Spedini Posted 14 January , 2014 Share Posted 14 January , 2014 l bought this fine revolver a few years ago.It`s a French m/1873 revolver sold to Swedish Navy 1884.Caliber is 11mm French ordnance.Very accurate with 10grains Swiss blackpowder.Enjoy pics! Fidde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Drill Posted 14 January , 2014 Share Posted 14 January , 2014 We'd call it MAS nowadays, (Maunfacture d'Armes St Etienne). UK residents can have one of these without restriction under the terms of section 58(2) of the current Firearms Act. Mustn't fire it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vectisitch Posted 15 January , 2014 Share Posted 15 January , 2014 11mm. bet that kicks well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 15 January , 2014 Share Posted 15 January , 2014 l bought this fine revolver a few years ago.It`s a French m/1873 revolver sold to Swedish Navy 1884.Caliber is 11mm French ordnance.Very accurate with 10grains Swiss blackpowder.Enjoy pics! Fidde Fidde, A very nice revolver, looks somewhat like the Webley RIC. Regards, LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadin Posted 16 January , 2014 Share Posted 16 January , 2014 The French were just a little anal when it came to marking this revolver. Here is a short example of what I found with mine..... http://deadin.info/webpics/M1873 However the German revo;vers of thesame period even had the charge holes numbered 1 thru 6....... (I guess that was to make it clear where to start with a reload....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 17 January , 2014 Share Posted 17 January , 2014 11mm. bet that kicks well Shouldn't've thought so with 10 grains of black. I'd thought Fidde's load was a civilised target practice load until I dug into the cartridge a bit, and it turns out that this was the original service load, delivering a ft.lb. energy in the low 70s - similar to a .25 ACP, and less than a good .22 rimfire round. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radlad Posted 17 January , 2014 Share Posted 17 January , 2014 Shouldn't've thought so with 10 grains of black. I'd thought Fidde's load was a civilised target practice load until I dug into the cartridge a bit, and it turns out that this was the original service load, delivering a ft.lb. energy in the low 70s - similar to a .25 ACP, and less than a good .22 rimfire round. Regards, MikB You sure you got those figures right Mik? I have never loaded for or fired one but always believed it was about equal to a .44 Russian, very similar to the 11mm German service (which I have used) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 17 January , 2014 Share Posted 17 January , 2014 You sure you got those figures right Mik? I have never loaded for or fired one but always believed it was about equal to a .44 Russian, very similar to the 11mm German service (which I have used) Hi Radlad, Take a look here:- http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30026713 and here:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/11mm_French_Ordnance The original load does appear to have been superseded by something a bit pokier, but according to other sources this wasn't produced in volume, forcing users to revert to the original. Unless the revolver was weak in construction (which by all accounts it certainly isn't) it should be possible to load to match .44 Russian or Reichsrevolver performance, even though the case is short. Regards, MikB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radlad Posted 18 January , 2014 Share Posted 18 January , 2014 Mmmm, done a bit of research of my own and it bears out your posts Mik. I could probably do better with a 180gr ball and a catapult Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 11 July , 2015 Share Posted 11 July , 2015 I have always liked the looks of the M1873, a nice rugged looking revolver of the colonial thru ww2 period, it had a surprising long service life, does anyone have a photograph of the GW military holster that was designed for this revolver? thanks khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 15 July , 2015 Share Posted 15 July , 2015 As to the ballistics of these revolvers, the closest comparison would be the old .44 Smith and Wesson American according to Cartridges of the World. The 11mm French Ordnance Revolver fired a 180gr. lead bullet at a muzzle velocity of 695fps. for 195fp of energy. It probably used around 20-25gr of black powder and the original bullet was a pointy cone shape that most likely tumbled on impact. Suitable cases can probably be made from modern .44 S&W spl. but I believe it requires a .451" heel type bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 15 July , 2015 Share Posted 15 July , 2015 Thanks Stubby, At present I have one of these 1873's sitting in my local gun shop, should pick it up in about a week or so, I hadn't thought about shooting it, as far as I know no one makes the cases and I believe that it can be achieved by shaving down 44? cal cases. I still hand load a number of loads and may investigate the feasibility. My gun was made about 1876 based on the series prefix and serial number, As it is all matching I consider it a black powder revolver. I will post a photo later. Regarding the holster, I just like to have a simple set , pistol, holster, and lanyard. khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 15 July , 2015 Share Posted 15 July , 2015 Loading for one of these would be a chore. According to Cartridges of the World, cases can be made from .44 S&W spl, or .44 Russian. The bullet would be the problem as it was apparently a "heel" type like a .22rf. requiring a .451" bullet with a "heel" to fit into the .44 case. I would say if anyone makes such a mold it would be, Accurate bullet mold co. Either that, or a hollow base bullet, like a Minie that would expand into the grooves upon firing. "Heel" type centerfire ammunition was common in the 1870's with the .38 Colt being one that's still encountered from time to time in the old "Lightning" revolvers and the U.S. Army models of the 1890's.. Modern ammunition uses a .358" bullet, but the bores on the old Colt.38's are closer to .375" requiring 148gr. hollow base wad cutter bullets to achieve any accuracy. The .41 Colt, and .44 S&W American are other examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 15 July , 2015 Share Posted 15 July , 2015 As for a holster, the best I can say is, watch Coleman's Surplus on line. They come up with all kinds of strange, out of the norm things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 15 July , 2015 Share Posted 15 July , 2015 Thanks Stubby, Very interesting data and tips, I think I may as well leave the M1873 unfired (by me) as the effort & expense involved is not worth the novelty of limited shooting in an obsolete caliber. Still a nice historical collectors revolver. Maybe someday someone will do a production run in that caliber. You sound very knowledgeable on cartridges, good to have another expert resource on board, welcome to the forum. regards khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 15 July , 2015 Share Posted 15 July , 2015 Thanks, I do a lot of casting and reloading, have quite a few books to refer to. I probably wouldn't shoot it either, but would keep an eye out for some cartridges just to have. Now a Riechs revolver, I probably would shoot, much easier to load ammo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 16 July , 2015 Share Posted 16 July , 2015 If anyone's interested, youtube has several videos on this revolver, and one where one is being fired. Simply enter a search for French 1873 revolver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gew98 Posted 16 July , 2015 Share Posted 16 July , 2015 11mm. bet that kicks well Actually they are very mild. I used to load and shoot for Reichsrevolvers and a glisenti wheelgun.... they are not much in the bang or kick but their large and slow lead "boolitz" make good close up stoppers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 17 July , 2015 Share Posted 17 July , 2015 I am not a ballistics expert by any means, but from years of experience a large caliber revolver does not necessarily equate with significant recoil, a lot of the energy is absorbed by a heavy frame revolver, and most of the larger side arms of the GW period fired a heavy bullet at a relatively slow speed. khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vectisitch Posted 18 July , 2015 Share Posted 18 July , 2015 am i right in thinking i can own one in the uk without a firearms licence?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dman Posted 18 July , 2015 Share Posted 18 July , 2015 11 mm French Ordnance 1873 Reference books list original load as 180 gr (11.7 gram) with 10 grains (.65 gram black powder) MV was only 430 fps - slow enough to be seen ME was only 73 ft lb Equivalent to .25 (6.35 mm) Auto Was modified in 1890 by using hollow base bullet of 160 -164 grains (10.6 grams) Power charge increased to 12 grains (.80 grams) MV was up to 620 fps with ME boosted to 144 ft lb Equal to .32 (7.65 mm) Auto Many were dusted off in 1914 and issued to troops, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 29 July , 2015 Share Posted 29 July , 2015 .New family member from France, manufactured at St Etienne in 1876, all matching numbers, interesting M stamp on the right side of the frame below the hammer, Marine/Navy ? not too sure yet, what do members think? khaki Here is the 'M' stamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 29 July , 2015 Share Posted 29 July , 2015 .New family member from France, manufactured at St Etienne in 1876, all matching numbers, interesting M stamp on the right side of the frame below the hammer, Marine/Navy ? not too sure yet, what do members think? khaki khaki, A very nice looking revolver, and another addition to your collection which is rapidly growing. Regards, LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaki Posted 29 July , 2015 Share Posted 29 July , 2015 Many thanks LF, I certainly appreciate a compliment from you, especially having enjoyed looking at the fine quality of the weapons of your own collection that you have posted for our pleasure. regards khaki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Drill Posted 29 July , 2015 Share Posted 29 July , 2015 am i right in thinking i can own one in the uk without a firearms licence?? Yes. And it is a certificate, not a licence ! But beware, the police and Home Office people have "obsolete calibre" pistols in their sights (pun intended). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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