Old Featherbed Posted 11 June , 2007 Share Posted 11 June , 2007 Which unit is considered to be the fastest recruited Battalion of the First World War...any ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59165 Posted 11 June , 2007 Share Posted 11 June , 2007 Do tell.... it wouldn't happen to be a Scottish one,would it? Aye,David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Featherbed Posted 12 June , 2007 Author Share Posted 12 June , 2007 Do tell.... it wouldn't happen to be a Scottish one,would it? Aye,David. I am unsure David as I am sure that I read years ago it was one of the Lancashire battalions and I am only trying to verify it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retrac Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 Hi Some of the Royal Fusiliers Battalions from 10 upwards were fairly quickly up to strength, but often weren't adopted by the War office until they were trained some months later. I think the 10th (Stockbrokers) was up to strength in a couple of days. I'll check when I get home. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevem49 Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 If we are talking 'Service' Battalions - The Army Order 324 was issued on 6th August 1914 and by 24th August the 9th Battalion The Sherwood Foresters was at full strength. The first 100 men being recruited on 9th Aug. Stevem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbluesboy Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 I think you will find it is one of the Manchester Pals,Manchester Regiment or the Salford Pals,Lancashire Fusiliers.Bob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltoro1960 Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 The 15th HLI (Glasgow Tramways) would take some beating. "Remarkably, an entire battalion of around 1,000 men was raised from the men of the Glasgow tramways in sixteen hours on 13 September 1914. James Dalrymple general manager of the Corporation Tramways Department was credited with being the main driving force behind this achievement." From their history - John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralphjd Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 The 2nd City Battalions, the 17th Manchesters, were recruited on the 2 and 3 September. On Thursday, 3rd September 2,151 men enlisted in Manchester, second only to the 3,521 who joined the colours in London. From Manchester Pals by Michael Stedman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 I imagine it is the case with several Regiments but, when the 7th Beds were raised under K2, they were formed instantly as the 6th Btn under K1 had so much surplus that there were enough men to generate the 1,000 odd needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59165 Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 I am unsure David as I am sure that I read years ago it was one of the Lancashire battalions and I am only trying to verify it. GK, I have no books to hand but it sticks in my mind that some of the pals btn's were raised in amazing time. Most of the posters here seem to be pointing that way too. London & Manchester being the biggest cities would have had a head start on recruiting because of location & population. Sorry,no help is it. David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Featherbed Posted 12 June , 2007 Author Share Posted 12 June , 2007 The 15th HLI (Glasgow Tramways) would take some beating. "Remarkably, an entire battalion of around 1,000 men was raised from the men of the Glasgow tramways in sixteen hours on 13 September 1914. James Dalrymple general manager of the Corporation Tramways Department was credited with being the main driving force behind this achievement." From their history - John John I was aware of the 16 hours that it took to raise the 15th Tramways but I am sure that I read somewhere that one of the Lancs Battalions was raised even quicker...though it does sound rather hard to imagine. Thanks all the same for the info anyway...I have the original history of the 15th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dycer Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 John I was aware of the 16 hours that it took to raise the 15th Tramways but I am sure that I read somewhere that one of the Lancs Battalions was raised even quicker...though it does sound rather hard to imagine. Thanks all the same for the info anyway...I have the original history of the 15th. Which I presume confirms the Battalion lost 13 Officers and 272 Men killed and wounded on the morning of 3 July 1916. George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 17/Manchester was recruited almost entirely on 3 September 1914. A few had been signed up the day before after recruitment closed for 16/Manc. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Featherbed Posted 12 June , 2007 Author Share Posted 12 June , 2007 17/Manchester was recruited almost entirely on 3 September 1914. A few had been signed up the day before after recruitment closed for 16/Manc. John John I am beginning to think it was the 17th Manchesters that I had read about...I just cannot find my original source or book. In regards to the 15th Glasgow's. Jimmy Dalrymple the man in charge of the Glasgow Tramways Depots back in 1914 took it upon himself to raise a civic battalion from the tramcar drivers , conductors and mainatinence men from the tramway depots. Before leaving his office he phoned every depot in Glasgow asking for a list of names of those men in the Department who would wish to enlist and on truning up for work the very next morning he had over one thousand names on his desk and from there the 15th Glasgow Tramways - First Service Battalion - were born...in a total of sixteen hours. Which I presume confirms the Battalion lost 13 Officers and 272 Men killed and wounded on the morning of 3 July 1916. George Dycer I have an index card on every soldier of the 15th Tramways so I would have to check out your figures or refer back to the original history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dycer Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 Keelie, Don't bother I'm quoting from an Article wrtten for the Scottish Daily Mail in the 1950's. I'm sure the figure is reasonably accurate e.g it states that on 3rd September 1914 the Town Clerk read out "The Magistrates recommend....that steps be taken....for the raising of the necessary recruits to form at least two battalions and that the expense of raising and equiping such battalions be borne by the Corporation out of the Common Good". George p.s. PM me a contact address if you want a photocopy of the Article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Stewart Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 The raising of these service battalions and what determines was the quickest raised depends on whether or not official permission for raising and sanctioning for the said battalion was received from the War Office. Those 'raisers', who off their own bat raised units without WO permission or sanctioning within a short space of time did come unstuck with their own success. You certainly could, and many did raise a battalion within a certain number of hours, but without WO approval, it wouldn't get into record books because of these technicalities. Both the 3rd & 4th Tyneside Scottish under WO terms and conditions were raised and sanctioned within twentyfour hours of getting the nod from the WO, and like the remainder of the T.S. Brigade there was enough surplus personnel to offset those rejected for whatever reasons, so all battalions were well over the 1,100 men required as part of the War Establishment set by the WO. Ironically the WO came back to the raisers of these locally raised units at a later date, asking them to raise an additional "Depot Company" within each battalion to consist of 250 men. In the initial race with the Tyneside Irish to raise a complete Brigade, the T.S. won and so shut down its recruitng offices. With this new WO announcement the T.S. had to seek new premises to find these extra 1,000 men. The Irish on the other hand hadn't closed there recruiting offices and so carried on enrolling and with a technical twist completed the Brigade with the extra 1,000 men before the T.S. This Depot Company ruling was applied to all locally raised battalions and began on the 5th December 1914(ACI 13 of 2nd December 1914), so one has to ask did all of those battalions previously mentioned in this post have their Depot Companies in place to be complete as battalion on this date? Graham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KONDOA Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 Graham, The ACI 13 of 2nd December referred to above has I believe answered a quandry I had with the RA. I noted from my enlistment data for the Hull Heavy Battery a gap in the enlistment dates which, now having seen your information, seems to account for this. Could you say if this also applied to TF raised RA units or similar or is it coincidence. Roop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Stewart Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 Roop, You're in luck here mate, as your Hull Heavy Battery in mentioned in person;- "In the case of the Hull Heavy Battery, and other such similar units which may be raised under local arrangements, the same principle will be followed by forming an additional sections. If it can be arranged these Depot Companies should at any rate during the present cold weather, be accommondated in suitable buildings or billets." As you will already be aware it wasn't only the Infantry that raisers formed but also artillery and engineers. Some of the raisers were local T.F. Committees, so once deemed "locally raised units" by the WO, then they would follow ACI's aimed at their formation and administration. Graham. PS Roop - PM me an e.mail address and I'll forward the ACI to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Banning Posted 12 June , 2007 Share Posted 12 June , 2007 Am sure I read somewhere that it was the 17th King's (Liverpool Regt) (1st Liverpool Pals) were prety sharpish on the recruitment side of things. Have no idea where I read this though and this is just from some random part at the back of my brain! I have emailed Simon Jones to ask him if I am right and he may well contribute to this post. Cheers Jeremy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retrac Posted 17 June , 2007 Share Posted 17 June , 2007 Hi Some of the Royal Fusiliers Battalions from 10 upwards were fairly quickly up to strength, but often weren't adopted by the War office until they were trained some months later. I think the 10th (Stockbrokers) was up to strength in a couple of days. I'll check when I get home. David Back with the books. 10th R Fus not as fast as some on here but enough for a depot. 21st Aug began recruiting (210); 425 by 22nd, 24th 900; 25th 1300, 27th 1600, sworn in 29th. Another RFus recruiting push brought 5000 into the Public Schools Bns in 11 days. There had been a meeting called by means of a letter in The Times on 26th August. By Sept 18th 2.5 Bns (18th, 19th and half of 20th Bns R Fus)went to Epsom and 1.5 (half of 20th and 21st) to Ashstead. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrymurland Posted 19 June , 2007 Share Posted 19 June , 2007 You're in luck here mate, as your Hull Heavy Battery in mentioned in person;- Graham, would that be 146 Hull Heavy Battery? Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Stewart Posted 19 June , 2007 Share Posted 19 June , 2007 Jerry, Initially the ACI would have related to the original 11th(Hull)Heavy Battery, which was raised about Sept 1915. Subsequently the other Hull Batteries would be included in the Instruction, as they were also raised by Lord Nunburnholme & the East Riding T.F.A., as all locally raised units had to have Depot units in place to allow for reinforcement. Graham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrymurland Posted 19 June , 2007 Share Posted 19 June , 2007 Don't suppose you have anything on the 146 Battery Graham, its very hard to track down Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Reed Posted 19 June , 2007 Share Posted 19 June , 2007 7th Battalion Royal Sussex Regiment, an officially sanctioned battalion was formed pre-New Army (thus one of the first ever wartime raised battalions) on 12th August 1914. It had taken in a full establishment of over 1,100 men by the end of the day. By 7th September 1914 it took the 11th Battalion of the same regiment (then actually officially the 9th Bn) 56 hours to raise the same number of men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph Posted 19 June , 2007 Share Posted 19 June , 2007 Jerry, There are 3 Hull Heavy Battery’s raised by Lord Nunburnholme and the East Riding Territorial Force Association; 1st or 11th HHB Formed 07/09/1914 2nd or 124th HHB Formed 14/01/1915 3rd or 146th HHB Formed 29/09/1915 Regards Charles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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