WWI Service Record for Patrick Byrne

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

Hello,

my grandfather, named Patrick Byrne (also known as "O'Byrne" later in life)  fought 

in the British Army during World War One.

 

He was born in Co. Wicklow, Ireland around 1889 (+/- 2 year).

 

He was injured in battle and received a Disability Pension for the rest of his life.

He lived at Harold's Cross, Dublin for most of his remaining life.  He died in the mid 1970's in

Dublin.

 

Accordingl to family focklore he was the victim of a mine explosion.  His shoulder was injured

but there were other injuries too.  A colleague of his died in the same explosion.

He was take off the battlefield, post battle, by the army medical team.

I dont know the battle and I have no documented evidence to support the above claims

 

The family would be extremely grateful for any assistance in gaining hard evidence here

 

Thanks

Mr Paul O'Reilly

[charlie962]

Paul, a needle in a haystack ?  There are in excess of 80 'P Byrne's in the Daily Casualty Lists as wounded 1914/18 and those lists are in no way complete.

 

Did Patrick marry during the war or have children during the war ? Certificates might give a clue to his unit ?

 

Charlie

[ss002d6252]

16 hours ago, Paul Gerard OReilly said:

Hello,

my grandfather, named Patrick Byrne (also known as "O'Byrne" later in life)  fought 

in the British Army during World War One.

 

He was born in Co. Wicklow, Ireland around 1889 (+/- 2 year).

 

He was injured in battle and received a Disability Pension for the rest of his life.

He lived at Harold's Cross, Dublin for most of his remaining life.  He died in the mid 1970's in

Dublin.

 

Accordingl to family focklore he was the victim of a mine explosion.  His shoulder was injured

but there were other injuries too.  A colleague of his died in the same explosion.

He was take off the battlefield, post battle, by the army medical team.

I dont know the battle and I have no documented evidence to support the above claims

 

The family would be extremely grateful for any assistance in gaining hard evidence here

 

Thanks

Mr Paul O'Reilly

Any idea on the regiment ?

Craig

[Jervis]

 

Additional info. would definitely help, but pension records might identify him. i.e. a record for P Byrne with an address of Harold’s cross Dublin would go a long way. I don’t have fold3 or WFA access to view. 

Edited 17 October , 2019 by Jervis

[ss002d6252]

5 minutes ago, Jervis said:

 

Additional info. would definely help, but pension records might identify him. i.e. a record for P Byrne with an address of Harold’s cross Dublin would go a long way. I don’t have fold3 or WFA access to view. 

Nothing obvious in the records, going to need more to narrow it.

Craig

[Mark1959]

There are dozens of Patrick Burns living in Dublin with pension cards. As Craig has just said more info required to narrow it down

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

Hello,

I am trying to trace the military history of Private Patrick O'Byrne, my grand father.  He was invalided in World Ward One towards the end of 1916 during some battle.

I would be very interested to know the circumstanes of his injuries and the name of the battle in which he fought.  Any earlier military history would also be interesting.

I'm also attaching some photographs of his cigarette case which must have save his life as it has a bullet hole on it.  It has his initials PO'B

You are welcome to share these images on your forum

 

He was born in 1891.   In June 1915 he was a member of  the

16th Div. Cyclist Corps (or Company) stationed at  Convamore Ballyhooly Co. Cork. 

I'm attaching a postcard he send to my grand mother at the time as reference.

 

He received a military pension.  I have 2 addresses for him below to which the pension would have been submitted over the periods below

• until 1969 he resided at 19 Westfield Road, Harolds Cross, Dublin 6, Ireland.
• from 1969 until his death  (aged 86)  on 1st July 1977   7 Whitechurch Road,  Rathfarnham Dublin 14, Ireland

 

If anyone has any information on his military record, or knows how I can acquire that information, I would be very interested.

Edited 1 February , 2020 by Paul Gerard OReilly

[corisande]

Paul

 

Welcome to the Forum

 

The photo of the box with the bullet hole seems not to have made it !

 

Anyway we need establish who he was in Army terms

 

He seems to be Patrick O'Byrne in Army Cycling Corps, te in Leinster Regt (3612)

 

His SWB record shows enlisting 28 May 1915, and invalided out 18 Oct 1916

 

His Pension Card then shows him at Grove Park, Rathmines

 

He was in 7th Leinsters, and their War Diary will show his movements

[Michelle Young]

I have merged the two topics to avoid repetition of answers 

[corisande]

To make it easier for others to follow, I add his MIC and Medal Roll

 

 

 

[corisande]

He is in Grove Pk, Rathmines  in 1911 census (as on Pension Card)

 

 

And I  think that it is too difficult to get him  1901  census  in Wicklow without knowledge of who his parents were

 

 

Edited 1 February , 2020 by corisande

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

Uploaded a picture of his cigarette case with bullet hole....lucky man (lucky me ! )

[corisande]

 

 

And the 7th Leinster's War Diaries are on Ancestry at - click

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

Thank you Lieut-General.

[charlie962]

P O'Byrne, 3612 Leinster Rgt was reported wounded in the daily casualty list of 20th July 1916 suggesting actual wounding in mid June ( ie before 'First day of the Somme).

Probably it was this wounding that led to his discharge in Oct 1916.

 

You will find he has a second, duplicate, Medal Index Card that gives his date of entry to France as 17/12/15 which ties up with the date the 7th Leinsters landed in France 18/12/15. But the Medal Roll suggests he was initially  with the "Cyclist Corps" upon entry to France.

 

So probably 16th Divisional Cyclist Company (as per postcard address) which will have landed about same time-  LLT says joined Division 11 December 1914, disbanded 1 June 1916. Troops redeployed to the infantry.

 

War Diary for 16th div Cyclists is here

 

So to summarise we seem to have:

Enlisted 28/5/15

Serving with 16th Div Cyclists, Cork, 20/6/15

Embarked for France 17/12/15

Transferred to 7th Leinsters (probably on)1/6/16

Wounded mid June 1916

Discharged (wounds) Depot Leinsters 18/10/16

 

That should help you focus on the relevant war diaries.

 

Charlie

 

Edited 1 February , 2020 by charlie962

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

Thank you Charlie.  That certainly narrows it down. greatly.   I'll search the June 1916 records to see if I can identify the battle in which he was wounded. According to family legend, during or after the battle he was in, the army medical corp went searching for wounded (non-fatal) soldiers and nearly left him for dead until he cried out for help.  A real survivor you could say.

It would be really great to know what the name of that battle was.  I'll keep search.  Thanks again.

[charlie962]

Looking quickly at the war diary there was an awful lot of bombing at the time but no obvious noting of casualties.

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

2 hours ago, charlie962 said:

3612

 

14 minutes ago, charlie962 said:

Looking quickly at the war diary there was an awful lot of bombing at the time but no obvious noting of casualties.

 

Hi Charlie,   did you mean  above that he is listed on the "daily casualty list of 20th June 1916" rather 20th July 1916" (suggesting mid June).  Can you confirm ?

[charlie962]

The daily casualty list normally appears about one month after the actual wounded (sometimes longer).

 

I can confirm that the Casualty List is dated 20 July 1916 thus actual wounding probably mid June 1916 or earlier

 

Charlie

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

thanks Charlie.

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

attaching some June diaries - any of which may be relevant.

As Mr Paddy O'Byrne was merely a private, there will be no speific mention of him as wounded.

But it would be interesting to know what part of the overall "push" or "battle" that these diaries relate to  ?

 

 

[MaxD]

You have posted pages from both 7 Leinsters and from 2 Leinsters,  The latter is not relevant to Pte O' Byrne. This link takes you direct to their (7th) diary

 

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/60779/43112_1970_4-00000?backurl=&ssrc=&backlabel=Return

 

 

The battalion were not involved in any major "battle" or "push" in April May or June 1916.  That of course does not mean he wasn't wounded but simply that it happened, as the diary shows, in the "normal" run of manning the trenches in the Loos area for spells of around 7 days at a time interspersed with spells out of the line at rest (which often meant hard work repairing trench works).

 

 As Charlie pointed out above, there was a lot of bombing (grenade throwing) on both sides and enemy artillery was always active, as was ours.  The diaries don't name names but do say when men were killed/wounded.   There were two occasions in Jun,  on 4th and on 26th when the battalion mounted raids on the enemy trenches but neither mention wounded left behind to be brought in later.  I didn't see a mine explosion.

Max

 

 

Edited 2 February , 2020 by MaxD

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

3 hours ago, MaxD said:

You have posted pages from both 7 Leinsters and from 2 Leinsters,  The latter is not relevant to Pte O' Byrne. This link takes you direct to their (7th) diary

 

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/60779/43112_1970_4-00000?backurl=&ssrc=&backlabel=Return

 

 

The battalion were not involved in any major "battle" or "push" in April May or June 1916.  That of course does not mean he wasn't wounded but simply that it happened, as the diary shows, in the "normal" run of manning the trenches in the Loos area for spells of around 7 days at a time interspersed with spells out of the line at rest (which often meant hard work repairing trench works).

 

 As Charlie pointed out above, there was a lot of bombing (grenade throwing) on both sides and enemy artillery was always active, as was ours.  The diaries don't name names but do say when men were killed/wounded.   There were two occasions in Jun,  on 4th and on 26th when the battalion mounted raids on the enemy trenches but neither mention wounded left behind to be brought in later.  I didn't see a mine explosion.

Max

 

 

 

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

Hi Max,

I'll scratch the 2nd Leinster Reference completely.  That was an early and incorrect guess I made before I recently learnt that he's started in the in 16th Div. Cyclist Corps.  I've been told by an army friend, that there were no mines in WWI.

So that part of the original family story is incorrect.  It is far more likely to be a grenade - as you say.

So we've 2 likely dates for the accident - Jun 4th or June 26th 1916, with a casualty listing of 20 July 1916.  Based on what Charlie was saying earlier, the more likely of the 2 dates is June 4th as it takes at 1 month for the lists to be updated...but that does not exclusively rule out June 26th ...I suppose.

Thank you for your valuable input Max.  

[Paul Gerard OReilly]

The other item of interest to me is the cause of the dent in his cigarette case (image attached above).  My army friend states that this appears to have been made by a bullet rather that a dent from falling shrapnel. 

So that cigarette dent may have been caused by a shot from a snipper on a difference occasion to the occasion that result in his being invalided out of service.