r.f.r.

[jamesbow]

hi all,

could you tell me the difference between the RFR, and the RNR and also the RNVR.my father was transferred in to the R.F.R.in `1910 he then served 1914-19 on bacchante,prince george,europa,pyramus.

would he have been called up or did he volunteer? how would i know i have his service papers but i cant see anything thats tells me.it appears he was on bacchante on the 13th july 1914 to the 10th feb 1916 then on the above ships until 14th feb demobilised.all the best jamesbow

[Jarvis]

James, the NA has the following to say. It doesn't answer your questions 100% but will get you closer to your answer(s) I hope.

The information below came from this link

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalog...tm&lBack=-1

The Royal Naval Reserve (RNR) was established in 1859 as a reserve force of officers and men of deep-sea merchant ships. By 1890 there were 20,000 men in the RNR.

Proposals for a naval reserve were discussed by the Registrar-General of Seamen as early as 1838 but it was not until the Royal Naval Reserve Act 1859 that provision was made for the Admiralty to maintain a reserve of up to 30,000 men. These men, recruited through local shipping offices came from among merchant seamen and fishermen and could be called upon for service in the Royal Navy in times of emergency.

Royal Naval Reserve Trawler Section - RNR(T)

The RNR was generally confined to officers and men of deep sea merchantmen but in 1911 it was felt that there was a need to employ trawlers in wartime as minesweepers and patrol vessels. The Royal Naval Reserve Trawler Section - RNR(T) was set up to enrol the necessary personnel. Although abolished as a separate section of the RNR in 1921, the RNR(T) always remained quite distinct from the RNR proper, and employed fishermen. In both world wars a large number of trawlers were taken up by the Royal Navy complete with their crews, who were entered on a form T124 by which they engaged to serve in a named vessel for the duration of the war only. Fishermen on a T124 formed the bulk of the RNR(T) during the First World War

Royal Fleet Auxiliaries

In 1911, the Royal Fleet Auxiliary (RFA) was also formed. This arose from difficulties over the legal position of the crew of the hospital ship Maine, commissioned in 1902 with a civilian crew, although it was one of HM ships and part of the Mediterranean Fleet. Until 1921 the officers of the Royal Fleet Auxiliaries were nearly all RNR officers and ranked accordingly. Since then they have been ranked as other merchant navy officers.

Royal Naval Division

From 1914 to 1916 a number of officers and ratings of the RNR served ashore in Flanders as infantry and formed the Royal Naval Division. In 1916 the Division was transferred to the army as the 63rd (Royal Naval) Division.

Shetland Royal Naval Reserve

In 1914, a separate organization of the RNR was formed on the Shetland Islands. Known as the Shetland Royal Naval Reserve it was unlike the regular RNR in that it was a coast-watching and local defence organization. It was disbanded in 1921.

The RNVR was founded in 1903. It was composed of volunteers from all walks of life - except maritime tradesmen who formed the Royal Naval Reserve. Men of the RNVR served in a variety of roles, not only on ships but also as part of the Royal Naval Division (63rd Dvn) who fought on land.

There is also an interesting link here regarding the RFR

http://www.gwpda.org/naval/mobrn02.htm

Jarvis

[jamesbow]

jarvis,

many thanks for that.it all gets a bit confusing?.would he be entitled to a pension?i think altogether he was in for 22years.

many thanks jamesbow

[Jarvis]

Jamesbow, it certainly confused me, perhaps someone can put it into perspective in laymens terms ?

Pensions are way beyond my scope, I'm afraid, but I would think anybody with 22 years service would be receiving 'a pension'. I'm sure there will be someone by shortly to be more precise on this.

Jarvis

[per ardua per mare per terram]

The RNR was a reserve of merchant seamen, who received some peacetime training.

The RNVR were civilians who volunteered for training (like the army volunteers at the time they were formed).

The Royal Fleet Reserve were completely different, it was formed with the same idea as the army reserves. The men in the RFR had to have served in the Royal Navy, only, and agreed to join the reserves. Men with SS numbers had signed up for 5 years Naval service (like being with the colours in the army) and 7 years in the reserves (so they left the Navy and could have other jobs) and I understand they received refresher training annually. In July 1914 there was a major fleet mobilisation and your father was called up with the other reserves. His original contract expired in 1917, but obviously that was in the war and he signed on again. If he received a pension it is usually written on the records as 'traced pension' or 'traced pen'.

[jamesbow]

thank you ,it is becoming clearer now,i cant make out anything else on his record,some of the writing is badly faded,i will ask my eldest brother to see if he knows about pension?

again many thanks jamesbow

[per ardua per mare per terram]

Bacchante 7th Cruiser Squadron North Sea as part of Cruiser Force C

28 August 1914 Covering force at Battle of Heligoland Bight.

October 1914 Escorted convoy to Gibraltar.

February 1915 Suez Canal.

April 1915-1916 Dardanelles.

http://www.worldwar1.co.uk/armoured-cruiser/hms-cressy.html

Prince george destroyer

Europa depot ship for destroyers Aegean and flag ship Mudros

Pyramus depot ship Mudros and later overflow for the above