VAD volunteer Rubie Pickard - d. 13/4/16 aged 67

[SRDjar]

Hi Pals

I remember seeing the grave of this gallant lady worker in Wimereux communal cemetery (3.L.3): Mrs Rubie Pickard, British Red Cross, 13th April 1916. She was a VAD voluntary worker (attached?)to the BRC

and was possibly a member of the British community living in Boulogne before the war, as her husband had

his place of residence in St Léonard, just south of the Channel port. Her job was to supply the British hospitals in the Wimereux/Boulogne area with daily newspapers. Not a nurse proper, sure, but a lady with grit all the same, considering her age (67). Her touching epitaph reads, 'Rests here with those she tried to comfort'.

Any additional info on her, one of the oldest civilian workers to die in F & F (if not the oldest), would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks in advance.

Regards.

SRD

[pauldesmondwhite]

I remember seeing the grave of this gallant lady worker in Wimereux communal cemetery (3.L.3): Mrs Rubie Pickard, British Red Cross, 13th April 1916. She was a VAD voluntary worker (attached?)to the BRC

and was possibly a member of the British community living in Boulogne before the war, as her husband had

his place of residence in St Léonard, just south of the Channel port. Her job was to supply the British hospitals in the Wimereux/Boulogne area with daily newspapers. Not a nurse proper, sure, but a lady with grit all the same, considering her age (67). Her touching epitaph reads, 'Rests here with those she tried to comfort'.

Have got a little further with Mrs Rubie Pickard and had some surprises.

Story begins with the 1891 census at Paper Mill, Cheston Road, Aston (Sched 19) where SAMUEL Pickard, 38, is Paper Mill Manager: b. Halifax, Yorks.

His wife is Rubie, 35, b. Stepney.

They have 4 children: Beda (10), Thomas (8), Eric (5), Wada (2mo.).

Samuel has been traced back in 1881 (age 31) and 1871 (age 22); and onwards only in 1901 (age 51).

Almost everywhere his birthplace is shown as Halifax, Yorks, but there is no corresponding birth registration.

District-wise "Sam" Q1 1847 Halifax 22 244 fits, but seems too early. Later entries in Yorks are not in Halifax.

Rubie turns out to be Sarah, 27, in 1881 and hasn't been found any earlier.

Only one marriage entry comes even close to matching this couple:

Samuel Pickard m. Sarah Hill Q1 1880 Salford 8d 50. So what was she doing up there?

The highly-varying census ages prevent easy identification of her family and birth registration, even though she consistently mentions Stepney.

Rubie *may* have lost at least one of her children in infancy or soon after.

Eric survived to marry Alice with whom he lives in East Dulwich in the 1911 census and is a Paper Maker's Agent. They have one daughter Ruby (spelt normally!).

Wada died unmarried at the age of 75 in Saffron Walden RD (Q1 1967).

Samuel Pickard's Medal Index Card shows him with British Red Cross, disembarking with BEF on 27.10.14.

His job was Store Keeper and rank Captain (so not the boat-owner I was expecting). He seems to have been issued the 1914 Star, but another line defeats me.

There seems to be no Medal Index Card for Sarah/Rubie (BRCS or VAD).

The 7th Edition (Mar 1918) of the British Red Cross Register of Overseas Volunteers has a forward section called "Headquarters Staff at Boulogne" and this contains the entry PICHARD, S. Newspaper Department.

There is no other entry for Sarah/Rubie in the main section, nor an entry at the back for cancelled contracts despite her distant passing.

Hope that may trigger a little more discovery?

Paul

P.S. Do try, someone, to find her birth registration (got money for certs these days?) and validate her status as eldest casualty!

Edited 16 January , 2014 by Paul White

[KevinBattle]

Perhaps with all the WW1 publicity in the centenary year, the British Red Cross might provide the answers on this?

Especially if it makes her the oldest BRC casualty?

The indifferent quality and sometimes varying birth details on some Census returns do make tracing someone quite difficult at times!

3 of their children were all baptised on 15th June 1886 (son Wada born about 1891) Eric, b Jan 4th 1886; Thomas b 1st May 1882 and daughter Beda b Feb 13th 1881. Living in Sharples in Bolton le Moors Parish, Lancaster. Both Samuel and Sarah Pickard shown as Paper makers.

Wada and Beda are very unusual names, so maybe some trace there?

In 1901 Census, 10 year old Wada is a pupil (not pateient) with the Nesbitt family.

[Jim Strawbridge]

May not be the oldest as Lt. Cmdr Gartside-Topping was kia on the 25th September 1915, aged 67.

[Sue Light]

I'm not sure what criteria are set for the 'oldest casualty.' Mrs Pickard was probably living in France pre-war, so was a volunteer, but in a similar way to the tens of thousands of BRCS/St. John volunteers working in the UK, who, of course, 'don't count' for casualty status, and almost certainly some older to die during wartime. Mrs Pickard died of natural causes - WO95/3989:

<<Miss Fox wrote to say Mrs. Pickard had been operated upon – found to be cancer of stomach and stitched up, nothing could be done. Very sad, the poor old lady is over 60 and was out here with her husband – have been out here in one of the Soldier’s Homes – her old husband is now ill at 7 Stationary Hospital.>>

And not a 'VAD' volunteer, which is a bit different.

Sue

[pauldesmondwhite]

I'm not sure what criteria are set for the 'oldest casualty.' Mrs Pickard was probably living in France pre-war, so was a volunteer, but in a similar way to the tens of thousands of BRCS/St. John volunteers working in the UK, who, of course, 'don't count' for casualty status, and almost certainly some older to die during wartime. Mrs Pickard died of natural causes - WO95/3989:

Sorry, Sue, I didn't mention why she came up as "oldest" (*woman*, Jim, sorry that wasn't clear - have you got Gartside-Topping's DoB?). She's on the CWGC Roll of Honour, so had some kind of status with the powers that be who classified her as "VAD Volunteer".

And out of 810 CWGC women, amongst those whose age is specified, she is the oldest at 67 (if this is confirmed by birth record). The next 4 women's ages are 66, 66, 65, 62.

[Jim Strawbridge]

I fail to see the relevance of age for "anything". TV shows, when introducing contestants, always seem to give name, age and occupation. The same with reports in the newspapers and the courts. Just my view but others seem to think that it is important. But, Paul, to look at VAD female workers who died using the CWGC website is only part of the story. The CWGC VAD casualties that are commemorated only relates to those that served overseas. There were probably far more VAD workers who did not serve overseas but did worthy work in the UK. Some of these will have died and will not have been eligible for CWGC commemoration. I think that I have on file a woman in the VAD who was aged in her 80s and died in service.

[Sue Light]

to look at VAD female workers who died using the CWGC website is only part of the story. The CWGC VAD casualties that are commemorated only relates to those that served overseas. There were probably far more VAD workers who did not serve overseas but did worthy work in the UK. Some of these will have died and will not have been eligible for CWGC commemoration.

Thank you Jim - that's exactly what I was trying to point out. The CWGC have done a great dis-service to women, and to use them as a marker for any type of demographic to estimate women who died during the Great War is flawed in the extreme. Less than 10% of VADs served overseas.

And to clear up the 'VAD' point, Rubie Pickard could not have been a VAD. Even her age made her twenty years too old, and I can see no evidence at all of affiliation to a UK Detachment. She may well have been a British Red Cross worker, or attached to the BRCS, but that covered a multitude of occupations other than VADs. I realise of course that it's a pedant's point.

Sue

[pauldesmondwhite]

Jim, if you feel so strongly that age is irrelevant, why does your file even contain a reference to the age of the 80s VAD?

Sue, I'm not trying to make some profound demographic point here, and I'm more aware than most just how selective CWGC is. And probably second to none in condemning that.

For those that *are* interested (me included), I'm merely drawing attention to the *statistic* about the apparently oldest in one single, well-defined data set. I thought that was obvious.

I'm not qualified to comment on whether Rubie could have been a VAD. That's only what CWGC records. Perhaps the Red Cross transcriptions later this year may throw some light on this (or maybe not).

[KevinBattle]

If you could all put your handbags down for a moment, any one want to comment on post #3?

I did think it was a serious enquiry but if it's just a slugfest forget it.

[pauldesmondwhite]

Thanks for the extra family detail, Kevin. Maybe I'll dig a bit deeper into Sarah Hill's birth at some point.

[Marilyne]

Good evening all, 

I'm currently filing my research on the women of Wimereux, starting with Mrs Rubie Pickard. There is a set of correspondance in the CWGC archives between the commission and three generations f Pickards: First with Samuel regarding the name of his wife on the headstone; then with son Eric on the possibility to visit "FATHER & MOTHER's GRAVES in Wimereux" and finally on the wish of Eric's son ("T", for Thomas???) to bury the ashes of his father (Eric) with Rubie (Eric's mother and T's grandmother), which was done on the 13th May 1960. 

This leads me to TWO questions: 

• WHERE is Capt Samuel Pickard buried?? He's not in the CWGC database. but he was on the IWGC staff in 1919, so does he have a civilian's grave on the cemetery in Wimereux?, (which I missed, means I have to go back to find that... ) or is he buried in the communal cemetery?? 
• in his correspondance, Samuel Pickard indicated that the whole family served. I found Thomas Pickard in the East Surrey Regt, 1st Bn. Eric said in his letters that he served 4.5 years, being demobilized in 1919 as a Lieutenant with the R.R.S.C. He also writes that he was in Arras in April 1916; when his mother died. Can anybody tell me what Eric's unit was? 

If anyone has some info ... 

Thanks

M.

Edited 2 August , 2023 by Marilyne

[Matlock1418]

5 hours ago, Marilyne said:

Eric said in his letters that he served 4.5 years, being demobilized in 1919 as a Lieutenant with the R.R.S.C. He also writes that he was in Arras in April 1916; when his mother died. Can anybody tell me what Eric's unit was? 

Jumping in where perhaps I ought go more cautiously ... but given the 1891 Census recording Eric was 5 then his birth would have been about 1886.

There is a pension index card for an Eric PICKARD age 33 [so about the right age, ish, in 1919 - for a birth in 1886] - T/2 Lt, RASC (MT) 

Address 10 Verdart Lane SE 6  Disabilities: Trench Fever, Heart Trouble & Neuritis

Might this be him? Rather looks like it might be - but still only a 2Lt??

MT seems potential hunting ground for a more specific unit at the end of the war.

There also is a MIC for an Eric PICKARD, RASC, Pte, M2/114854, Comm 14.4.18 so that could be his early service.

M

Edit: That's always assuming he wasn't Eric Walter PICKARD, ASC TF, LT. Gazetted 1.6.16, Relinq'd Commission 18.12.18 [17.10.41 a medal application from The Sqd Leader, Comg No 1 initial Tng Wing, RAF Babbacombe, Torquay - issued 22.10.1941] - MIC available, as well as a less helpful PIC

Edited 1 August , 2023 by Matlock1418
edit

[Marilyne]

Matlock, 

Thanks for this. 

I think you have the right one from the start... he writes quite badly... RRSC is of course RASC... could have thought of that myself: 

What is also worrying in this whole thing is that he wrote a letter to the Commission in 1925 (??) and received an answer NINE YEARS later?? 

 

M.

[Jim Strawbridge]

On 31/07/2023 at 19:49, Marilyne said:

 

I'm currently filing my research on the women of Wimereux, starting with Mrs Rubie Pickard. There is a set of correspondance in the CWGC archives between the commission and three generations f Pickards: First with Samuel regarding the name of his wife on the headstone; then with son Eric on the possibility to visit "FATHER & MOTHER's GRAVES in Wimereux" and finally on the wish of Eric's son to bury the ashes of his father (Eric) with his mother, which was done on the 13th May 1960. 

This leads me to TWO questions: 

• WHERE is Capt Samuel Pickard buried?? He's not in the CWGC database. but he was on the IWGC staff in 1919, so does he have a civilian's grave on the cemetery in Wimereux?, (which I missed, means I have to go back to find that... ) or is he buried in the communal cemetery?? 
•  

If anyone has some info ... 

 

As the son was able to place his father's ashes in his mother's grave I think that we can assume that Samuel was not buried anywhere but was cremated. I cannot envisage his body being exhumed and then cremated.

[Matlock1418]

Returning to Mrs Rubie PICKARD's commemoration by CWGC https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/84617/mrs-rubie-pickard

It is puzzling that she is described as Voluntary Aid Detatchment on the CWGC website [with an inserted VAD on the original Grave Registeration] but there is a photo on Find A Grave which shows a CWGC headstone with British Red Cross inscribed [and BRC clearly on the Headstone Schedule].

???

No mention of her husband's interment or ashes on either site or headstone

M

Edited 2 August , 2023 by Matlock1418

[Marilyne]

32 minutes ago, Jim Strawbridge said:

As the son was able to place his father's ashes in his mother's grave I think that we can assume that Samuel was not buried anywhere but was cremated. I cannot envisage his body being exhumed and then cremated.

Jim, 

My bad English is at fault again: Samuel and Rubie had a son, called Eric. Eric sais in his letters that he visited the graves of his parents in Wimereux. 

Eric then died somewhere around 1960 and ERIC's SON placed the ashes of ERIC in his mother's grave... that's why we still don't know where Samuel is... 

[Jim Strawbridge]

3 hours ago, Marilyne said:

Jim, 

My bad English is at fault again: Samuel and Rubie had a son, called Eric. Eric sais in his letters that he visited the graves of his parents in Wimereux. 

Eric then died somewhere around 1960 and ERIC's SON placed the ashes of ERIC in his mother's grave... that's why we still don't know where Samuel is... 

So far as I have been able to ascertain Eric had three children being Ruby Louise Pickard (b. 1910 in Clerkenwell), Thomas Edmund Pickard (b. 1914 in Clerkenwell) and Patricia A. Pickard (b. 1921 in Lewisham). So it must have been Thomas that arranged for his father's ashes to be placed in his grandmother's grave. A little unusual as his mother was still alive at the time.

The family tree is something like this :-

Sarah Rubie Hill (b. 1856 circa in Stepney) married Samuel Pickard (b. 1853 circa in Leeds, Yorkshire, d. 4th Q, 1922 in Foleshill, Warwickshire - likely error) on the 12th March 1880 in Pendleton, St. Thomas, Lancashire.

Five children being :-

Beda Pickard (b. 13th February 1881 in Pendleton, m. Harold W. Wright in 4Q. 1915 in Willesden),

Sarah Elizabeth Pickard (b. 1881 in Pendleton),

Thomas Pickard (b. July 1882 in Bolton la Moois, Lancashire),

Eric Pickard (b. 14th January 1886 in Bolton, Lancashire, m. Alice Ethel Tyrell, three children, d. 1960 in Romford, Essex)

and Wada Pickard (b. 1891 in Aston, Warwickshire, d. 1967 in Saffron Walden, spinster).

 

There are 20 family trees registered on Ancestry for our Samuel Pickard and whilst most are copies of each other some have been compiled independently. Only one shows Samuel's death and I believe this to be an error. None of the other family trees show his death. From BMD there is a Samuel Pickard who died in the 4th Quarter 1922 in Foleshill, but he is shown as aged 57 so almost certainly wishful thinking by the compiler. I think that he will be one of

Samuel Pickard (died Burnley in 1927 aged 77), Samuel J. Pickard (died Coventry in 1928, aged 76), Samuel Pickard (died 1939 in Mansfield, aged 87) or Samuel Pickard (died Dewsbury in 1940, aged 88). If he died during the war period then the CWGC will almost certainly have had him recorded and commemorated and I cannot see that this is the case.

 

This is the son :-

Deaths Mar 1960
PICKARD	Eric	74	Romford	5a	489
Probate shows that he lived at 52 Weald Way, Romford, Essex and died on the 8th January 1960 with probate granted to his widow Alice Ethel Pickard.

Edited 2 August , 2023 by Jim Strawbridge