Connaught Rangers In Lancashire

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Dear Forum Members

I am researching my family history and it looks like my Irish Grandfather served in the Connaught Rangers between 1914 and 1920.  However, on a record I have found on Ancestry it says that he was stationed in the North West of England and was in the Machine Gun Corps. He was awarded the British War Medal and Victory Medal.  What I would like to know is where and why the Connaught Rangers would be stationed in Lancashire?   

Thanks in advance if you can share any information.

[HERITAGE PLUS]

Maxine

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

None of the Connaught Rangers Battalions - there were six - were stationed in Lancashire.

 

See:  http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-british-infantry-regiments-of-1914-1918/connaught-rangers/

 

It would be helpful if you gave us his name, rank and service number(s together with any other details that you have about him, in order that we can help you further.

 

Dave

Edited 13 October , 2020 by HERITAGE PLUS
Typo correct

[FROGSMILE]

18 hours ago, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Dear Forum Members

I am researching my family history and it looks like my Irish Grandfather served in the Connaught Rangers between 1914 and 1920.  However, on a record I have found on Ancestry it says that he was stationed in the North West of England and was in the Machine Gun Corps. He was awarded the British War Medal and Victory Medal.  What I would like to know is where and why the Connaught Rangers would be stationed in Lancashire?   

Thanks in advance if you can share any information.

Maxine, before the war the Connaught Rangers consisted of two regular battalions (1st and 2nd) and two reserve battalions (3rd and 4th), the latter made up from auxiliary (part-time, citizen) soldiers.  Of the two regular battalions it was standard army practice that one would serve in a barracks ‘on the home establishment’ (Britain and Ireland) and one battalion ‘on the foreign establishment’ (often India, but also in other overseas garrisons).  
 

For those on the home establishment they would generally move barracks every 2/3 years and these were anywhere in the British isles, but often on the edge of or among conurbation.  Ergo a battalion might be based in Liverpool and thus in Lancashire, but would then move after a few years.  In addition the regiment had a permanent home (training base) and HQ in Ireland, at Galway, known as the ‘regimental depot’.

 

When war broke out both regular battalions were sent to the front line to fight, the Reserve battalions were mobilised to train and provide reinforcements, and additional ‘War-Service’ (for the duration only) Battalions (5th and 6th) were raised from mass civilian volunteers as part of a national recruitment drive initiated by Lord Kitchener and eventually supported by John Redmond.

 

Each of the battalions had a medium machine gun (MMG) section and in 1916 these were extracted and merged with other sections to form machine gun companies within a discrete and centrally focused Machine Gun Corps (MGC) with its own identity and HQ.  There were a number of training camps where these MGC men went to train, including Wimbledon, Grantham and Strensall.  
 

It seems likely that your forebear was a member of a Connaught Rangers MMG section that was absorbed by the MGC in 1916 and subsequently perhaps was for a time training at a camp in Lancashire.

 

NB.  Examination of the movements of the Connaught Rangers indicates that none of its battalions were based in Lancashire during the course of WW1, which implies that the reference to Lancashire must be linked with service in the MGC.

The Connaught Rangers was one of the smaller regiments during WW1 due to its limited recruiting area.  Very heavy losses early on led to the 2nd Battalion merging with the 1st before the end of 1914 and never being reconstituted until after the war.  The 4th Battalion also merged with the 3rd by the end of 1918 and the much diminished 6th was disbanded in the early summer of that year. 

Edited 14 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Thanks for the information Dave and Frogsmile, it's much appreciated. 

 

From my research so far I've found the Connaught Rangers were in Preston at Fulwood Barracks and in Blackburn but this was well before WW1 - 1876 and 1989.  I've found this out from Newspaper archives as the Connaught Rangers had a very well regarded regimental band and gave concerts in the region in the summer of 1876 alongside the Coldstream guards.  

 

On Ancestry there is a record for Martin Fahey, b.- Pte Martin Fahey, 5919 Connaught Rangers and 61906 MGC, on his record it says 0 in the 'theatres of war which served' column and in the 'remarks' column it says Class Z. (AR) 9-7-19.   

 

Thanks

 

 

[FROGSMILE]

3 hours ago, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Thanks for the information Dave and Frogsmile, it's much appreciated. 

 

From my research so far I've found the Connaught Rangers were in Preston at Fulwood Barracks and in Blackburn but this was well before WW1 - 1876 and 1989.  I've found this out from Newspaper archives as the Connaught Rangers had a very well regarded regimental band and gave concerts in the region in the summer of 1876 alongside the Coldstream guards.  

 

On Ancestry there is a record for Martin Fahey, b.- Pte Martin Fahey, 5919 Connaught Rangers and 61906 MGC, on his record it says 0 in the 'theatres of war which served' column and in the 'remarks' column it says Class Z. (AR) 9-7-19.   

 

Thanks

 

 

There are superb genealogical detectives on the forum who might well be able to advise you about Fahey’s enlistment date based on the sequence of his regimental serial number.  Most individual service records were destroyed by bombing in WW2 but some survived and its sometimes possible to look at near numbers and make basic assumptions based on the sequencing.

 

The Class Z reference refers to Fahey’s demobilisation to the Army Reserve (AR) at the end of the war, and in effect indicates the point of his discharge.

 

It is possible to trace where the Connaught Rangers were stationed over the centuries via various newspaper archives, as stations were listed periodically.  For historical research purposes these were compiled into a series by year in the USA as part of the ‘Nafziger Collection’ where they are held by the US Army staff college website.  The links to these, along with a plethora of other historical information relating to British Army regiments can be sourced via the superb FIBIWiki page here: https://wiki.fibis.org/w/British_Army

The webmaster for FIBIWiki posts here as ‘Maureene’ and she is always very helpful (she is based in Australia so bear in mind her time zone).

 

NB.  If it can be determined which battalion of the Connaught Rangers that Fahey served with then it’s possible to trace the MGC Company that he served with too, as the companies were numbered in direct accordance with the number of the Brigade within which the battalion was serving.  Many war diaries for these MGC units and the brigades survive, but sadly in addition to the service records destroyed by bombing in WW2, a post war fire destroyed many more MGC general records that were temporarily being stored in a garage.

Edited 14 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Jervis]

Hi Maxine,
His medal records show - as Frogsmile suggested - he initially joined Conn. Rangers and transferred to MCG. Unfortunately they do not show which Battalion of CR he served with. 

 

They do indicate he entered at theatre of war after 1916. If he was living in Britain he may have been conscripted, although he looks to be living in Galway which means he would have volunteered and volunteered relatively late and In the knowledge of what the war involved and what he was getting himself in for. 
 

Jervis

[ss002d6252]

 

20 hours ago, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Dear Forum Members

I am researching my family history and it looks like my Irish Grandfather served in the Connaught Rangers between 1914 and 1920.  However, on a record I have found on Ancestry it says that he was stationed in the North West of England and was in the Machine Gun Corps. He was awarded the British War Medal and Victory Medal.  What I would like to know is where and why the Connaught Rangers would be stationed in Lancashire?   

Thanks in advance if you can share any information.

 

When was he born ?

 

Craig

 

 

 

 

 

 

[FROGSMILE]

I think that the most likely place to link any MGC training with Lancashire would be Altcar Ranges.  During the First world war two hutted camps, ‘A’ and ‘B’ Camps, were built for the Command musketry School.  The layout of Altcar Ranges was ideal for musketry as the firing direction was out to sea.  This arrangement was very safe and would have enabled Machine gun firing over a wide arc out to over a 1,000 yards.  Incredibly the range had its own railway station of magnificent architecture and a light gauge line for running ammunition up to the firing points.  It was closed in 1921 and later demolished.  
There was also a ‘Sniggery Camp’ nearby: https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/94697-sniggery-barracks/

 

Edited 16 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Dr Maxine Watson]

On 14/10/2020 at 13:00, ss002d6252 said:

 

 

When was he born ?

 

Craig

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Craig,

 

I think he was born in Clonmel, Tipperary, Ireland.  

 

 

[ss002d6252]

50 minutes ago, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Hi Craig,

 

I think he was born in Clonmel, Tipperary, Ireland.  

 

 

Do you know what year he was born?

 

Craig 

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Hi Craig,

 

from what I can gather somewhere between 1895 and 1902.  The Irish records are patchy and Fahey is a common name in that area.  

 

Cheers

Maxine

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Hi Craig,

 

from what I can gather somewhere between 1895 and 1902.  The Irish records are patchy and Fahey is a common name in that area.  

 

Cheers

Maxine

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Thanks Frogsmile for the information and map of Altcar.  I'm sure many soldiers passed through training camps and it's not recorded on records.

Cheers

Maxine

[FROGSMILE]

9 hours ago, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Thanks Frogsmile for the information and map of Altcar.  I'm sure many soldiers passed through training camps and it's not recorded on records.

Cheers

Maxine

I think it’s extremely likely that he spent some time there Maxine.  I’ve fired tripod mounted machine guns there myself.  I know for sure that it was (and remains) the only firing range in Lancashire suitable for MMG firing over the longer ranges commensurate with field firing, as opposed to merely checking functionality of the guns and check zeroing (collimating) at short range.

Edited 20 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Fattyowls]

Hi Maxine

 

This is little bit of background on the dedicated station, Altcar Rifle Range, as described by Mr F. As his map suggests the ranges are still in use and I think I can hear firing from here when the wind is in the right direction.

 

There is another WW1 link nearby, just on the other side of Formby to the north of the camp. The war poets Siegfried Sassoon and Robert Graves were based in Litherland to the south at the depot of the Royal Welsh Fusiliers and would travel up to Formby Golf Club to play. It was at Formby Point just to the north of the camp at Altcar that Sassoon threw his Military Cross medal ribbon into the Mersey as a symbol of his open disillusionment with the war. The Liverpool terminus for the railway line that ran past Altcar camp up to Southport was Exchange Station, and it was in the station hotel that the hearing into Sassoon's conduct was held. Graves travelled to Liverpool to defend his friend and it was as a result of this that Sassoon was sent to Craiglockhart in Edinburgh to be treated for shell shock. Here he famously met Wilfred Owen, whose father had been a station master about a mile away from Exchange on the other side of the Mersey at Woodside.

 

Apologies for digressing into the railway geography of Edwardian Merseyside and it's impact on WW1 poetry. It's not entirely relevant to the Connaught Rangers or the Machine Gun Corps. but I thought it might be of interest. 

 

Pete.

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Thanks for the information.  I've just started on my quest to look into my family history so finding everything interesting.  

 

[FROGSMILE]

On 20/10/2020 at 11:20, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Hi Craig,

 

from what I can gather somewhere between 1895 and 1902.  The Irish records are patchy and Fahey is a common name in that area.  

 

Cheers

Maxine

 

Maxine, if his name was Martin Fahey and the family "name was common" in the Clonmel, Tipperary area, it's quite possible that there were a number of men with the Christian/first name Martin.  On what basis do you think that the Connaught Rangers man is the right one?  Is there some other evidence?  Establishing a date of birth or relating other, corroborating facts, is important in narrowing down your man.  The more family information that you can provide the clearer it is to establish a lineage.  Was he married, if so to whom?  Who were his parents (names, etc.)?  Did he have children?  All these details help to narrow things down with family names that are prolific, although I realise you might have only some, or none of this information.  The excellent genealogical detectives here (of whom I'm not one) really just need you to lay out all the information that you have, so as to avoid going down the wrong rabbit holes.

Edited 21 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Chris_Baker]

By sheer coincidence I have just completed research on a Wigan man who joined the Connaught Rangers in November 1914 ... 

[FROGSMILE]

3 minutes ago, Chris_Baker said:

By sheer coincidence I have just completed research on a Wigan man who joined the Connaught Rangers in November 1914 ... 

 

Is his name Martin Fahey, Chris?  Apparently the connection with the North West is confined to being stationed there at some point.

Edited 21 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[Chris_Baker]

No. He was Thomas Collinson. Joined up with a chap named McNulty. Trained at Kinsale.

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Thanks both.  From what I can gather Martin Fahey was the son of John Fahey b.1867 in Ardfinnan and Elizabeth Leary, b.1873 in Clonmel.  I've done some further research and it looks like their son Martin was born in 1902.  He married in Clonmel in 1937 to Margaret O'Brien.  He had to be in Lancashire around 1919 or he could not be DNA connected to me! So my natural thought process led to Military service and when I searched records up came Martin Fahey with service in the North West of England.  I'm hoping that when the 1921 Census comes online in 2022 I will be able to track him down.

[FROGSMILE]

6 hours ago, Dr Maxine Watson said:

Thanks both.  From what I can gather Martin Fahey was the son of John Fahey b.1867 in Ardfinnan and Elizabeth Leary, b.1873 in Clonmel.  I've done some further research and it looks like their son Martin was born in 1902.  He married in Clonmel in 1937 to Margaret O'Brien.  He had to be in Lancashire around 1919 or he could not be DNA connected to me! So my natural thought process led to Military service and when I searched records up came Martin Fahey with service in the North West of England.  I'm hoping that when the 1921 Census comes online in 2022 I will be able to track him down.

 

Perhaps @PRC or @clk or @corisandecan help?

Edited 22 October , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[corisande]

From what I can gather Martin Fahey was the son of John Fahey b.1867 in Ardfinnan and Elizabeth Leary, b.1873 in Clonmel.  I've done some further research and it looks like their son Martin was born in 1902.  He married in Clonmel in 1937 to Margaret O'Brien.  He had to be in Lancashire around 1919 or he could not be DNA connected to me! So my natural thought process led to Military service and when I searched records up came Martin Fahey with service in the North West of England

 

You may be trying to draw too much out of DNA results. We need establish what you know as a fact, as opposed to what you have surmised. I may be wrong here but ...

 

1. Do I take it that one of your grandparents was fathered  by a soldier in WW1. And that you are not sure who that man was.

 

2. Are you sure even of his name?

 

3. You have a DNA test that suggests that you are perhaps connected to a Martin Fahey , but are not sure

 

Like you, I can get Martin Fahey's birth and marriage in Ireland, but it is not really helping to answer your basic question which seems to be to name your grandfather, rather than to determine Martin Fahey's service record

[Dr Maxine Watson]

Hi Corisande,

 

It was my father, and yes, sure of the name and related by DNA with seven cousins spread around the globe.  He was the only boy, so no confusion between other male relatives. I've his birth, baptism, marriage, death, grave location, 1911 Census etc....but.....the mystery still is his link to Lancashire.

Cheers

Maxine

[corisande]

Thanks for clarifying that.

 

So you have all the Genealogy information, you know who he was, you "just" need to establish why he was in Lancashire