9th Highland Light Infantry

[Guest Robyn]

my great uncles David and Parlane Chalmers (twins) were killed in France in 1918. I have details of their deaths and have grave details etc but short of visiting the UK I do not know where to start.

I would very much like to know where they were fighting (they were in "B" Company if that is useful) and of the battles they were involved in, but the language of armies has me a little bit baffled. Can you help?

Many thanks

Robyn

[dycer]

Robyn,

One of our Forum Members-kenneth mcarthur-takes a great interest in the 9th H.LI..He recently e-mailed me the Battalion's complete WW1 War Diary for example.

Can I suggest you E-mail Kenneth via the Forum to alert him to your interest and take it from there.

If you don't receive a response E-mail me via the Forum and I'll seek permission to E-mail you a copy of the War Diary.

The Diary gives a daily account of the Battalion's activities throughout the War e.g Places,Battles and Casualties,etc.I should stress ,though that only the names of Officer Casualties are recorded.

George

[ceebee]

Robyn

Adding to George's comments, you may also like to look at the website for the Royal Highland Fusiliers from which you can download Shoulder to Shoulder "The Glasgow Highlanders" 1914-1918 and other documents for the 9th Bn, including the war diary. See the link here.

I have some more information and will have a look when I get home tonight.

Cheers

Chris

[Dolus]

Private 202143 Parlane B Chalmers was killed on 13 April 1918 when the 9th HLI (The Glasgow Highlanders) were at Neuve-Eglise.

Private 202142 David Chalmers was killed on 26 October 1918 when the 9th HLI attacked the village of Englefontaine.

Both these actions, and indeed the full story of the 9th HLI in the Great War, are in Alec Weir's recently published "Come On Highlanders". (It was Alec Weir who transcribed the 9th HLI War Diary, now available as has been said on the RHF website, as part of his original research into the 9th HLI).

[Malcolm]

The diary is online and freely available.

see

 

Aye

Malcolm

[jdajd]

I have little to add because everyone else has covered the sources pretty well, but I have more than a passing interest in the Glasgow Highlanders myself. If you can manage try to find Courage Past by Alex Aiken. It is out of print and can be kind of pricey, but worth finding. Alex's grandfather (?) served in the 9th and the book tells of his experiences up to their fateful visit to High Wood July 14/15. Alex was the one who set up the cairn for the fallen at High Wood. If you are interested I will be visiting High Wood and the Somme this summer and would be happy to help in any way I can.

Jon

[ceebee]

I see there is a second post running on this topic which collectively provides a good amount of information.

I can only add a little more information gleaned from my research of Pte Thomas Collard Graves MM of the 9th Bn who was also KIA on 13 April 1918. Thomas is also commemorated on the Ploegsteert Memorial.

The service numbers for David and Parlane Chalmers (202142 and 202143) suggest that they were originally in the 4th Bn HLI (a Territorial Force Bn). When the Territorial Force service numbers were renumbered in March 1917 the range 200001 to 240000 was allocated to the 4th Bn HLI. The 9th Bn were allocated the range 355001 to 380000. I am told that a soldier who moved to a different battalion in the same regiment was likely to retain his service number.

In terms of battle nomenclature, the 9th's action on 13 April 1918 falls within the Battle of Bailleul (13-15 April 1918), which includes the tactical incident called the Defence of Neuve Eglise. This battle is one of several that are collectively titled the Battles of the Lys.

The 9th's action in October 1918 falls within the Battle of the Selle (17-25 October 1918). This battle formed part of the battles titled The Final Advance in Picardy.

In both actions the 9th was in the 100th Brigade, 33rd Division.

The Scottish National War Memorial's website has an excellent database that records soldier's details and can also be used to research deaths for Scottish battalions for each day of the war. For instance 34 men from the 9th Bn died on 13 April 1918.

Maps of the battle areas can be very helpful in building a picture. You may wish to try the Paths of Glory website which has a good range of trench maps. The site is run by Forum member Croonaert.

Lastly, medal cards may be downloaded (at a fee) from the UK National Archives .

Cheers

Chris

[Guest Robyn]

Thank you all so much. The links have been great. I admit to shedding a tear or two for those young men, reading the daily report of the horrible circumstances of their deaths. David and Parlane have become family heroes but their deaths so close together and so near the end of the war literally killed their mother. She died of "grief" six months after them. I had all but given up on really finding any information because Australia, where I am, is a heck of a long way from France or Scotland.

+Thanks again. What a fantastic development the internet is!!!!

Kind regards

Robyn

[olosangus]

Thanks to this post I was able to track down the MM action for Bugler Johnstone at Cuinchy in June 1916 on the war diary. He also won the DCM in April 1918. I am lucky neough to have his medals in my collection.

Much appreciated. Simon

[Guest Robyn]

The service numbers for David and Parlane Chalmers (202142 and 202143) suggest that they were originally in the 4th Bn HLI (a Territorial Force Bn). When the Territorial Force service numbers were renumbered in March 1917 the range 200001 to 240000 was allocated to the 4th Bn HLI. The 9th Bn were allocated the range 355001 to 380000. I am told that a soldier who moved to a different battalion in the same regiment was likely to retain his service number.

Can you please tell me what a Territorial Force is?

Robyn

[dycer]

Robyn,

Territorials were part-time Soldiers who looked after Home Defence.

For example one of my Uncles was a Postman.

If you look on the Main Website-Researching a Soldier-you will find lots of information about the Force and how they went from their liability to just to defend Britain to fighting in France.

George

[Guest Robyn]

Thanks George,

I will go looking. Is there any way to verify whether indeed a soldier was first of the Territorial Force and then moved to a different Battalion?

Robyn

[dycer]

Robyn,

I must confess I am not a great expert on this.

If you look on the Site I referred to you earlier you will find an Article on how Territorial Soldiers were given a new Service Number in 1917.

It appears, given the Numbers you have quoted and the information in the Article we can deduce that your Relatives served in the 4th Battalion and subsequently transferred/were drafted to the 9th.

There may be something in the 9th War Diary that refers to a draft of men being received from the the 4th Battalion but to be honest your best hope is to see if some kind Soul will search the National Archives in Kew,London to see if their Service Papers survive,many were destroyed during the London Blitz in 1940.

I trust someone more learned will come along soon and offer better advice.

I am not trying to be deliberately vague but it is just that my Uncles served in a different Scots Regiment so I cannot claim to be an expert on the H.L.I or indeed my Uncles'.

George

[Guest Robyn]

Thanks George,

I posted a request yesterday for a "kind soul" but it has disappeared. I'm still working my way around the site and will try again. Thanks for the advice.

Funny thing is that my brother in law is the curator or some such thing at Kew. He has had no contact with the family for forty odd years. I keep trying to make contact but have had no response of any kind from him. It's a shame to have such a valuable resource at hand and yet so completely unreachable. Let alone being a sad loss for the family to have lost contact.

Thanks again

Robyn