FatkatnJulie Posted 18 March , 2018 Share Posted 18 March , 2018 Hi iv just got this 1907 bayonet are these marking on the pommel regiment markings if so anybody know what regiment,thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatkatnJulie Posted 18 March , 2018 Author Share Posted 18 March , 2018 It looks like . 2 R SUS . 110 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 18 March , 2018 Share Posted 18 March , 2018 55 minutes ago, FatkatnJulie said: It looks like . 2 R SUS . 110 2nd battalion Royal Sussex Regt? Rack No. 110. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatkatnJulie Posted 18 March , 2018 Author Share Posted 18 March , 2018 Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibre792x57.y Posted 19 March , 2018 Share Posted 19 March , 2018 Another P.'07 with Regimental Stamps - I have previously shown one c/w a first pattern frog. That was marked to R.B.(Rifle Brigade) and was dated throughout; bayonet scabbard and frog to 1909. The new acquisition is marked to the Coldstream Guards, C.G. over A 651. This puzzles me a little as it cannot be a Company No. - too high. Must be a rack number. The first was made by Sanderson and the scabbard by HGR, and this one is. typical of manufacture at RSAF Enfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibre792x57.y Posted 19 March , 2018 Share Posted 19 March , 2018 (edited) So the first gives me a an early (1909) commercial specimen in a Mk 1 scabbard with frog, now the new acquisition is Government Arsenal made in a Mk2 scabbard. Note the typical Enfield shading of the hilt blueing into the blade ricasso. The bayonet is dated March 1911 and the Enfield made scabbard is dated 1912. Both Regimentally stamped. Sommewalker Edited 19 March , 2018 by calibre792x57.y Correct a mistype. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibre792x57.y Posted 19 March , 2018 Share Posted 19 March , 2018 Just in case anyone is wondering about the first- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 19 March , 2018 Share Posted 19 March , 2018 (edited) On 3/18/2018 at 09:29, FatkatnJulie said: It looks like . 2 R SUS . 110 The official ‘Instructions to Armourers ‘ of 1897 & 1912 both give the abbreviation as ‘SX’ only. The 2nd Battn was a regular army unit, so the Armourer is very unlikely to have strayed from the official requirements. That said, it’s hard to see what else it could mean. Does anyone have a copy of the 1931 Instructions to check whether the abbreviation was changed ? Regards, JMB Edited 19 March , 2018 by JMB1943 Add info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 19 March , 2018 Share Posted 19 March , 2018 4 hours ago, JMB1943 said: The official ‘Instructions to Armourers ‘ of 1897 & 1912 both give the abbreviation as ‘SX’ only. The 2nd Battn was a regular army unit, so the Armourer is very unlikely to have strayed from the official requirements. That said, it’s hard to see what else it could mean. Does anyone have a copy of the 1931 Instructions to check whether the abbreviation was changed ? Regards, JMB I think they must have changed at some time, being as though there's a 37 inspection stamp it may well be a later unit marking...I have a 1907 marked WORC DEP, Worcesters should officially be W.R., that also has plenty of late 30's inspection stamps. Cant seem to find a later instructions for armourers online that has the relevant lists. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 25 March , 2018 Share Posted 25 March , 2018 On 3/18/2018 at 16:29, FatkatnJulie said: It looks like . 2 R SUS . 110 On 3/18/2018 at 17:27, GWF1967 said: 2nd battalion Royal Sussex Regt? Rack No. 110. On 3/19/2018 at 20:51, JMB1943 said: The official ‘Instructions to Armourers ‘ of 1897 & 1912 both give the abbreviation as ‘SX’ only. The 2nd Battn was a regular army unit, so the Armourer is very unlikely to have strayed from the official requirements. That said, it’s hard to see what else it could mean. Does anyone have a copy of the 1931 Instructions to check whether the abbreviation was changed ? There are things I don't like about this marking... JMB has pointed out it is not the WW1 regulation mark for the Sussex regiment, and it lacks also the 'full stops' found on almost all regimental markings. I don't have any knowledege of the post WW1 marking system either, but I would be surprised if it did not match the earlier systems... I suppose the 'R' could be 'Resreve', but even so - the 'SU' seems wrong... Does the bayonet have a firm known history? If not, especially given the '37 marking, I do wonder if the markings have been added at a later date than when the bayonet was made - what is the date on the ricasso? I can't quite make it out... This could have been done to add value as the 2nd Sussex was at the Battle of Mons. Just my opinion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 25 March , 2018 Share Posted 25 March , 2018 (edited) Trajan, I agree with your observation regarding the lack of full stops to denote an abbreviation. Dave66, I have seen recently a P. ‘07 marked DEP. over ESX. (for the Essex Regt. ) over 18; this did have the full-stops in place. However, the D was in a considerably larger font than the other capitals. What is the status of your WORC DEP ? If these are legitimate Armourer’s markings, I think we would expect a consistent format, Regt & Depot or Depot & Regt., but not both. Regards, JMB Edited 25 March , 2018 by JMB1943 Add info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 25 March , 2018 Share Posted 25 March , 2018 7 minutes ago, JMB1943 said: Trajan, I agree with your observation regarding the lack of full stops to denote an abbreviation. Dave66, I have seen recently a P. ‘07 marked DEP. over ESX. (for the Essex ) over 18; this did have the full-stops in place. However, the D was in a considerably larger font than the other capitals. What is the status of your WORC DEP ? If these are legitimate Armourer’s markings, I think we would expect a consistent format, Regt & Depot or Depot & Regt., but not both. Regards, JMB Hello JMB, The Worcester one I have is a D.P. With numerous inspection stamps, but the latest being 38...pommel marking attached below. I have another, a Sanderson, with a production date of 5 17, with only one inspection stamp of 25...pommel stamped DEP WILTS 257 with no full stops. One of each to confuse things!, interesting though. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 25 March , 2018 Share Posted 25 March , 2018 Here's one of the DEP WILTS for comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 25 March , 2018 Share Posted 25 March , 2018 Dave, Thanks for posting these photos——although confusion reigns as a result!! I can almost imagine the armourer saying to himself, “ Hell, I’ve stamped DEP below REGT on a (dozen/hundred/thousand) bayos and left out all of the full stops. But what are they going to do ? Take away my dies and punches ?” Perhaps it would not be treated so lightly. Would any ex-regular Army personnel care to comment ? Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 25 March , 2018 Share Posted 25 March , 2018 JMB, Certainly confusing, given how accurate they were during the Great War, it certainly proves they relaxed the rules in the twenties and thirties...I really can't see anybody faking pommel markings on depot bayonets, but it would still be interesting to see the a copy of instructions for armourers from say the late 30's to make a comparison if one became available. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark69 Posted 30 December , 2019 Share Posted 30 December , 2019 Hi just wondering what regiment , unit these marking are thanks in advance LLP SK 115 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 Hello Mark69, Welcome to the forum. I cannot find anything in the Instructions for Armourers, 1912 that corresponds to those markings. Presumably these markings are on a Pattern 1907 bayonet; would you be able to post a photo of the pommel area? Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark69 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 Hello Mark, SK would indicate Suffolk Regiment, 115 would be the rack/weapon number...as for the LPP/LLP (not too clear to me anyway) not a clue I’m afraid. Dave. Happy new year to you all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark69 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 Thanks for your help Happy New Year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 Mark/Dave, It looks to me that LLP is actually a lightly struck DEP, = Depot. I think that we have had other DEP marked P.’07’s on here over the last year or two. A Happy New Year to all! Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 18 minutes ago, JMB1943 said: Mark/Dave, It looks to me that LLP is actually a lightly struck DEP, = Depot. I think that we have had other DEP marked P.’07’s on here over the last year or two. A Happy New Year to all! Regards, JMB I’ll go with that...Makes perfect sense JMB, Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 Dave, Thanks for the vote of confidence in my tired, old eyes! Good militaria-hunting in 2020. Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 31 December , 2019 Share Posted 31 December , 2019 JMB, I’m sure your eyes will be far better than mine in a few hours time, courtesy of a very large 1.5 litre bottle of red.😀. Best of luck to you also, just brought a very expensive frog and helve carrier so need to replenish funds. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msdt Posted 10 January , 2020 Share Posted 10 January , 2020 Happy New Year to all! Picking up on the original marking of R SUS, as well as WORC and WILTS and ESX, these are all stamped following the 1932 regulations. These regimental attributions represent the WW2 service of these WW1 produced bayonets. As WW1 (and earlier) regimental stampings mostly stopped in 1915 any 1907 bayonet with a later production date and a regimental mark is likely to have been done after WW1, and judging by the re-issue stamps often in the early 1930's. BTW the 1932 form for Suffolk is SUF. What year is your bayonet Mark? Are there any re-issue dates? Cheers, Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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