Queries on a Croix de Guerre Medal awarded for action April 1918

[charlie962]

5 hours ago, MaxD said:

A Battery.

Max, Thanks for the reply re Squire. (edit again--I see that on the day his CdeG was for being runner between 38Bde and French 266 Field Regt, as were the other two runners listed in 38 Bde War Diary. Shows how Service Records don't tell the full story)

What is 'A Battery' ? edit, Ah- was there A, 24,72 and D making up 38 Bde ?

 

Edit again- I've understood!

Edited 19 July , 2019 by charlie962
To keep bits about Squire in one post

[charlie962]

Very interesting to read the 38 Bde War Diary and all those CdeG citations. (Max, your additional research comments are very helpful).

 

I can see some basis for the original contention, but:

 

It is clear that the 'Commanding Officers' of all four Batteries in the Brigade were awarded the CdeG with the same citation and for the same period 23/4-1/5/18. Otherwise awards seem to have gone to Bde HQ and liason with French apart from one or two specific acts. So it does seem that  the 'battery commander'  picked up the representative award.  It thus comes down to who should be designated the 'battery commander' for this time period

 

The War Diary shows casualties occuring in the period up to and including 30/4 but with the heaviest being 25/4.  Kaye was appointed to temp command some time during the 25/4.

 

-Was Holmes 72 battery commander 23/4-25/4, then incapacitaded, covered by Brockway in turn incapacitated then Kaye takes over 25/4-1/5?

 

-As Max has pointed out, we were not there, but to be fair to Kaye, did Kaye do any less than the other 3 battery commanders during the citation period ?

 

-It is clear that 72 Bty suffered great casualties in officers but does that automatically mean that the battery officers should have received more awards ?

 

-There may well be 72 Bty officers who didn't get full recognition of their acts but sadly that often was the case. I suspect it has to be looked at in that light rather than thinking Kaye didn't deserve any award or he assumed someone elses ?

 

Charlie

 

PS.  the French 266° RAC (Field Artillery Regiment), with whom the 38th Army Bde RFA worked, did get a Fourragère with ' citation à l'ordre de l'Armée'.

 

 

Edited 19 July , 2019 by charlie962

[womba]

 

To Max's " It would be nice to know whether our work has now satisfied your query."

 

Of course I acknowledge you seem to have done all that is humanly possible  and I am grateful for that. It is much more than I could have managed alone. Some of what I have learned will be added to my own online family history.

 

But it seems my original query will remain a mystery and perhaps that is the way it should be. So both the Kaye's and the Brockway's can enjoy their own versions of history.

[MaxD]

Womba

 

Your last line is most welcome.  You have had the facts presented and some additional info and interpretations provided.  It is solely up to you to decide how they fit with your own family's stories.

 

Worth adding that I have found it a most interesting little project to work on.

 

I am following up for interest the side issue of the "award of the Legion d'Honneur" to the brigade referred to in the CWGC entry for Lt Col Hood with the RA Historical Society.  I'll post what ever comes out of that in due course.

 

Max

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

In rugby, it's the guy who crosses the line with ball who gets his name on the scoreboard.

Who now remembers Bennett, Williams, Pullin, Dawes, David & Quinnell?

 

Edited 20 July , 2019 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr

[wandererpaul]

It’s been a fascinating story to read and follow. Way out of my league, regarding searches for the diaries etc and the interpretation of it all.

 

It’s always best to be open with what you’re looking for on here. Winkling our those names has broadened everyone’s eyes and minds. Adding to the family story. The new facts and timelines can sit alongside your own personal transcripts and can be interpreted how people see fit.

 

The knowledge of the people on here and the openness of their assistance is greatly appreciated.

 

You'll never know for sure if your ancestor should’ve been recognised with an award, such as the C de G. Kaye was acknowledged, as he was there too, alongside many other brave souls.

 

The MC, we now know, was a Birthday Honours award. Therefore, the recognition of Kaye’s actions throughout the War. That cannot be disputed.

 

Best of luck writing all of this up!

[MaxD]

Link to page 415 in the Edmond's Military Operations in France and Belgium 1918 Vol ii, footnote.

 

https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.210684/page/n507

 

Max