1914 Clasp

[BIFFO]

as im self isolating it has given me time to sort out  my medals to research,I have a 14 trio to a welsh man who K.I.A near langermarc 25-10-14 on his 14 star there is a clasp with  2/2762 what can be deduced from this ?

[seaJane]

Long shot, but name Rowlands by any chance?

 

[Keith_history_buff]

There's a post or two on here that states the following: 

When 1914 Stars were issues to the NoK of fatalities, they were automatically issued with the clasp. By definition, the deceased would not be wearing ribbon bars, so no roses were issued. There must be an Army Order or similar, whereby the deceased automatically got the clasp, whereas those that were still living had to apply for it.

Not sure if someone like Justin can elucidate as to what the clasp reference would mean. If you were to look at a number of persons confirmed to have received the clasp, I would imagine a similar reference is showing. If you have access to the medal rolls on Ancestry, that may be the quickest way to see numerous entries for clasp recipients.

[Keith_history_buff]

Posts 9 and 11 within the following would appear to answer your question

https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/257861-1914-star-roll/

[BIFFO]

Thank you all cleared that up 

[BIFFO]

Nope SJ,

For a change im STUCK AGAIN

My 14 trio man 

James Henry Lewis service number 8776

2nd battalion Welsh regiment

kia 21-10-14

as  he was a lance corporal when kia he only went "over there"31-8-14, so he must have previous military service ?

I have asked a wr expert who can only say he enlisted at maesteg,

1911 England/Wales census

has his address as Main Barracks Abyssinia Cairo Egypt how can I fin when he joined and why was he in Egypt?

any help would be good 

  

 

[seaJane]

CWGC has him killed 25/10/15, not 21, not that that helps much...

• https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1618878/lewis,-james-henry/
• Aged 28
• 2nd Bn. Welsh Regiment
• Brother of Mrs. A. Leah, of 2, Hayday Rd., Plaistow, London.

I see his Medal Index Card has one of those *X* cross-reference marks to him as "Pte" but I don't know where you'd trace that back to.

This is the only likely man on FreeBMD:

• Births Dec 1886
• LEWIS James Henry District Newport M[onmouth] Volume 11a Page 161
• and could be this man baptised Llangattock iuxta Caerleon 10 Dec 1886 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCTK-XQR

Familysearch.org gives the census address as Abbassia, Egypt and he is with the 1st Bn Welch Regiment (along with 3 other Lewises in the same "household" who I suppose were messmates) :

• https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?givenname=James Henry&givenname_exact=on&surname=Lewis&surname_exact=on&birth_year_from=1886&birth_year_to=1887&record_type=3&birth_place0=9&count=20&offset=0
• https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7VH-XBX

 

The 1st Battalion had been in Egypt in 1886 but went back to Pembroke in 1893 before being sent out to the Boer War. I think in 1911 they were probably between India and Wales but as I'm not an expert it would be better to ask one. I can't see him anywhere in TNA and the Regimental Museum charges £35 for research ...

[BIFFO]

Thank you SJ,

I have him on census 1901 but cannot find him on 1891 even on English  Wales census very curious ?

born in Swansea,later I will looksee wd for 2nd

[seaJane]

Yes, 1911 says Swansea but they're all pretty close together so I'm wondering if there was a mix-up or he actually didn't know where he was born? It is odd about the 1891 census unless they were an army family and he was abroad, he would only have been about 5 at the time.

[BIFFO]

Thank you again SJ,

1901 he is an underground colliery worker living in Swansea,with his widowed mother who died 1903,so he may have got on his toes and joined up as he had no mother-father,its a mystery I dont think I will be able to sort.The chap I wrote to if he doesnt know much about him in the Welsh regiment its not worth knowing.

[williywonker]

The 1914 Star Case Files held at the NA confirm that it was War Office policy to automatically issue the clasp to the next-of-kin or legatee of officers and men deceased prior to 22/23rd November 1914. No application was necessary. The clasp reference number is the unit nominal roll reference. For those officers and men still serving, the 1914 Star and clasp was issued via the regiment. The 1914 Stars to those discharged were sent to their home address. With the exception of the case above, all other medals, clasps and MID emblems issued by the Army Medals Office had an issue voucher number and date of despatch added to their MIC. Officers and men discharged the service had to make an individual claim for the clasp to the War Office by completing forms available at Post Offices. This process was not well advertised and the AG complained that few application forms for the clasp had been received. A great many men simply purchased a clasp from their local tailor (including women and nurses, all of whom were ineligible)

Mal

 

Edited 7 April , 2020 by williywonker
spelling mistake noted

[Keith_history_buff]

7 hours ago, williywonker said:

The 1914 Star Case Files held at the NA confirm that it was War Office policy to automatically issue the clasp to the next-of-kin or legatee of officers and men deceased prior to 22/23rd November 1914. No application was necessary.

Thanks for this. Would it be possible to advise as to the TNA reference for these 1914 Star Case Files files please?

[Keith_history_buff]

James Henry Lewis appears on page 107 of the medal roll. To the right of his entry, a green pencilled "C3" has been written. There are four others on the same page, all of whom died during the qualifying period (4 August 1914 - 23 November 1914), having the same green "C3". For the other five men on the page, they applied for clasps, and they were duly issued in 1933, 1920, 1921, 1928 and 1937. 
C3 relates to 58 men who were on this particular automatic issue voucher, dated 12 November 1921. It has the two references of CLASP/2/2762 and I.V.1480/C

Image courtesy of Ancestry, fraction of original image reproduced under fair usage terms.
 

[Keith_history_buff]

On 07/04/2020 at 00:58, williywonker said:

The 1914 Star Case Files held at the NA confirm that it was War Office policy to automatically issue the clasp to the next-of-kin or legatee of officers and men deceased prior to 22/23rd November 1914. [See image below] No application was necessary. The clasp reference number is the unit nominal roll reference.

For those officers and men still serving, the 1914 Star and clasp was issued via the regiment. The 1914 Stars to those discharged were sent to their home address. With the exception of the case above, all other medals, clasps and MID emblems issued by the Army Medals Office had an issue voucher number and date of despatch added to their MIC. 

Officers and men discharged the service had to make an individual claim for the clasp to the War Office by completing forms available at Post Offices. This process was not well advertised and the AG complained that few application forms for the clasp had been received. A great many men simply purchased a clasp from their local tailor (including women and nurses, all of whom were ineligible)

Mal

 

Transcript and image from the 1914 Star case file
 

Quote

AAG to Secretary Of State Winston Churchill dated 16 July 1919,

‘... I propose to issue the clasp to the personal representative of dead officers and ORs [other ranks] who were qualified for the 1914 Star, as it will be impossible to check [on an individual basis] whether they came under the fire of the enemy’s mobile artillery or not. ’

‘Good. No doubt there will be difficulties but the advantages will be found to outweigh those altogether
WC 17 July 1919’.

Source of this info: williywonker