VICTOR EDGAR FAGENCE Research

[Tomb1302]

Hello all,

 

I am researching a Victor Edgar Fagence, who, with the help of @Jools mckennaand @PRC, I've been able to deduce voluntarily enlisted in the 10th (or 11th) Queens in 1915, and was born Oct. 1st of 1897 in Surrey.

 

I'm not sure what to ask in terms of help, but, if anyone could give me some background, and military history on him, that would be delightful.

 

I am conducting this research for a friend.

 

Thank you.

Edited 24 July , 2019 by Tomb1302

[charlie962]

He appears as wounded in the Daily Casualty List of 13/9/17 suggesting actual wounding a month earlier. Doesn't say which Battalion.

 

Here is the List on FindmyPast newspapers. It may be worth checking some of the others wounded on the same list to see if they all come from a specific Bn but it can be a frustrating excercise.

 

Charlie

Edited 24 July , 2019 by charlie962

[Tomb1302]

3 minutes ago, charlie962 said:

He appears as wounded in the Daily Casualty List of 13/9/17 suggesting actual wounding a month earlier. Doesn't say which Battalion.

 

Here is the List on FindmyPast newspapers. I may be worth checking some of the others wounded on the same list to see if they all come from a specific Bn but it can be a frustrating excercise.

 

Charlie

Charlie,

 

Thank you for your help - I'll continue to look.

[charlie962]

I don't have Ancestry but the Medal Roll may well specify his Bn (s) ?

[Tomb1302]

1 minute ago, charlie962 said:

I don't have Ancestry but the Medal Roll may well specify his Bn (s) ?

Charlie,

 

Unfortunately, I don't have Ancestry either. Do you know of anyone who might? A regular researcher on the forum maybe?

 

Thank you.

Edited 24 July , 2019 by Tomb1302

[charlie962]

probably free at your local library ?

[Tomb1302]

Just now, charlie962 said:

probably free at your local library ?

Charlie,

 

I could give this a go, thank you.

[Dave66]

His ancestry medal roll is here, with a screenshot below of the relevant info.....https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=IEM4&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&dbid=5119&gsfn=Victor&gsln=Fagence&gsfn_x=NP_NN&gsln_x=1&cp=11&new=1&rank=1&uidh=l37&redir=false&gss=angs-d&pcat=39&fh=0&h=6275783&recoff=&ml_rpos=1

 

Dave.

[charlie962]

Just a note that the War Diaries can be seen on this site where eg the 10th Bn is here

 

 

Note also that change of Bn might be triggered off on arrival in France, after a wounding or sickness etc

Edited 24 July , 2019 by charlie962

[Tomb1302]

1 minute ago, Dave66 said:

His ancestry medal roll is here, with a screenshot below of the relevant info.....https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=IEM4&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&dbid=5119&gsfn=Victor&gsln=Fagence&gsfn_x=NP_NN&gsln_x=1&cp=11&new=1&rank=1&uidh=l37&redir=false&gss=angs-d&pcat=39&fh=0&h=6275783&recoff=&ml_rpos=1

 

Dave.

Dave,

 

This is very much appreciated. I'm sure my friend will be humbled by these discoveries.

 

Thank you.

 

 

Just now, charlie962 said:

Just a note that the War Diaries can be seen on this site where eg the 10th Bn is here

Noted - Thank you!

Edited 24 July , 2019 by Tomb1302

[Dave66]

You’re welcome, nice to be able to help out.

Can’t see anything else military for him, but there is a baptism record confirming birthday, parents George and Ada Mercy.

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=IEM11&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&dbid=4772&gsfn=Victor Edgar&gsln=Fagence&gsfn_x=NP_NN&gsln_x=1&cp=11&qh=ZXNOQUU5TDBoP%2BHZa%2ByMWQ%3D%3D&new=1&rank=1&uidh=l37&redir=false&gss=angs-d&pcat=34&fh=0&h=1531754&recoff=&ml_rpos=1

Extract from above record below

Best of luck,

 

Dave.

Edited 24 July , 2019 by Dave66

[Tomb1302]

1 minute ago, Dave66 said:

You’re welcome, nice to be able to help out.

Can’t see anything else military for him, but there is a baptism record confirming birthday, parents George and Ada Mercy.

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=IEM11&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&dbid=4772&gsfn=Victor Edgar&gsln=Fagence&gsfn_x=NP_NN&gsln_x=1&cp=11&qh=ZXNOQUU5TDBoP%2BHZa%2ByMWQ%3D%3D&new=1&rank=1&uidh=l37&redir=false&gss=angs-d&pcat=34&fh=0&h=1531754&recoff=&ml_rpos=1

 

Best of luck,

 

Dave.

Dave,

 

Would it be too much to ask to have screenshots of your findings on Ancestry?

 

Seeing as I don't have it myself, I can't access that link, and a previous one.

 

Thank you.

[Dave66]

3 minutes ago, Tomb1302 said:

Dave,

 

Would it be too much to ask to have screenshots of your findings on Ancestry?

 

Seeing as I don't have it myself, I can't access that link, and a previous one.

 

Thank you.

👍

Edited previous post...had forgotten to add it!

 

Dave.

[Tomb1302]

Just now, Dave66 said:

👍

Edited previous post...had forgotten to add it!

 

Dave.

Thank you Dave!

 

Much appreciated!

[Dave66]

Just in case you get to the library, there is a large family tree for him here.

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/156681872/person/222061892733/facts?_phsrc=tZQ3&_phstart=successSource

 

 

[Tomb1302]

4 minutes ago, Dave66 said:

Just in case you get to the library, there is a large family tree for him here.

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/156681872/person/222061892733/facts?_phsrc=tZQ3&_phstart=successSource

 

 

Much appreciated Dave!

[clk]

Hi Tomb1302,

 

1 hour ago, charlie962 said:

He appears as wounded in the Daily Casualty List of 13/9/17 suggesting actual wounding a month earlier. Doesn't say which Battalion

 

He has a 'hospital' admission/discharge record on Findmypast (link) which reads as:

 

First name(s): V

Last name: Fagence

Service number: 10081

Rank: Private

Unit: Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment)*

Admitted to 11 Casualty Clearing Station 1.8.1917. Discharged to 26 Ambulance Train 2.8.1917

Ailment: "GSW abdomen & hand R"

 

*In the register, it shows him as an 11th Battalion man. I don't know how that squares with his medal roll record though. 

Image sourced from Findmypast

 

Regards

Chris

[Tomb1302]

10 minutes ago, clk said:

Hi Tomb1302,

 

 

He has a 'hospital' admission/discharge record on Findmypast (link) which reads as:

 

First name(s): V

Last name: Fagence

Service number: 10081

Rank: Private

Unit: Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment)*

Admitted to 11 Casualty Clearing Station 1.8.1917. Discharged to 26 Ambulance Train 2.8.1917

Ailment: "GSW abdomen & hand R"

 

*In the register, it shows him as an 11th Battalion man. I don't know how that squares with his medal roll record though. 

Image sourced from Findmypast

 

Regards

Chris

Chris,

 

This information falls right in line with everything that's been found so far, further cementing the collective research everyone has put in.

 

Thank you all - This isn't even a relative of mine, and I am touched by the reception and response I got.

 

Cheers all.

[charlie962]

12 minutes ago, clk said:

In the register, it shows him as an 11th Battalion man. I don't know how that squares with his medal roll record though. 

Could be a transcription error in the Register found by Chris ?. There are loads of 10th and 11th Bn men of RWS  etc (all 41st Div) in the surrounding pages of that date.

[Pat Atkins]

Might be irrelevant, in which case do please ignore, but...

 

Any relation to Sydney Fagence, an old soldier (3rd Hussars) who enlisted in The Queen's in August 1914, then was transferred to Suffolks, Northamptons and Labour Corps? I only ask because he has a service record on Ancestry I came across while looking for your man, he came from Surrey, and it's an uncommon name. Sydney F was born in Chertsey, married to Kate and had 4 kids (one called Maurice Edgar Fagence, maybe just coincidence). Was 38 in 1914 and living in Woking, seems to have been a Boer War veteran.

 

Anyway, good luck! Pat

[Tomb1302]

5 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said:

Might be irrelevant, in which case do please ignore, but...

 

Any relation to Sydney Fagence, an old soldier (3rd Hussars) who enlisted in The Queen's in August 1914, then was transferred to Suffolks, Northamptons and Labour Corps? I only ask because he has a service record on Ancestry I came across while looking for your man, he came from Surrey, and it's an uncommon name. Sydney F was born in Chertsey, married to Kate and had 4 kids (one called Maurice Edgar Fagence, maybe just coincidence). Was 38 in 1914 and living in Woking, seems to have been a Boer War veteran.

 

Anyway, good luck! Pat

Pat,

 

My friend mentions a 'Christoper' and a 'Harold', but no Sydney.

 

I will ask as soon as I see her next!

 

Thank you!

[charlie962]

The Census 1911 for Church Farm Pyrford has the family with Victor,13,  and Harold,19,(who was wounded with the RWS in 1918) but no mention of a Christopher. There's alo an Arthur,24, and Sidney,11.  There are a number of Surrey Mirror or Surrey Advertiser references for George, the father, including his death in 1913.

 

I couldn't see Victor on the 1939 Register. Was he back in the military ? Might there be an MoD retained Service File (nothing obvious on the Ancestry index for Fagence) ?

 

Charlie

[Tomb1302]

@Pat Atkins

 

She has told me that he did indeed have a relative 'Sidney Fagence' born in Pyford, Surrey.

 

Not sure that'll help much, but I suppose it eases the 'confusion'? Although, the names are spelled differently according to what you and I have.

 

Odd.

[Chris_Baker]

I presume you are aware that his memoirs are held at the Imperial War Museum. 

[Tomb1302]

6 minutes ago, Chris_Baker said:

I presume you are aware that his memoirs are held at the Imperial War Museum. 

Chris,

 

I am, thank you. I have been provided his voice recordings of the war.

 

Unless I paid no attention to the Museum page and all his information was already there, I can at the very least consider this an enjoyable activity with the community.

Edited 24 July , 2019 by Tomb1302