TANK CORPS 50th ANNIVERSARY DINNER: SEPTEMBER 1966

[INW]

My family have this photo of my grandfather at the dinner held in London fifty years after the first tank battle.

The names of four men can be identified from their badges with a magnifying glass.

The fourth (from my left) man's badge is bleached out; perhaps it reflected back the flash. He has a fabulous set of medals. Can any 'tank medal expert' identify the medals and is there any chance of identifying him from his medals?

The other men are, left to right: 
L.H.Boughton
M.H.Chew
F.J.McGuirk
Unknown; his badge cannot be read but his medals must be unique. He must have also served in WW2.
G.H.Wells (my grandfather)
The group may have been put together for the photograph because they were from the midlands, around Birmingham.

Does anyone have any other photos of the event?

 

Regards

 

INW

 

Edited 8 May , 2020 by INW
a typo corrected

[sadbrewer]

I'm speculating here, but I wonder if the Midlands contingent were part of this group?

Report from 1960 courtesy of the British Newspaper Archive. 

 

 

[david murdoch]

Cracking picture. Your grandfather is wearing his Motor Machine Gun Service cap badge on his lapel! Originally Gunner 686 MMGS with 9th Battery. When MGC took them over they nicked the badge and in some cases the MMGS men were ordered to break the letters off their original badges - as they had to wear the plain crossed guns from early 1916 but many kept them. 

 

L.H.Boughton  Gunner Leonard Henry Boughton 2948 MGC(Motors) Commissioned 2nd Lieutenant in  Tank Corps 29/3/1918
M.H.Chew I think is  Pte. Harold Masters Chew 69396 F Battalion / 6th Tank Corps 
F.J.McGuirk  Pte. Frederick John McGuirk 75344 originally Army Cyclist Corps

Edited 8 May , 2020 by david murdoch

[mancpal]

David, 

The MMG cap badge minus the lettering appears to be worn by Pte Chew as well  WW1 oak leaves to add to his 14 star and clasp.

The unknown chap looks to have a 2nd war MID. I cant give a definitive answer to his medal entitlement but can see a WW1 pair, 3 WW2 stars, 39-45 medal and defence medal add a couple of coronation medals and that only leaves 1.

 

Simon

[Gareth Davies]

Paging @delta

[johntaylor]

Fantastic photo Ian - interesting that the medal register shows Harold Chew as being in 6th Bn, and his name appears in the nominal roll in the War History of the Sixth Tank Battalion (though misprinted as A. M. Chew). However for some reason, in the photo he's wearing the French badge awarded to 9th Bn on his tie (see an example here: http://www.whartonmilitaria.co.uk/details.php?section=britishbadges_armourcavalry&item=BBAC0024 ). Incidentally he has another regimental badge in his button hole, above the MGC badge, but I can't make that out.

 

Regarding the mystery man next to your grandfather (who has the look of an officer), he certainly has an impressive collection of medals but once you take out the WWI and WW2 campaign medals, I'm not sure if they will be distinctive enough to identify him. The ones on the far right may reveal more to a medal expert, but I'm not too optimistic.

 

However I wonder if it might be possible to do something with his name badge? You've done very well to work out the others, and I wonder if you could attempt a really high quality scan of his badge to see if it reveals anything at all?  I know I'm clutching at straws here!

 

Finally, regimental journals such as The Tank often carried reports and photos of gatherings, and this one was obviously taken by a professional photographer. They have a complete run of magazines at the Tank Museum in Bovington, and it would be worth checking with them once we're allowed out again.

 

All the best, John

[david murdoch]

I think I got H M Chew wrong - he died in 1937!

Got to be Arthur Henry Chew. 14 Star, and GSM with Iraq clasp. Also served in 9th Tank Corps. He later went out to Iraq with 1st ACC Tank Corps - serving in 8th L.A.M.B

Edited 8 May , 2020 by david murdoch
Adding information.

[Michelle Young]

Please acknowledge source of images as per forum requirements 

thank you 

[Gareth Davies]

1 hour ago, johntaylor said:

Fantastic photo Ian - interesting that the medal register shows Harold Chew as being in 6th Bn, and his name appears in the nominal roll in the War History of the Sixth Tank Battalion (though misprinted as A. M. Chew). However for some reason, in the photo he's wearing the French badge awarded to 9th Bn on his tie (see an example here: http://www.whartonmilitaria.co.uk/details.php?section=britishbadges_armourcavalry&item=BBAC0024 ). Incidentally he has another regimental badge in his button hole, above the MGC badge, but I can't make that out.

 

All the best, John

 

There was a Sjt C Chew in the 9th Bn; he was awarded the CdG. The chap 2nd from left seems to have a CdG.

 

Edited 8 May , 2020 by Gareth Davies

[FROGSMILE]

6 hours ago, mancpal said:

David, 

The MMG cap badge minus the lettering appears to be worn by Pte Chew as well  WW1 oak leaves to add to his 14 star and clasp.

The unknown chap looks to have a 2nd war MID. I cant give a definitive answer to his medal entitlement but can see a WW1 pair, 3 WW2 stars, 39-45 medal and defence medal add a couple of coronation medals and that only leaves 1.

 

Simon

His final medal appears to be the Regular Army LS&GC, which suggests he stayed on after WW1 and then was either still young enough or perhaps more likely was recalled from the reserve for WW2.  If so he should be a fairly well known character assuming he stayed with the Royal Tank Corps/Regiment.

[Gareth Davies]

Chews that we have found:

 

Arthur Henry Chew, was originally Worcestershire Regiment then 9th Bn.

 

George Chew, originally in the Warwickshire Regt. Silver War Badge holder. I suspect that this is the C Chew I mentioned earlier who was 9th Bn. George went on to be a Chelsea Pensioner.

Harold Masters Chew. No previous regiment.

 

The Chew pictured appears to have a CdG.

 

 

 

 

Edited 8 May , 2020 by Gareth Davies

[david murdoch]

42 minutes ago, Gareth Davies said:

Chews that we have found:

 

Arthur Henry Chew, was originally Worcestershire Regiment then 9th Bn.

 

George Chew, originally in the Warwickshire Regt. Silver War Badge holder. I suspect that this is the C Chew I mentioned earlier who was 9th Bn. George went on to be a Chelsea Pensioner.

Harold Masters Chew. No previous regiment.

 

The Chew pictured appears to have a CdG.

 

 

 

 

Per my post #7. From the Tank Corps enlistments ledger, he first enlisted in the army 24/6/1909, then re enlisted for a further four years on 26/2/1919, then extended terms 28/5/1921 to complete 21 years service. This would have taken him to 1930. He then re enlisted 16/10/1939 to R.A.C. The re enlistment in 1919 would fit in with joining No.1 ACC and going out to Iraq then the 7869246 renumbering. He'd have been a welcome addition the the ACCs being a combat experienced soldier - going by the ACC casualties in Iraq a lot of them were 18/19 year olds too young to have served in WW1.

 

[Gareth Davies]

I’m with you all the way David apart from that I can’t see AH listed as a CdG holder (which is almost certainly due to my poor searching skills).

[david murdoch]

4 hours ago, Gareth Davies said:

I’m with you all the way David apart from that I can’t see AH listed as a CdG holder (which is almost certainly due to my poor searching skills).

Here we go - from the newspapers Evening Dispatch 24/8/1918. Confirming his CdG and also being wounded five times. I've seen one of Stephen's tank crew pics with a lad with an armful of wound stripes  - as I remember was thought to be Chew, but this newspaper photo hopefully confirm that. This article stating he went to France August 1914 with Worcestershire Regiment tallies with his date of entry on the MIC.

 

Edited 8 May , 2020 by david murdoch
Changed image for better quality.

[Gareth Davies]

Excellent, thank you.

[INW]

Thanks for all the replies, I have now had chance to find the list of people attending the dinner. It was not as well filed as it should have been.

It was A.H.Chew of 9th Battalion. I had not noticed that my efforts with a magnifying glass had not matched the initials on the list.

My only excuse is that the original typewriter used for the list had a very worn letter A.

 

Few names in the list of attendees jump out at me. One that does is C B Arnold of Musical Box and F Battalion.

 

INW

[delta]

Thanks for sharing Ian. 

I haven;t researched this for some while and my list is thereore dreadfully out of date

Could you please publish the full list? 

 

 The event took place at Caxton Hall in London and those present who had served with C and D Companies at Flers Courcelette in 1916 were as follows:

Lt Allan Cuthbert (Bill) Brannon ASC (HQ D Company)

32257 Gnr William Taylor DAWSON (C20)

2944 Gnr Robert William Frederick Cornish FROST (D10 Dinkum)

2876 Gnr William Ernest (Billy) FOSTER (D20 Daphne)

40002 Cpl Douglas James GARDINER (C18 Casa)

32476 Gnr Wilfred “Wilf” Vernon GIDDINS ( C Company)

Lt Harold George “Daddy” Head (D3 later MC)

2283 Gnr Charles Henry Wallace HEWITT  (C Company)

2261 Gnr John Finlay MELDRUM ( C Company)

2714 Sgt James (Jimmy) NOEL   (C Company later DCM)

32361 Gnr Robert (Bob) TATE (C19 Clan Leslie)

32097 Gnr John Cameron TOLSON (D19 Duke)

Edited 8 May , 2020 by delta
inability to write clear and concise English

[INW]

Thanks everyone: 

 

Following J.T.'s advice I have asked my cousin, Sarah, who keeps the photo to do detailed scans of the medals and badges.

In the meantime this is the best image of the fourth man's medals.

I list the current thoughts below numbering the medals from my left to my right.

 

1    WWI British War Medal

2    WWI Victory Medal

3   G V  Coronation medal? Explore Inter War campaign medals.

4   G VI Coronation medal? EII very unlikely. Explore Inter War campaign medals.

5    WWII Star ?

6    WWII Star ?

7    WWII Star ?

8    WWII Defence Medal

9    WWII War Medal with oak leaf for 'Mentioned In Dispatches'

10  Long Service and Good Conduct issued 1944 - 1959

 

I suppose he could have served from 1918 to 1953. 35 years.

 

My grandfather was a Birmingham air raid warden in WWII, would he have be been entitled to the WWII defence medal ?

 

INW

Edited 9 May , 2020 by INW
Changed notes for medals 3 and 4

[mancpal]

I would imagine that the second of the two coronation medals would be for George VI rather than Elizabeth II. This is of course if they are coronation medals at all, what other medals would have been available to him between the wars

 

Simon

[david murdoch]

7 minutes ago, mancpal said:

I would imagine that the second of the two coronation medals would be for George VI rather than Elizabeth II. This is of course if they are coronation medals at all, what other medals would have been available to him between the wars

 

Simon

http://www.worldmedals.co.uk/Rib/britribb.htm This is a useful table of British medal ribbons. Planning on screen taking screen shots and knock the colour out - gives a better idea how they will show up in old photos. 

[mancpal]

David,

thanks for showing the above representation. The number of threads on here over the years relating to medal ribbons and the colour they can appear when subject to old technology I can't remember.

 

Simon

[johntaylor]

I'm glad we've explained the 9th Bn badge on Sergeant Chew's tie - I'm still puzzled by the top badge on his jacket lapel, which should probably be the Worcestershire Regiment but doesn't look much like it (or any other regimental badge, as far as I can see).

 

Regarding the mystery man, the impressive collection of medals certainly indicates long service and I do feel his general bearing and demeanour suggest he was an officer, though it's only a hunch. The name badge is very close to being legible and a better quality scan might be enough. The full list of attendees should also provide some vital evidence, and once we come up with a possible name then the medals will leave no doubt. However it would be great to see the full list of names as a starting point if possible.

 

Regarding your grandfather, I think he should have been entitled to the Defence Medal but I know a lot of people didn't bother applying (the medals weren't named, so didn't have the cachet of WWI medals). My mum and dad applied to the MoD for their WW2 medals in the 1970s and received them - I'm not sure if you can still do the same thing now!

 

John

 

 

[Gareth Davies]

The mystery man has the LS&GC which means he did 18 years as a soldier (he may have subsequently been commissioned). 

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

19 hours ago, mancpal said:

David,

thanks for showing the above representation. The number of threads on here over the years relating to medal ribbons and the colour they can appear when subject to old technology I can't remember.

 

Simon

The 1966 picture will almost certainly be on panchromatic film  rather than the old technology orthochromatic film, so David's image in post #20 will be a fair approximation.

 

[Bordercollie]

I think the 2 difficult to identify medals are more likely to be GSM 1918-62 and India GSM 1936-39.  If worn in the correct order the Coronation Medals would come after the WW2 Campaign Medals.