AndyHollinger Posted 25 December , 2006 Share Posted 25 December , 2006 I received this photo, beautifully framed for my office wall. Unfortunately, I don't know the make or model of the airplanes involved ... can anyone help me here? Are they British or French? Thanks in advance. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanA Posted 25 December , 2006 Share Posted 25 December , 2006 Looks like a Sopwith Camel to my untutored eyes. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyHollinger Posted 25 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 25 December , 2006 can anyone give me a sqn or nationality ... the center circle seems small ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolphin Posted 25 December , 2006 Share Posted 25 December , 2006 Andy The aeroplanes are definitely Sopwith Camels in British service (two American Camel squadrons used aircraft with British national markings, but the photographed machines don't have the unit markings of either the 17th or 148th Aero Sqns USAS). The two bars aft of the roundel could indicate No 46 Sqn RFC/RAF, as that was the unit's marking up to 22 March 1918, but the bars were usually marked closer to the tail. I have seen a photograph of a Camel from No 213 Sqn RAF (formerly the Seaplane Defence Squadron/No 13 Sqn RNAS at Dunkerque) with two bars, but it wasn't the official unit marking. Unfortunately, a censor has scratched out the aircraft serial numbers on the nearer machines, which make positive identification very difficult. If you can read a serial number on the fuselage or rudder of one of the background aeroplanes, it will greatly assist. The roundels are the standard proportions for British Great War aircraft, ie 1 for red, 3 for white and 5 for blue. This was later changed to 1, 2 and 3, respectively. I hope that this helps Gareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyHollinger Posted 26 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 26 December , 2006 Yes, it does .. thanks! Andy Any history on the 46th Sqn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanA Posted 26 December , 2006 Share Posted 26 December , 2006 There is a thinly fictionalised autobiography of Victor Yeates who flew with 46 squadron entitled "Winged Victory" and, more recently, Gordon Atkins has written a good biography of Yeates in "Winged Victor". I can't remember where I've put this one but I'm sure it contains photos. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 26 December , 2006 Share Posted 26 December , 2006 Hello Andy, 46 Sqn was formed at Wyton in April 1916, and flew first with Nieuport two-seaters and afterwards with Sopwith Pups, from spring 1917. In November 1917 it changed the Pubs for Camels (Battle of Cambrai) Captain D.R. MacLaren was the hightes scoring ace of 46 Sqn ( 54 victories). Regards, Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolphin Posted 26 December , 2006 Share Posted 26 December , 2006 Andy Air Vice-Marshall A S G Lee wrote of his time flying Pups and Camels in No 46 Sqn RFC in two books: No Parachute and Open Cockpit. There's a chapter or two about No 46 in his third book Flypast. Lee flew 222 hours, including 118 patrols, and was credited with 7 victories, while with the unit. Regards Gareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeW Posted 26 December , 2006 Share Posted 26 December , 2006 Come on guys, you're leading Andy up the garden path here. The Camels are from No.73 Squadron. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolphin Posted 26 December , 2006 Share Posted 26 December , 2006 Any Sorry, mea culpa. Obviously one shouldn't try to answer these questions when distracted by the festive season. The Camels are No 73 Sqn after 22 March 1918. If the second aeroplane has an 'S' on the fuselage, then it's probably 'C' Flight. No 73 Sqn was formed in July 1917 and went to France in January 1918. It served on the Western Front until the Armistice. Gareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyHollinger Posted 27 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 27 December , 2006 Anything interesting about 73 sqn? Lauren bought me them thinking they were Lafayette Esg. planes ... I knew they weren't but want to know something about the picture if it is to go in my office Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeW Posted 27 December , 2006 Share Posted 27 December , 2006 but want to know something about the picture if it is to go in my office Hey Andy, it's a very nice photograph, one that I've not seen before. I think I probably speak for most of us to say we'd all like it on our office walls. I'm by far and away not the best person to answer about RFC and latterly RAF Squadrons, but to start things off, my impression, rightly or wrongly, is that 73 was one of those squadrons that kept out of the limelight and nobody knows much about them. In France from January 1918, occupied on offensive patrols and ground attack work, 120 claimed victories, 10 pilots reaching "ace" status, most of which do not seem to be "popular" names - I have heard of Hubbard (as in old mother Hubbard). Capt.OM Baldwin 16 Capt. GL Graham 13 LT WS Stephenson 12 Capt WH Hubbard 11 Lt EJ Lussier 11 2Lt RW Chandler 7 Lt N Cooper 6 Capt M LeBlanc Smith 6 Capt TS Sharpe 6 Capt GEH Pidcock 6 The above info from Above The Trenches. Obviously a squadron that would benefit from someone carrying out a bit of research - they deserve their 15 minutes of fame. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickdavis Posted 27 December , 2006 Share Posted 27 December , 2006 There's at least one other photo to go with this one. Both were taken by an official photographer during the retreat following 21 March 1918, hence the scratched out serials. The location was Humieres and the date 6 April 1918. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan Posted 28 December , 2006 Share Posted 28 December , 2006 In November 1917 it changed the Pubs for Camels Must be a fictional squadron I can't imaginge any RFC unit giving up the pub! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyHollinger Posted 29 December , 2006 Author Share Posted 29 December , 2006 Thanks one and all ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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