Four KRRC Riflemen

[rap1943]

Hello everybody

I wonder if anybody has or is researching any of the following men.

To my knowledge they all served in the 16Btn KRRC.

Henry Mallalieu (Harry Mallalien on MIC) C/515

Wilson Clegg C/549 (also MGC 26003)

Fred (Frederick) Fitton C/712

Ernest George Smith C/393 (died 28/1/1916)

Cheers

Bob Pearson

[rap1943]

In addition to the four names on my previous post above I now have a few more. They were Pals of my Dad, Frederick Pearson C/516 'B' Company 16Btn KRRC. Some of them were also in 'B' Company. Also some of them played football for the St Clements CLB team in Spotland, Rochdale where most of them lived I think.

C.T. Tweedale C/746 (dow 2/12/1917)

Frank Thompson C/551

Henry Taylor C/523 (dow 16/7/1916)

Ralph Rawstron (Rostron) C/513

F. Whitehead C/527 (dow 16/7/1917)

C. Turner C/392

I am looking for anybody who may have knowledge of any of these men as I am trying to build up a picture of this group of Pals (there may be more in the group).

Tried to attach a photo of the football team but failed miserably. I am just technologically dislexic I think.

Cheers

Bob Pearson

Melbourne

[harribobs]

Hi Bob

I can't help directly but I'm based in north manchester on the border with rochdale and my grandfather was 13th batt KRRC

bear it in mind if i can help

chris

[stiletto_33853]

Bob,

The C numbers you have given are all numbers denoting Church Lads Brigade

16th KRRC C/1 through C/1770+ original CLB enlistments

C/1770 to C/2999 CLB drafts

17th KRRC C/3000 through C/4745

18th KRRC C/6001 through C/8000

20th KRRC C/8001 through C/10000

C/10001 through C/12000 not used

21st KRRC C/12001 through C/13100

Try looking on The Long Long Trail for information on the Church Lads Brigade.

Hope this helps

Andy

[rap1943]

Chris and Andy

Thanks for your posts with info, guidance and offer of help. I may take you up on that one day Chris.

By the way Chris, do you ever get down to the NA in the big smoke?

Cheers

Bob

[harribobs]

Bob

Give me a shout whenever

not as yet been to the NA , but i'm building myself up for it, Andy managed to get the info on my GF for me, but i am told his unit history is there and well worth reading!

cheers

chris

[stiletto_33853]

Just read an interesting article re the KRRC and the early prefix some with regard to the Church Lads Brigade which might be of interest. The article is in the OMRS Journal of summer 1994 and is by Paul Reed.

Mortenson was right to suggest that the "C" Prefix was initially used for the 16th (Church Lads Brigade) Battalion KRRC; the sample clearly shows the first numbers used in this prefix were men who enlisted on 19th September 1914, the date of formation for the 16th Battalion. The Sample cleary shows that with so many new army battalions already formed, the 16th had problems in filling out its establishment : Not even a thousand men had enlisted within a month of formation. Compare this to one of the K1 Battalions, who could boast a thousand enlistments within 10 days in August 1914.

By the close of 1914 the 16th (CLB) KRRC had all but recruited a full establishment, but from the sample it seems the "C" Prefix was to be used alongside the "R" Prefix, as the 17th, 18th and 19th Battalions were formed in 1915. These men, although given a "C" Prefix, would have had no connection with the Church Lads Brigade.

Andy

[stiletto_33853]

A scan of the sample given

[rap1943]

Thanks Andy, the depth of knowledge on this forum continues to amaze me.

Cheers

Bob

[Mark Abbott]

Bob,

I am currently researching C410 Pte Samuel Ball, who won an MM with the 16th KRRC at (I think) High Wood.

Pte Ball was born and enlisted in Wigan. Unfortunately he was killed on 24 March 1918 and is buried at Ypres Reservoir Cemetery. It would appear he enlisted on the 21st August 1914 and first went to France on 16.11.1915.

Do you know if a nominal roll has survived?

Mark

[rap1943]

Hi Mark

I don't know anything about a nominal roll perhaps some of the more knowledgable blokes than me on this forum may be able to help.

In reference to the thread you started on Samuel Ball on 11 Nov, I have looked at my diary sections and they only go up to April 1916 which is a bit early for high wood. I'm hoping to get the full diary soon. I will look then.

Bob

[Mark Abbott]

Bob,

Thanks for that. I have also ordered a copy of the War Diary for the relevant period in the hope that Ball is mentioned.

I will keep you informed

Mark

[Audax]

C-527 Frank Whitehead, Died of Wounds 16th July 1916. Aged 25 years. Member of St Clement, Spotland, Rochdale C.L.B. Lived at 218 Spotland Road. Married with one Child aged 14 months old. Attended St Clement's Sunday School.

C-712 Pte F Fitton M.M. returned to the C.L.B. as Adjtant of 7th (Rochdale) Battalion of the Manchester Diocesan Regiment during the 1930s-40s.

[Sgt_Hazell_Great_Grandson]

C-527 Frank Whitehead, Died of Wounds 16th July 1916. Aged 25 years.  Member of St Clement, Spotland, Rochdale C.L.B. Lived at 218 Spotland Road.  Married with one Child aged 14 months old. Attended St Clement's Sunday School.

C-712 Pte F Fitton M.M. returned to the C.L.B. as Adjtant of 7th (Rochdale) Battalion of the Manchester Diocesan Regiment during the 1930s-40s.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hullo Audax.

Do you have any info on Sgt. William Hazell , KRRC , C250 , 16th Church Lads.

My GGF.

Thanks for any help.

Roland.

[rap1943]

Hi Audax

I really must check this site more often, I nearly missed your post.

Thanks for that info on Frank Whitehead & Fred Fitton. Do you have more on the CLB at St Clements?

Cheers

Bob

[Audax]

Hullo Audax.

Do you have any info on Sgt. William Hazell , KRRC , C250 , 16th Church Lads.

My GGF.

Thanks for any help.

Roland.

Found on abebooks.com 'With the C.L.B.Battalion in France' by the Reverend James Duncan (The Chaplain) Book Description: Skeffington & Son Ltd, London, United Kingdom, 1917. Binding is Hard Cover. Book Condition: Very Good. in No Dust Jacket. First Edition. in No Dust Jacket A record of the Church Lads Brigade, part of the King's Royal Rifles formed during the First World War, which fought on the Western Front. Includes 1 folding b/w photograph. xvi + 106pp. Red cloth boards with light fade to spine. A photograph of this book is available on request. First Edition. Binding is Hard Cover. 12mo - over 6¾" - 7¾" tall. Bookseller Inventory # 38082

The book dealer is based in Wellingborough, Northants. U.K

Cost....................£95.00........................

[Audax]

Hullo Audax.

Do you have any info on Sgt. William Hazell , KRRC , C250 , 16th Church Lads.

My GGF.

Thanks for any help.

Roland.

Roland,

Sorry I haven't anything on Sgt Hazell; but here's a list of Buglers who went to France in 1915. ( I have had a look at your other posts).

Info mostly from SDGW/ CWGC and MICs.

C/604 Bugler W Adams. Trans to Labour Corps 9.4.19

C/418 Bugler Alfred L Barlow. Discharged 23.5.19

C/676 Bugler John H Harrison. Discharged 19.3.19

C/589 Bugler Arnold Ingham. K in A 15.7.16 (High Wood) Age 21 (Born St Peter’s Ashton-U-Lyne) Son of John and Emily Ingham of 70, Marlborough Street, Ryecroft, Ashton-under Lyne. (Thiepval Memorial). (MIC shows Private)

C/193 Bugler William Nightingale. Discharged 17.2.19

C/678 Bugler Richard Coote Southwell. K in A 28.1.16 (Born Pontefract, Yorks. Enlisted Pontefract. Son Richard Coote Southwell and Lily Southwell of Mill Lane, Pontefract, Yorks. (Loos Memorial).

C/658 Bugler Frank Stanier. Enlisted 23.9.14 Discharged 4.4.18 Trench Feet.

C/406 Bugler Stanley O Webb. Enlisted 21.9.14. Discharged 21.3.17. Wounds (Glastonbury).

[Sgt_Hazell_Great_Grandson]

Roland,

Sorry I haven't anything on Sgt Hazell; but here's a list of Buglers who went to France in 1915. ( I have had a look at your other posts).

Info mostly from SDGW/ CWGC and MICs.

C/604 Bugler W Adams. Trans to Labour Corps 9.4.19

C/418 Bugler Alfred L Barlow. Discharged 23.5.19

C/676 Bugler John H Harrison. Discharged 19.3.19

C/589 Bugler Arnold Ingham. K in A 15.7.16 (High Wood) Age 21 (Born St Peter’s Ashton-U-Lyne) Son of John and Emily Ingham of 70, Marlborough Street, Ryecroft, Ashton-under Lyne. (Thiepval Memorial). (MIC shows Private)

C/193 Bugler William Nightingale. Discharged 17.2.19

C/678 Bugler Richard Coote Southwell. K in A 28.1.16 (Born Pontefract, Yorks. Enlisted Pontefract. Son Richard Coote Southwell and Lily Southwell of Mill Lane, Pontefract, Yorks. (Loos Memorial).

C/658 Bugler Frank Stanier. Enlisted 23.9.14 Discharged 4.4.18 Trench Feet.

C/406 Bugler Stanley O Webb. Enlisted 21.9.14. Discharged 21.3.17. Wounds (Glastonbury).

Thanks for this. I have just received another fine pic of the 16th KRRC C.L.B. band in training soon after their formation in detailed close-up.

I have pics of just the buglars but this is the only one of the entire band. Will post when i get a chance to scan.

Regards,

Roland.

[johnreed]

Perhaps I am missing something, I am researching A/200268 Rfn Arthur Edward Gains 16Bn Kings Royal Rifle Corps who was KIA 12 October 1918.

I am somewhat bemused by the prefix C

John

[Audax]

johnreed said:

Perhaps I am missing something, I am researching A/200268 Rfn Arthur Edward Gains 16Bn Kings Royal Rifle Corps who was KIA 12 October 1918.

I am somewhat bemused by the prefix C

John

John

Have a look at

Previous posts Church Lads Brigade, 16th Kings Royal Rifle Corps, 16th KRRC.

[MBrockway]

Found on abebooks.com 'With the C.L.B.Battalion in France' by the Reverend James Duncan (The Chaplain) Book Description: Skeffington & Son Ltd, London, United Kingdom, 1917. Binding is Hard Cover. Book Condition: Very Good. in No Dust Jacket. First Edition. in No Dust Jacket A record of the Church Lads Brigade, part of the King's Royal Rifles formed during the First World War, which fought on the Western Front. Includes 1 folding b/w photograph. xvi + 106pp. Red cloth boards with light fade to spine. A photograph of this book is available on request. First Edition. Binding is Hard Cover. 12mo - over 6¾" - 7¾" tall. Bookseller Inventory # 38082

The book dealer is based in Wellingborough, Northants. U.K

Cost....................£95.00........................

Pals,

I have just managed to get hold of this book - luckily for a lot less than £95 LOL!

A quick dip suggests it's quite interesting, but only covers 1915 and 1916. The frontispiece is a large photo of 16/KRRC on parade - presumably before embarking - sadly however not brilliantly clear

I'll put more detail onto the Forum once I've read it! Particularly my views on its usefulness as a reference resource. Once I've finished it, I'll also be happy to look anything up.

As some of you know, my grandfather served in this battalion after being transferred from 12/KRRC.

Cheers,

Mark

[rap1943]

Hi Mark, how are you?

I will certainly be interested in what you have to say about the book and in particular if there is anything about the people I'm interested in.

Cheers from a cold Melbourne

[snailybailey]

Hi Mark,

Just piggy Backing onto this thread!! I read with interest that you have this book. I am researching a CLB casualty and wondered if there is any reference to him in the book or even a photograph?

His details are below:

Rifleman C/1281 James Arncliffe Burdon

16th Bttn KRRC

KIA 15/07/16

Aged 17

Son of Tom and Jane E. Burdon, of 56, Durham Rd., Stockton-on-Tees

CWGC link = http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_detail...casualty=552716

I'd be grateful for ANY info about him or the Battalion.

Kind regards

Glyn

[MBrockway]

Hi Mark, how are you?

I will certainly be interested in what you have to say about the book and in particular if there is anything about the people I'm interested in.

Cheers from a cold Melbourne

Hi there too Bob! I'm well ... but getting very frustrated by a truculent computer!

Sorry to be slow replying, but I had thought that my earlier post was not successful! There were gremlins having a party with the site that day - that's why there's the gobbledegook second post. I abandoned the post with the intention of coming back to it when I'd actually read the book

Only spotted the two posts had in fact appeared when I was going through my more recent posts!

I'm going to write the names of your blokes on a bookmark and keep a good look out for them as I read it. Glyn, I'll do the same for your man too.

There are definitely a few names sprinkled through the text, but it's by no means a comprehensive war diary.

Glyn, sorry to say there's only the one photo in the book - a frontispiece picture of the battalion formed up for review, presumably just before embarking for France. It's too fuzzy to recognise individual men though.

Bob, sorry to hear of the Melbourne cold - but have you had the precious rain you need yet??

Cheers to all!

Mark

[rap1943]

Hi Mark

Thanks for looking out for my men.

As I type, at 8.45 am, it is raining and has been most of the night on and off. However it is not enough as our dams are still only just under 30% full.

Cheers

Bob