George Denrick Sandmann

[John Hayward]

Browsing this forum gives the impression that members like a puzzle, so here goes.

The attached photo depicts George Sandmann who died on Oct 23rd 1938 aged 44.

His medal index card shows him as serving in the RFA, entering Egypt on 26th May 1915.

Does the uniform in the photo fit with this? If not the MIC must be for either his father or uncle of the same name (they would have been 53 and 58 in 1915!)

Here’s the bit that’s puzzling me. I have George’s service record, which shows him as No 11493 George Denrick Sandmann of the Scots Guards.

He was discharged on 20th Oct 1914 after 13 days, as unfit under “para 392 (iii)© KR”

If he was unfit in October 1914 did the desperate need for men increase that quickly that he was considered fit within 7 months? And should his second period of service create a seperate service record, rather than be added to the original?

I am pretty certain (!) the photo and service records are for the same person. The photo was in my Grandmother’s possessions (George was one of her brothers) and his name, age and date of death are written on the back. The service record has my Great Grandfather’s name and address as next of kin.

Any thoughts or suggestions would be of interest.

Thanks

[John Hayward]

MIC attached

[Stebie9173]

Some men who had been rejected on medical grounds just left and went and re-enlisted elsewehere and to a different regiment (omitting to tell the recruiter that he had already been rejected, of course).

One biographical book (Fire-eater, by O Pollard) even talks about a friend rejected a dozen times around London due to heart problems who eventually got in by sending his fit friend to the medical and then going himself to the call-up - easier in the main throng of enlistees of course).

The medals are a standard trio - 1914 or 1914-15 Star, BWM & VM. There is no "Rose" on the Star ribbon so likely a 1914-15 Star - in other words as per MIC.

He has a lanyard, often associated with mounted troops including the artillery. His collar badges are grenade/bombs which were worn artillery men after WW1.

He would probably have received 6 months training between enlistment and going overseas, so it seems he just went up the road and re-enlisted after he was rejected.

A distinct possibility.

The six digit number 695157 indicates that the number was issued by either:

55th Divisional Artillery Column - 1st Line West Lancashire Territorial Artillery.

or

57th Divisional Artillery Column - 2nd Line West Lancashire Territorial Artillery.

Neither of these units appears to have served in Egypt, however. Most odd.

He appears to have transferred to a Regular Artillery Unit later in the War, and been renumbered 286026 (though after early 1917 when his 1942 TF number was changed to 695157)

Men enlisting into Territorial units at the start of the war would often enlist locally, by the way.

It could also be that the Guards Regiments operated a more stringent enlistment criteria (apart from the historical minimum height) than the Territorials. Quite likely actually, I would imagine...

Steve.

[RedCoat]

i thinks stebies covered it

Donnie

[John Hayward]

Thanks for the responses.

The info regarding the numbers adds a bit more detail, and the West Lancashires fits with his living in Preston.

Curious about Egypt- hope I interpreted the MIC correctly.

Thanks again.

[Guest JOHNSANDMAN]

Hi John,

My Grandfather John James Sandmann served as Gunner in the war - he was Roberts brother, and I suspect Georges and your Grandmothers. My son has just come back from Belguim where he swa Roberts name on a memorial. I have some photos of my Grandfather which I will post. Do you have any other photos of the Sandman family. I have been tracing our family back to Hanover.