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Remembered Today:

tony.vds

Shrouds of the Somme

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tony.vds

Am I the only one to find this project quite disturbing?

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DavidOwen

I think it is a worthwhile project.

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Steven Broomfield

It's been discussed on the Forum previously ut my abilities with the search facility are singularly poor.

 

That said, I saw it in Exeter in the summer and my wife and daughter, and my daughter's boyfriend, all found it rather moving.

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Ken Lees

I walked past it a few times recently at Thiepval. Like the previous "artistic interpretation" in the same location I don't like it at all and won't go near it.

 

Each to their own, but for me it adds nothing to what is already there and I wish it was elsewhere - somewhere even easier to ignore.

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Gunga Din

Shrouds: the original Shroud website had all the numbers wrong - something that even the tabloid journalists have managed to avoid doing in the past 4 years - , which suggests they had more of an eye on other things rather than historical accuracy. The First Day of the Battles of the Somme (to give it its correct title) represents less than a fraction of 1% of all UK men killed, or wounded and a lot less of that fraction of the Canadians, Newfoundlanders, Australians, Newzealanders, Indians, South Africans, West Africans, East Africans, West Indians and Nepalis who stood shoulder to shoulder with the UK for the best part of 4 years in often squalid conditions.

 

It is a small event in the context of the Great War that has taken on supernatural significance in the minds of the media that subordinates the enormous contribution of the Commonwealth to second place. It does not represent in any form the memorialisation of the Great War other than these unfortunate 0.3% of UK fatalities and less than 0.2% of those of the so-called Empire. By any measure it is a peculiar focal point.. ...For the families and descendants of the 99.9% of men who did not die in the shrouded fields of the First Day of the Somme, the symbolization becomes meaningless. 

 

The Sea of Poppies on the other hand was visually stunning and universal in its embrace...also (importantly) it embraces the Commonwealth (old 'Empire') - something the Shrouds project singularly fails to do. One would like to see a permanent installation - just one, maybe at Kew or Windsor or the Arboretum - to permanently mark the Centenary and then hopefully all the other rather grisly attempts at re-memorializing something that has already been memorialized for 100 years will slowly be dismantled. 

 

Gunga Din

Edited by Gunga Din

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Steven Broomfield

Nice to have you back, Martin.

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derekb

 I saw an article about this on the news and I think it is in poor taste, bearing in mind that I am a “one off” 

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squirrel

Mawkish in the extreme.

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hazelclark

Good grief! What next? One shouldn’t be surprised though.  The Centenary has thrown up some tacky junk and padded diaries. I bought some of the latter before realizing that it might be better to do a bit of research before hitting the “buy now” button.

 

Having said that, I did buy a Passchendaele Poppy from the British Legion which I understand was made from old shell casings and soil from Ypres. Each pin was named to a particular soldier who died there, and (in my opinion)was in keeping with the sentiment the poppy portrays. I assume they didn’t discriminate on the basis of race if the soldier was in the British Army. Just liked the idea of having something for myself to commemorate the Centenary.  However, I remember a thread about “posh poppies”so they may not be to everyone’s taste either.  Missed out on the Tower Poppies.

 

The picture of the man holding the doll or whatever it is, is enough to make one want to throw up.

 

Hazel C.

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PhilB

I wonder what the artist`s motives are in cases such as this. Self gratification, irresistible artistic expression or philanthropy?

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David Filsell

Clearly the 'artist, is going for the Turdner Prize. Tasteless, thoughtless, pointless all come to mind - but I someone, somewhere must think it art!. I think a parody of commemoration - waste of time, effort and space

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Steven Broomfield

Out of interest, apart from being the only person to not hate the things, am I also the only person actually to have seen them in the flesh, so to speak?

 

Is that a coincidence?

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Gareth Davies

No. Yes.

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RaySearching
9 minutes ago, Steven Broomfield said:

Out of interest, apart from being the only person to not hate the things, am I also the only person actually to have seen them in the flesh, so to speak?

 

Is that a coincidence?

 

Now did you buy one at £95.00

and line the artist's pockets, Oh nearly forgot a small percentage is going to good causes so its alright then

 

 

Its just me being cynical again

 

 

Edited by RaySearching

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hazelclark
14 minutes ago, Steven Broomfield said:

Out of interest, apart from being the only person to not hate the things, am I also the only person actually to have seen them in the flesh, so to speak?

 

Is that a coincidence?

Ahem! Maybe!  However, I have to say my first reaction on looking at the link, was revulsion, although not for for any deeper reason than that. Maybe it seemed better in the flesh?? I have also become fed up with some of the other stuff that has been spewed out in the name of “commemoration “

H.

Edited by hazelclark

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RaySearching
5 hours ago, PhilB said:

I wonder what the artist`s motives are in cases such as this. Self gratification, irresistible artistic expression or philanthropy?

 

Artists fees money,money.money 

 

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squirrel
2 minutes ago, RaySearching said:

 

Artists fees money,money.money 

 

 

6 hours ago, PhilB said:

I wonder what the artist`s motives are in cases such as this. Self gratification, irresistible artistic expression or philanthropy?

All of the above.

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Ken Lees
26 minutes ago, Steven Broomfield said:

Out of interest, apart from being the only person to not hate the things, am I also the only person actually to have seen them in the flesh, so to speak?

 

Is that a coincidence?

 

No.

 

Probably.

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hazelclark
2 minutes ago, squirrel said:

 

All of the above.

I don’t think that is entirely fair. I am sure some of them are motivated by higher ideals, but there has been just too much stuff that has nothing to recommend it. I did, however, wonder how much the Passchendaele Poppy raised for the Legion compared with the creator. In this latest case the same question might be of interest.

Hazel

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Steven Broomfield
1 hour ago, Gareth Davies said:

No. Yes.

 

Have you seen them?

 

Has anyone else seen them?

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RaySearching
1 hour ago, hazelclark said:

I did, however, wonder how much the Passchendaele Poppy raised for the Legion compared with the creator. In this latest case the same question might be of interest.

 

Here is a rough breakdown

Paul Cummins Ceramics Blood Swept Lands and seas of Red C.I.C Ltd

Total realised from sales                     23,024,304

During the period  services and

 goods were supplied by the

following parties relating to installation

 costs                                                    

Paul Cummins Ceramics Limited        7,175,526

Historic Royal Palaces                        1,360.000

 

Distributed to charitable causes           8,422,916

 

breakdown.JPG.a31ae7bc0c94ec86babdf83b9e2a4ca5.JPG

 

So a little over a third went to charitable causes

 

How much profit did Paul Cummins make from the enterprise "he's not saying"

 

Now how much will the creator of the figurines make,  I assume he's not saying either

 

 

Ray

 

 

 

 

 

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Gareth Davies

I haven't but in one of the photographs of them that I saw online there were definitely people looking at them ;-)

 

1 hour ago, Steven Broomfield said:

Out of interest, apart from being the only person to not hate the things, am I also the only person actually to have seen them in the flesh, so to speak?

 

Is that a coincidence?

 

25 minutes ago, Steven Broomfield said:

 

Have you seen them?

 

Has anyone else seen them?

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squirrel
1 hour ago, hazelclark said:

I don’t think that is entirely fair. I am sure some of them are motivated by higher ideals, but there has been just too much stuff that has nothing to recommend it. I did, however, wonder how much the Passchendaele Poppy raised for the Legion compared with the creator. In this latest case the same question might be of interest.

Hazel

I agree with your comment "but there has been just too much stuff that has nothing to recommend it". There is a vast industry in "remembrance" items that do not provide any donations to Service Charities and some of it is complete tat, some mawkish in the extreme. Just a money making exercise for those making and selling it.

I just do not understand the concept behind Shrouds of the Somme and find it mawkish and in poor taste.

 I'll stop there, but if I see or hear Binyon's, "They shall grow not old" misquoted again I shall probably need therapy...

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