Graeme Heavey Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Can anybody fill me in on some details of this battalions virtual destruction and why was it called Chocolate hill? My gt gt uncle appears to have been one of the lucky few that survived and i am wondering what it was all about? Cheers Graeme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Chocolate Hill was so called to differentiate it from another hill which was also called after its colour - Green Hill Westlake's book 'British Regiments at Gallipoli' is worth getting hold of it gives the foll; "Landed 'B' Beach and to Divisional Reserve positions at Lala Baba. Casualties from shelling - 1 killed, 22 wounded. Moved forward via north side of Salt Lake 5.30 pm (7th Aug 1915). In close support of 6th Lincolnshire took part in attack on Chocolate Hill. Moved from top of Chocolate Hill to reserve positions on beach behind Lala Baba (8th Aug) Casualties 4 killed, 53 wounded, 3 missing. Moved forward to positions under Chocolate Hill (9th Aug) Advanced for attack on Ismail Oglu Tepe 5.15 am - 'C' and 'D' Companies in front, 'A' and 'B' in reserve. Soon came under fire from Scimitar Hill. Records show that advancing troops (6th Borders, 7th South Staffs, 6th Lincs) had been informed that Scimitar Hill was held by British troops. 'A' and 'B' suffered heavy casualties - all officers except one being killed. Survivors moved forward to firing line. Battalion collected along road near Torgut Chesme and held position. Roll call at dawn (10th Aug 1915) - 5 officers, 120 other ranks." regards Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Heavey Posted 4 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Thank you Michael for your time and the info. GULP!! Its only just emerging about gt gt uncle Patrick as we speak, a bit like my gt grandad who is his elder brother by a year. My dad is named after the two of them. He was discharged in September 1916 due to his wounds. In the long run a lucky man to survive and get out of the mess I think. I will try to get that book too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Also try to get the library to get for you the 'Official History, Military Operations, Gallipoli, Vol.II'; much more detail on the battles and maps too regards Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Heavey Posted 4 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Cheers mate will do. Look forward to reading that although a fair bit of emotion involved I suspect! The extract you quoted, which unit is that from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 The quote from Westlake's 'British Regiments at Gallipoli' is 6th (Service) Battalion The Border Regiment see pages 133/4 regards Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eceabat Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Hi Pals, Just saw the posting on Chocolate Hill and thought I’d throw this in. A year or so ago I was walking over the area and, just above the road that separates Chocolate Hill from Green Hill and the cemetery on the latter, I came across a line of spent Ottoman cartridge cases in a recently ploughed field (the field had just been turned over ahead of winter). Spending about half an hour or so, I found about 50 spent cartridges extending in a line of about 50 metres or more on the inland slope of the hill, roughly parallel to the road. Speaking to Sahin Aldogan, a Turkish expert on the campaign, we agreed that it was likely that the cartridges came from the Ottoman troops outposted in the area falling back ahead of the British advance. A later search found spent Ottoman cartridges and some spent and unfired 303 around the crest of Chocolate Hill. When ploughed over, the reason Chocolate Hill was given its name is apparent, very dark, rich coloured soil. The Turgut Cesme was demolished in the 1970s or 80s. However, with the assistance of local farmers, a friend Jeff Cleverly and I were able to locate its position. While there are only some remnants of broken stone, some water still comes to the surface at the site. Hope this is of some interest. Cheers Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Bill, It's nice to hear from you again - you must have been very busy of late quote: "The Turgut Cesme was demolished in the 1970s or 80s. However, with the assistance of local farmers, a friend Jeff Cleverly and I were able to locate its position. While there are only some remnants of broken stone, some water still comes to the surface at the site." Am I right in thinking that is one of the Turkish wells, sometimes called by the Brits, 'fountains?' And can you oblige by pointing me in the right direction to it on the map [note: the map below is Dec'15 and NOT Aug'15] Regarding the names given to the hills, the British OH has the following to say "Rising from the plain, midway between the W Hills and Lala Baba, two small isolated hills also claim attention. These two hill, joined by a low nek, were subsequently called Chocolate Hill and Green Hill from their prevailing colours; but before the Suvla landing they were known as 'the Chocolate Hills'. On the Turkish map they were collectively called Mastan Tepe (Yilghin Burnu)." Plenty of room there for confusion, which is exactly what happened apparently See footnote page 252 "When the term 'Yilghin Burnu and Ismail Oglu Tepe' was, quite correctly, used in orders to express 'Chocolate Hill, Green Hill and the W Hills', many officers, who saw the hills for the first time that day, took Yilghin Burnu to refer to Chocolate Hill and Ismail Oglu Tepe to Green Hill, immediately to the east of it. This was undoubtedly the reason why, later in the day (7th Aug), some of the troops ordered to advance on Ismail Oglu Tepe ignored the W Hills altogether." 'Staff work' - what, where? Best regards Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevem49 Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Chocolate Hill was so called to differentiate it from another hill which was also called after its colour - Green Hill Westlake's book 'British Regiments at Gallipoli' is worth getting hold of it gives the foll; "Landed 'B' Beach and to Divisional Reserve positions at Lala Baba. Casualties from shelling - 1 killed, 22 wounded. Moved forward via north side of Salt Lake 5.30 pm (7th Aug 1915). In close support of 6th Lincolnshire took part in attack on Chocolate Hill. Moved from top of Chocolate Hill to reserve positions on beach behind Lala Baba (8th Aug) Casualties 4 killed, 53 wounded, 3 missing. Moved forward to positions under Chocolate Hill (9th Aug) Advanced for attack on Ismail Oglu Tepe 5.15 am - 'C' and 'D' Companies in front, 'A' and 'B' in reserve. Soon came under fire from Scimitar Hill. Records show that advancing troops (6th Borders, 7th South Staffs, 6th Lincs) had been informed that Scimitar Hill was held by British troops. 'A' and 'B' suffered heavy casualties - all officers except one being killed. Survivors moved forward to firing line. Battalion collected along road near Torgut Chesme and held position. Roll call at dawn (10th Aug 1915) - 5 officers, 120 other ranks." regards Michael Don't forget the 9th Bn Sherwood Foresters who were part of this Brigade. 150 name son the Helles memorial testify to their efforts on 8th and 21st August 1915. stevem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Heavey Posted 6 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Absolutely not forgotten mate, bless them all. What a total nightmare it all must have been for the blokes who had never left their villages to be fighting in Turkey. The mind boggles!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Heavey Posted 6 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Soory forgetting my manners!! Thanks everyone for the info, much appreciated!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garycaulfield Posted 11 November , 2006 Share Posted 11 November , 2006 I was fascinated to see this thread on the board, as only last Sunday 5th Nov, I was standing on the slopes of Choclate Hill! I managed to blag a trip to the region at tax payers expense (long story) and got the opportunity to spend a day in the penninsula. My gggrandfather, Fusilier 12403 John McShane Of 5th Royal Irish Fusiliers was killed on 8th August 1915 on or in the vicinity of Chocolate Hill. The RIF had a hard time in that area due to sniping, shelling and burning scrub. The commnader's war diary for the period states: 8th August Chocolate Hill (53). Occupied Turk trenches. Some shelling. Sniping exceedingly prevalent and without intermission. Hill honeycombed with enemy trenches, enemy still in the vicinity of GREEN HILL and snipers in the vally (sic) between the two hills. 8th YILHIN BERNU (Chocolate Hill). Whether caused by H.E or otherwise I cannot say, but the brushwood and undergrowth which covers the hill caught fire, burning fiercely and extending rapidly. This after some time and with much difficulty was eventually extinguished. Ordered to be ready to move to HILL 50 to relieve the S.Stafford regt. The war diary then goes on to state about their relief of The South Staffs on Hill 50 (Green Hill). I read somwhere that Choclate Hill got its name from the burnt scrub, referred to above. I think this is unlikely as it features in the diary with the name Choclaoate Hill, before the fire had started. This war diary which I downloaded form the NA site also contains numerous coloured drawings made by the CO of the 5th RIF: Lt Col Pike, who appears to have been a talented artist.When I get my scanner up and running again I will send them in. Best wishes Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gabriel S Posted 15 August , 2014 Share Posted 15 August , 2014 I have just come across this topic as I call to mind that many years ago in Bakewell, Derbyshire they had just opened the Old House Museum. The chap keeping an eye on the place showed us a glass display case in which was a clip of 303 bullets. Behind the heads and at about 90 degrees to them was a bullet head. He told us that this was his clip and he had been in a battle at some place called Chocolate Hill. The firing had been intense and it was only later he noticed the enemy bullet which had lodged itself in his clip of 303s. Often wondered where Chocolate Hill was and this morning - found it! I guess the old soldier is long gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossar Posted 21 January , 2022 Share Posted 21 January , 2022 Gary - I note that you say you have got hold of the 5th Royal Irish Fusiliers war diary for around 8th August 1915. I have gone onto the NA to try and get this - but it appears that it is not now there. Only dates for the 5th Battalion that are coming up are later in 1918. I would be grateful if you could advise how I could access the diary from 1915. Many thanks Ann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Michelle Young Posted 21 January , 2022 Admin Share Posted 21 January , 2022 @Garycaulfield hasn’t been on the site since 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garycaulfield Posted 21 January , 2022 Share Posted 21 January , 2022 Hi Ann I'm afraid I have no idea why the NA no longer have this war diary as a download etc. However if you contact the RIF museum in Armagh they may be able to assist. I hope this helps. Good luck. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRC Posted 21 January , 2022 Share Posted 21 January , 2022 3 hours ago, Crossar said: Gary - I note that you say you have got hold of the 5th Royal Irish Fusiliers war diary for around 8th August 1915. I have gone onto the NA to try and get this - but it appears that it is not now there. Only dates for the 5th Battalion that are coming up are later in 1918. I would be grateful if you could advise how I could access the diary from 1915. War Diaries for British Army units who served at Gallipoli have been digitised but are only available on Ancestry. Various ways to get there, but I usually just go for "Browse this collection" and use the drop-down boxes to select:- Regiment or Unit: Princess Victoria's (Royal Irish Fusiliers) Division or Corps: 10th (Irish) Division Piece descriptions will then pop up relating to the 5th and 6th Battalion - see screenshot. Image courtesy Ancestry. That search page can be found here - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/60380/ Cheers, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaureenE Posted 21 January , 2022 Share Posted 21 January , 2022 5th Battalion Royal Irish Fusiliers is one of the War Diaries transcribed by the late Martin Gillott and available in a Kindle Edition, so the handwriting is already interpreted and transcribed for you. You don't need to have a Kindle, you can download the Kindle Ap. Cost is £2.99 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Gallipoli-Diaries-Royal-Irish-Fusiliers-ebook/dp/B01N4RO2YA/ref=sr_1_18?keywords="Gallipoli+Diaries"+Gillott&qid=1642804847&s=digital-text&sr=1-18 The available War Diaries https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k="Gallipoli+Diaries"+Gillott&i=digital-text&qid=1642804847&ref=sr_pg_1 Maureen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossar Posted 22 January , 2022 Share Posted 22 January , 2022 Many thanks for this Peter - and so glad you provided that link - as I am on Ancestry but couldn't get onto that page from the search function!! Got the diary - that's great - researching Blantyre soldiers who fought and died in WW1 and a few of them died around 7th and 8th August - with different battalions - some Royal Irish Fusiliers and others with Australian Imperial Forces - but all at Gallipoli. Thanks for your advice and assistance. And thanks too Maureen for providing the link to that book as well - really appreciated. Ann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevem49 Posted 3 February , 2022 Share Posted 3 February , 2022 Some WD for Gallipoli, like the 9th Battalion Sherwood Foresters (Nott's and Derby Regiment) seemed to have vanished without trace. Only returning on 1st July 1916, when they landed in France from Egypt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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