

I think it would better enable the forum to help you if you told us what you think was not "right" about your great, grandfathers card. I suspect you have the image enhancing side well under control.

As an aside 124608 James Grayston referred to above also only qualified for the British War Medal.

Cheers,
Peter

[kenf48]

21 hours ago, danBww1 said:

I have suspect that my great grandfathers, card is not right for some time and have been picking round the edges of the great war for a couple of years.

You may care to share your concern as to why the card 'is not right'.  The cards were an administrative tool created in the Medals Office as an index to the document of record which is the Medal Roll.  You are never going to find hidden meaning in the cards has as been said many times before.

Your great grandfather's war service reflects not only that of Gnr. Grayston as helpfully posted above but also Gnr Syd Tyrrell 130170 (8 Coy RGA).  Syd later wrote about his experience in the Great War.  He was twice rejected for service on medical grounds, including poor eyesight, he wrote had it not been for the war he would not have realised he needed glasses.

Eventually however he was called up for service on the 11th November 1916 and like Grayston, and others in this cohort whose records survive, graded Bi for fitness, that is unfit for front line service but able to withstand Garrison Duty abroad.  He was told by the examining doctor at Northampton, 'You're just the sort of chap we want'.  He was appointed a gunner in the RGA and two days later sent with a party of others to Rugeley Camp, "Then followed the dishing out of uniforms, a few drills and route marches;then home on ten days' overseas leave. Back to Rugeley to hard frost and snow, washing in rough shelters exposed to the elements, mercifully for a few days only.  Then boarding a train at night rattling through the hours of darkness to Devonport.  We embarked on a captured German boat, the Huntspill, and sailed through the Bay of Biscay to land at Gibraltar on the 6th December."

He then writes about his time in Gibraltar where he remained for the duration of the war.

"It was like going to another world.  At home there were short days and long nights, bitter cold weather and darkened lights everywhere.  At Gibraltar, lovely sunshine by day and at night a blaze of lights ashore with searchlights lighting up the sea for miles around.  There I spent the next two years; at the time it seemed like hard lines, but now looking back it takes the form of a very pleasant holiday in another land across the sea.'

He goes on to mention the hardship and rationing on the Home Front, and whilst he had relatives and friends who served and died in other theatres, including one who was awarded the MM he makes no further mention of the war.

Syd Tyrell, 'A Countryman's Tale'.

It seems your great grandfather was another who had a 'good war', and no amount of fiddling with the mics is likely to change that.  Together with his comrades he was awarded a British War Medal as he 'left his native shore' but did not enter a theatre of war.