German Belt Buckle Identification

[tim_oz]

I found this buckle in a box of stuff when clearing out my fathers garage and was wondering if it was from WW1. I have no idea how it got there and no one in the family had ever seen it before. Any thoughts on it would be appreciated.

Tim

[tim_oz]

The back

[tim_oz]

Another pic of the front

[Kirkes Lamb]

I personally think this is WW2. I checked on the web and saw there was an SS Unit that took to the skies by this title, but I am sure there are some experts out there who will give you the definative answer

[yellow]

It looks to me like a Freikorps buckle who were para military organisations that were formed between the time of Imperial Germany and the Weimar. They protected the borders of Germany particulary on the Eastern Frontier. These units were formed from German veterans of WW1, sadly they degenerated into strong arm right wing squads who supported the rise of the Nazis.

I dont think this item is WW1...although what I find interesting is that the reverse duplicates the construction of a WW1 French buckle. Cannot explain that.

It seams eBay is now swarming with storm trooper buckles and badges, most of which are fantasy items.

Steve.

[eparges]

There exist a small, white metall,stamped insignia (capbadge), ca 3 x 2,5 cm, as worn by Austrian Sturmtruppen during WW1. As far as I know, these buckles were produced (and still are, but in a more german-type buckle style) from the 1970 onwards in Poland (by the same guy who is now floding the market with M1918 earcutout stahlhelme...small advise: weigh the helmet, it's lighter and when the sides are 'pressed', between your belly and arms, there's movement, impossible to do with original ones...). These buckles are very popular with some boldheaded, booted thugs on the continent...

[tim_oz]

Eparges

Thanks for that I thought it was to good to be true.

Tim

[eparges]

some pics of different badges the buckle is, in my opinion, derived from

[bob lembke]

"eparges";

Am I correct; the five badges you just posted are all Austro-Hungarian?

I am weak on uniforms, decorations, etc., but study storm formations in depth, mainly from Central Powers sources. IMHO:

The buckle almost certainly can't be genuine WW I German.

Freikorps is a bit more possible, but still quite unlikely. Lots of people seem to think that their principal occupation was fussing with uniform and decoration details; I remember a forumite, here or elsewhere, thinking that the officers of a Freikorps that had to organize, uniform, and arm itself in about a week, when the depots had been already been pillaged and looted, spent a lot of their time going to jewelers having fancy unit designations engraved on their P 08s, rather than seeing to the arming and organizing of their men, etc. I don't think that Freikorps is very likely.

I was surprised when I first saw examples of the many Austo-Hiungarian storm troop badges, but my sense of the seemingly genuine ones is how "busy" the designs seem to be; just look at the five examples that "eparges" just posted. Designwise the buckle is very different.

I know zero about the WW II stuff, but if we restrict outselves to the WW I era, I think it is a "fantasy" piece, to repeat a polite phrase probably borrowed from coin collecting.

Bob Lembke

[eparges]

The pix I posted are indeed Austro-Hungarian, and are only an exemple of the wide-range of badges that existed. Again, I've seen the buckles, after undergoing 'aging' in a catlitter-recipient...

[tim_oz]

Eparges

Thanks for the pictures of the badges it was intresting to see the basis for the fake. The cat litter tray is an intresting aging method but Ive also seen "genuine antique" WestAfrican Bronzes undergoing a simular process in a public urinal. I suppose its just another reminder of buyer beware. Mind you the weekend was not a compleate loss I did find my Great Uncles Victory Medal (genuine) which was great.

Thanks again

Tim

[Guest 44jochen]

Hello, sorry but it is a fake.