Jamesniece Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 I am trying to research Great Uncle James Nicol killed at Gallipoli 17/06/1915. Have a picture of him with nelson on naval hat but believe he served on Clyde which sank. How do I find out more information. No record of him in campaign medals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 James, Welcome to the forum, James was in the Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve and served in Nelson Battalion which was on shore, its unlikley he served on a ship. Have a search on the forum for the Nelson Battalion which was in the 1st Naval brigade at Gallipoli. Regards Charles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 Hi James, I don't know whether or not this will help you? Nelson Bn., R.N.D. Roll of Honour: Nicol. J. Petty Officer, R.N.V.R. 'Clyde' Z/2280. Glasgow. K.I.A. Gallipoli 17/06/1915. Regards Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshdoc Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 Hi James neice, I think I am right in saying you would not expect to find a MIC for him in the natiional Archives as they are for army only. There are no MICS as such for the navy. GAreth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 25 April , 2006 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2006 James, Welcome to the forum, James was in the Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve and served in Nelson Battalion which was on shore, its unlikley he served on a ship. Have a search on the forum for the Nelson Battalion which was in the 1st Naval brigade at Gallipoli. Regards Charles Thank you for your help. Will follow this clue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 The Clyde here refers to his recruitment area. The RNVR had various recruiting devisions like Clyde, Wales or London and they formed part of his number in this case CZ 2280. There are no online mics, but there is a medal roll which will say to whom the medals were sent. His service card is at Kew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 25 April , 2006 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2006 Hi James, I don't know whether or not this will help you? Nelson Bn., R.N.D. Roll of Honour: Nicol. J. Petty Officer, R.N.V.R. 'Clyde' Z/2280. Glasgow. K.I.A. Gallipoli 17/06/1915. Regards Arthur Thanks Arthur. Can you explain whether Glasgow means where he enlisted? I believed that he was born in Rockhampton, Australia as his family lived in Aust then returned to Scotland. Does the "clyde" mean the ship.Thanks for your interest - I can't believe you all answered so quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 25 April , 2006 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2006 The Clyde here refers to his recruitment area. The RNVR had various recruiting devisions like Clyde, Wales or London and they formed part of his number in this case CZ 2280. There are no online mics, but there is a medal roll which will say to whom the medals were sent. His service card is at Kew. Thank you that would be wonderful as I live in Australia and getting to kew would present a challenge!!. Not sure if this is the place to reply to the message that just popped up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 Thanks Arthur. Can you explain whether Glasgow means where he enlisted? I believed that he was born in Rockhampton, Australia as his family lived in Aust then returned to Scotland. Does the "clyde" mean the ship.Thanks for your interest - I can't believe you all answered so quickly. Hi By the information that we have I would think that he joined the the R.N.V.R. in Glasgow as this where you would find the Clyde Division of the Reserve. Below is a copy of the R.N.R. badge. The frame for the badge below was different for the R.N.V.R. howevever, the badge in the centre was the same. The ship that served at Gallipoli was the 'SS River Clyde' Regards Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted 25 April , 2006 Share Posted 25 April , 2006 Hi Further information regarding the frame of the R.N.V.R. I have managed to lay my hands on a copy of the sort of frame that the title and badge would have been in. Regards Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 25 April , 2006 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2006 Thank you Arthur, this is all helpful. Janet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbluesboy Posted 27 April , 2006 Share Posted 27 April , 2006 Hi Jamesniece.Your relative served in the Nelson Battalion,Royal Naval Division.All records for the Royal Naval Division apart from the medal rolls are held at Royal Naval Airstation Yeovilton Museum.The RNVR had Divisions throughout the UK,such as London,Tyne,Mersey,Glasgow,Etc.As your ancestor was a Petty Officer which is roughly equal to a Sergeant in the Army I would guess that he was already in the Royal Naval Reserve before WW1.The address of the RNAS Museum is as follows,the staff are very helpful and for a small fee they will send you a copy of all the records they have on your ancestor, FAO Mrs Jan Keohane, Ref : RND, Fleet Air Arm Museum, RNAS Yeovilton, Somerset,BA22 8HT, England,UK.. Tel No is UK... 01935 840565. Hope this Helps Bob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 27 April , 2006 Author Share Posted 27 April , 2006 Many thanks Bob will get onto it. Janet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 28 April , 2006 Share Posted 28 April , 2006 James Nicol qualified for a 1914 Star as shown in Fevyer & Wilson's '1914 Star to the RN etc.' The Nelson battalion seems to have had a large contingent cron the Clyde division in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 28 April , 2006 Share Posted 28 April , 2006 All records for the Royal Naval Division apart from the medal rolls are held at Royal Naval Airstation Yeovilton Museum. This is only correct as far as it goes. The National Archives (TNA) hold microfilmed copies of the service cards for the RND ADM 339/1 for the service records of RND ratings ADM 339/2 for the service records of RND ratings who were killed ADM 339/3 for the service records of RND officers The Fleet Air Arm Museum holds the originals (but for a change the PRO copied both sides!) of these records and the engagement papers, which give limited information often duplicated on the service cards (eg height, hair colour). It is a small museum (compared with say the RAF Museum) with small staff, mostly volunteers and limited resources. It is far better to either contact TNA at Kew who have far more research staff, or ask someone in the Forum to do a look up and see what you get. It was possible for men in both the RNVR and RNAS to enter service at a level above the standard Ordinary Seaman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 29 April , 2006 Author Share Posted 29 April , 2006 Thank you to all who have helped especially Fred who has found the record at Kew and forwarded it on to me. The only previous record that I had of James Nicol was on the war record from his older brother Thomas who was killed in France in 1918. It mentioned that he had a younger brother killed at Gallipoli but the Australians had no records of him. Thomas was with the Australian Army at that time so his records were easy to access from the Australian War Museum. They have an excellent service which photocopied his whole service record which also included letters from Thomas's mother regarding his effects which were lost at sea. It was great to see my Great Grandparents writing. It must have been devasting to lose both sons. Lest we forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 6 May , 2006 Share Posted 6 May , 2006 Here's the RND service card from ADM 339/2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 12 May , 2006 Author Share Posted 12 May , 2006 Here's the RND service card from ADM 339/2. Thanks for this. Why doesn't it show date and place of birth? Would he have signed enlistment papers? are there likely to be other records or is this all that was kept on soldiers? jamesniece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
per ardua per mare per terram Posted 12 May , 2006 Share Posted 12 May , 2006 the DoB is on the card and was on the transcription that I sent you. Date of birth 26/10/1894 His place of birth will be on the engagement papers held at the FAA Museum, at the address above. These are the only personnel records that I know of that have survived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesniece Posted 15 May , 2006 Author Share Posted 15 May , 2006 the DoB is on the card and was on the transcription that I sent you. Date of birth 26/10/1894 His place of birth will be on the engagement papers held at the FAA Museum, at the address above. These are the only personnel records that I know of that have survived. Sorry I realised that you had given me DOB just as I pushed enter. I will have to access the engagement papers as I would be interested to see if he was born in Australia or Scotland. Many thanks again for all your efforts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 30 May , 2006 Share Posted 30 May , 2006 In Capt Roy Swales' history of the battalion 'Nelson at War 1914-1918' [pub by Pen & Sword 2004] James' name appears on page 60 with the list of the fallen for the period 8 June - 11 July 1915 Regarding the date when James was KiA, alas there are few details page 56 "14 June saw Nelson Battalion move back into the firing line and over the next four weeks they moved in and out of the front and support lines as dictated by the rotation of the brigades. The Divisional War Diary records many of these as 'quiet days' but this description is purely relative, because sniping and shelling of the camps and bivouac areas continued and all was far from quiet in the RND firing line." James' name also appears on the Helles Memorial best of luck with your research Michael D.R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horatio2 Posted 27 June , 2006 Share Posted 27 June , 2006 I am trying to research Great Uncle James Nicol killed at Gallipoli 17/06/1915. Have a picture of him with nelson on naval hat but believe he served on Clyde which sank. How do I find out more information. No record of him in campaign medals. There is little detail in available records on the activities of Nelson Battalion on 17 June 1915. However, 1st Naval Brigade War Diary states that at 3pm that day there was an exchange of shell fire (recorded in the diary of a Drake Battalion officer as "an artillery duel") and that the Nelson trenches were damaged, so the Nelsons were in the line. Acting PO Nicol was the only Nelson killed on that day, perhaps in that exchange of fire. FAA Museum is by far the best archive for RND records because the 'official' microfiche of RND Record Cards at TNA has scores of errors and omissions. The museum also has all RNVR enrolment papers and much else, such as courts martial records and Active Service Casualty Forms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Posted 27 June , 2006 Share Posted 27 June , 2006 James is remembered on the Scottish National Memorial, Edinburgh Castle. Details Surname NICOL Firstname James Service Number Clyde 1/2280. Date Death 17/06/1915 Decoration Place of birth Other SNWM roll THE ROYAL NAVY Rank Petty Officer Theatre of death R.N.V.R. Nelson Battalion R.N.D. Aye Malcolm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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