May-July 1916 Gommecourt

[bmac]

I have the War Dairies plus other documents for these units for the period mentioned (many are scanned or transcribed):

VII Corps Staff

VII Corps Royal Artillery

VII Corps Heavy Artillery

56th Division Staff

56th Division Royal Artillery

56th Division RE

167, 168 & 169 Brigades Staff

167 Trench Mortar Bty

168 Machine Gun Coy

169 Trench Mortar Bty

1/1 Londons

1/3 Londons

1/7 Middx

1/8 Middx

Rangers

1/4 Londons

Kensingtons

London Scottish

London Rifle Brigade

1/2 Londons

Qns Victoria Rifles

Qns Westminster Rifles

1/5th Cheshires

45 Siege Bty RGA

94 Siege Bty RGA

50 Siege Bty RGA

91 Siege Bty RGA

68 Siege Bty RGA

+ several others copied at the PRO

280-283 Field Bty RFA

1/1 416 Field Coy RE

also

139 Brigade Staff

1/5 North Staffordshires

1/6 North Staffordshires

1/5 Notts & Derby

1/7 Notts & Derby

plus several documents from the Court of Inquiry held into the performance of the 46th Division

[armourersergeant]

just stummbled by this post by accident!!!!

Where have you been all my life Bmac i am doing research on Snow commander of 7th corps, he took a holiday before the somme 1st july does it say if he was ill or why and...ohh so many questions on staff preperation and alsorts. Also court of inquiry what does that say...

sorry to beg but

Please please please

Arm.

[Sharonp]

Hi,

This is a long shot, my granfather was in the 1st North Staff regiment around 1912 would you have any info, his name was Walter Oxford, 9404.

Thank you,

Sharon.

[Ancre1917]

Hi

I see you have the 1/6 North Staffs diary. Any chance of a copy, especially those bits dealing with the 1st July 1916 on the Somme and the September 1918 attack at the St Quentin canal?

Thanks

Rich

[bmac]

Rich,

I only have the 1st July bit which I will dig out after I've come back from Marks & Spencers with a little something for the wife's dinner. You know how it is, a little man's work is never done.

Bill

[Ancre1917]

Rich,

I only have the 1st July bit which I will dig out after I've come back from Marks & Spencers with a little something for the wife's dinner. You know how it is, a little man's work is never done.

Bill

Thanks Bill. Look forward to hearing from you soon.

Rich

[Roy Evans]

Bill,

In view of your forthcomming book on the 46th Div, I'll be happy to snail mail any of the relevant bits of the South Staffords diaries.

Roy

[bmac]

In view of your forthcomming book on the 46th Div, I'll be happy to snail mail any of the relevant bits of the South Staffords diaries.

Roy,

Very kind. I have been sent a lot of stuff recently on various units, bought a few books too, so at some point I will have to review what I have and what I need. I have the 1/6 S Staffs history and a 1/5 S Staffs report from 1st July but not the War Diaries for May-July 16. So, basically not a lot. So, yes please!

Bill

[Guest Joe7029]

Hi

I am researching my wifes Great Uncle who died on 14/06/1916 at Hebuterne.

His details are as follows:

1303 lawrence Charles Beesley a private in the 1/5th Cheshire Regiment who was a pioneer with the 56th Division at the time. Also serving in the same regiment was his brother Walter Beesley.

I am trying to get a picture of what these guys were doing at the time, there day-to-day routine in preparing for the battle on 1st July.

Regards

Joe

[bmac]

Lawrence and Charles Beesley went to France with C Company, 1/5th Cheshire Regiment in February 1915. The regimental history gives some sketchy background but, as the Divisional Pioneers, they were there to dig, wire and generally labour. At this time, one of the main occupations was digging 6 foot deep trenches for the telephone cables leading back to Divisional HQ and the artillery which then had to be filled in again afterwards. If you can find it, 'Subalterns of the Foot' by Ann Wolff is an account of the war taken from the diaries/letters of an officer of the 1/5th Cheshires, Lt Heald. It is out of print but may be available through somewhere like bookfinder.com. One platoon (No 9) of C Company was involved in the attack on 1st July the other three stood to under heavy artillery fire all day in front Hebuterne village.

This is an extract from my book for 14th June:

Wednesday, 14th June 1916

Third Army weather report: Dull & cold. Rain: 0.5mm. Temp. 60-47º F

THE WORKLOAD for all of the battalions was unremitting. It mattered little whether the unit was earmarked to be involved in the forthcoming attack, in the absence of any special labour units to do the digging and carrying, the infantry had to get on with the job. On 14th June, the 1/4th Londons embarked on a two-week night time work schedule of harsh intensity which, if the attack went in on the day planned, would give them just 24 hours in which to recover and be ready to act as the support battalion in the 168th Brigade’s assault. Every night for two weeks, between 9 p.m. and 5 a.m., the 1/4th marched three miles to their workplaces and three miles back to their billets when their labours were done. 280 men were seconded to the 2/2nd London Field Company R.E., 140 joined up with the 1/5th Cheshires and another 140 were at the disposal of the Brigade Signal Officer for cable trench digging. It was hard and unpopular work, done mainly in pouring rain and under threat of imminent harm from machine gun, minenwerfer and artillery.

This extract describes a somewhat hairy moment during a time when the battalion and a whole brigade of men spent three nights out in No Man's Land digging a new advanced trench about 300 yards away from the German front line:

Saturday, 27th May 1916

Third Army weather report: Fine

The Divisional Pioneers, the 1/5th Cheshires, had the job of improving a communication trench started the night before. For them, the previous night had been relatively quiet. An artillery duel away to the right had covered the noises of digging in their sector and their luck had even extended to the one man hit by a stray bullet being saved by his new helmet. This night was to be more eventful, however, as 2nd Lt Heald recorded the next day in his diary:

"Last night we had a much worse time. We had support lines to dig and the top of our communication trench to finish. Fritz was uncannily quiet at first. He let us get well out and then he hailed shrapnel shells and machine gun bullets on us for about ten minutes. The air was one mass of bursting shells. Luckily we had a little cover. I was just spacing our men out to dig when it started. The trench was about two feet deep. We had no one hit which seemed to me absolutely marvellous. Our helmets are splendid. Our men dug like they have never done before… They gave us four or five more of these bursts of fire. I was very lucky the last time. I had picked up a shovel when they started. The trench was enfiladed. I got down as low as possible and put the shovel in front of me. A shell burst in the air about three yards off and pieces came all round but I was not touched… Everybody got mixed up in the trench and we had a job to sort them out. We got home quite safely after about as exciting a night as I have ever had."

[Roy Evans]

Hi bmac,

I've only just picked up your post #8, guess it's a bit late now!

Roy

[bmac]

Hi bmac,

I've only just picked up your post #8, guess it's a bit late now!

Roy

Reckon so

[bmac]

Sorry, this is not a subject about which I know anything.

[webmistress]

Hi bmac

I wonder if you have anything on the 1st/16th Bn London Regiment (Queen's Westminster Rifles) please. I believe they formed part of 169 Brigade.

I am researching my cousin 2nd Lt Edward Henry Bovill, missing at Gommecourt on 1 July 1916. Apparently he was wounded in the face the moment he got out of the trenches in the early morning, but continued to lead his men the whole day and was one of the last, if not the last, to leave the German trenches (3rd line), out of which they were forced by sheer weight of numbers. His Regiment was cut to pieces and he was shot dead late in the evening, just as he was getting back to the British trenches.

Many thanks

Natalie

[bmac]

I wonder if you have anything on the 1st/16th Bn London Regiment (Queen's Westminster Rifles) please. I believe they formed part of 169 Brigade.

I am researching my cousin 2nd Lt Edward Henry Bovill, missing at Gommecourt on 1 July 1916. Apparently he was wounded in the face the moment he got out of the trenches in the early morning, but continued to lead his men the whole day and was one of the last, if not the last, to leave the German trenches (3rd line), out of which they were forced by sheer weight of numbers. His Regiment was cut to pieces and he was shot dead late in the evening, just as he was getting back to the British trenches.

Natalie,

There are eight mentions of 2nd Lt Bovill in my book including this description of the circumstances of his death:

One of the last to leave the German lines was 2nd Lt. Edward Bovill of ‘A’ Company, 1/16th Queen’s Westminster Rifles. Before the war a wealthy corn merchant with offices in the City and a devout, church-going man from Surrey, Bovill had been wounded in the face as he left the safety of the trenches but he had gone forward with his men nonetheless. He had been one of the small group of Q.W.R. platoon commanders who had kept their battalion’s attack from failing after the company commanders had all been killed. Throughout, he had led his dwindling band of men gallantly and aggressively. Now he found himself scurrying from shell hole to shell hole, until eventually he moved into the lee of the slight rise that gave protection from the machine guns firing from the cover of the Park. His escape was nearly complete. The last few yards took him through the graveyard of the 1/2nd Londons who had been slaughtered as they tried in vain to reinforce the men of the 169th Brigade in front of Gommecourt. Their bodies now littered the gentle slope up which the lieutenant crawled and scrambled. Bullets still whistled and sang close by. Grass and earth were flung into the air by their impact. From what was left of the British front line trenches, men peered anxiously, each one charting his tortuous progress, each one encouraging him onwards to safety. By the time the lieutenant reached the British parapet, his journey of 300 metres had taken fully half an hour. Hands reached out to meet him; cheerful voices greeted his safe return. As he stepped into the trench and safety, a bullet from some unknown weapon in the German lines slammed into the lieutenant’s body. Surrounded by his despairing colleagues, 2nd Lt. Edward Henry Bovill of ‘Buckland’, Betchworth in Surrey died before medical aid could help him.

This is the footnote about him:

2nd Lt. Edward Henry Bovill, ‘A’ Company, London Regt. (Queen's Westminster Rifles), died on Saturday, 1st July 1916. He was the elder and only surviving son of Mr and Mrs J. Henry Bovill of ‘Buckland’, Betchworth in Surrey, his younger brother, 2nd Lt. J Eric Bovill, 6th Dragoon Guards (The Carabiniers) was killed on 23rd January 1916 and is buried in Vermelles British Cemetery, grave III. A. 1. Born in April 1887 he was educated at Summerfields, Oxford, Harrow and Pembroke College, Cambridge. He was gazetted on the 9th August 1915 and went to the front in March 1916. Bovill was a wealthy City corn merchant with offices in Mark Lane, EC1. In his will, he left £32,207 (approximately £1.2 million in today’s money). A codicil to his will stated: “In case I am killed I want to give the parish of Buckland a new organ. I want a good one, so please spend up to £500 on it. If necessary, spend another £500 on it” (£500 in 1916 was the equivalent of some £18,300 now). His body was lost and his name is inscribed on the Thiepval Memorial, Pier 13 Face C.

There is a photograph of him on my web site: http://www.gommecourt.co.uk/fallenqwr.htm

Let me know if I can help further.

Bill

[webmistress]

Bill

Thank you so much for the information, very much appreciated!

Natalie

[ianw]

Just to say I stopped off at Buckland this evening to take a look at the lovely little war memorial that stands next to the village pond adjacent to the busy A25. It was a splendid sight in the warm evening sun. The essence of an English village proudly remembering the men they lost. The church is immedaitely opposite and I will have to find out if Edward's bequest of a splendid organ for the church was acted upon. I hope so.

The names of the Bovill brothers are of course there on the memorial and it was really rewarding to read the detailed and desperately sad description of Edward Bovill's death at Gommecourt at the end of a gallant day of hard fighting. Sadly it appears that both brothers may well have fallen to a sniper's bullet.

We will remember them.

[gnr.ktrha]

Hello Bill,

I have been reading about the London Scottish attack during the 1st of July, in their regimental histories. I would be very interested to read the war diary entries for the period. Would it be possible for you to let me see what you have? If it is easier, I can PM you my email address.

Many thanks for your time,

Stewart

[ianw]

Passed through Buckland today and visited the war memorial. There is also a splendid memorial to the Bovill brothers in the church :-

[jamesday]

Natalie and others

I live in Buckland and am writing a history of the men on the War Memorial. I have a lot of info on Edward Bovill but only have much less on his brother John Eric Bovill. I would be very keen to chat to Natalie as I have had no luck in tracing any family yet.

James

[Guest Joe7029]

BMAC

In reply to post 10 Thank you for your time and effort in replying it is much appreciated. Sorry for the delay I have been away without any comms!!

Regards

Joe

[Kluson]

Hi Bill

I am researching  William Henry Fincken, died on 2 July 1916 1/3 London. We thought from family stories that he was wounded on July 1 and died from wounds on July 2. He is buried at Hebuterne, we believe he was trying to dig a communication trench out into no mans land from yellow trench/ Z hedge to Fir and Firm. Is this as much detail as I am likely to find? Really appreciate any help

Thanks

Dave

[johnboy]

This topic is 5 yrs old. You might be better starting a new topic in Soldiers forum. Give as much info as you can and I am sure that you will get some help.

[Kluson]

Thanks, I did a search and found this.so replied to it.

Thanks for the advice

I did start a topic in soldiers but no replies

Many thanks once again for your advice