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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Soldier photo's and some embroidary !


richardshaw

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Hello,

I was so impressed with the kind response to my last my post I thought I would chance anyone being able to shed some light on some photo's I have.

On the photo's I am posting Im not sure who the people are or the units. I beleive they are maybe connected. The photo with the embroidary could have a link through the name of Sgt J Sims West Riding which is a family name.

The only other clue I have is that the back of pic 27 it has a name Herbert on it !

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AS the resolution wasnt good enough on the last picture here is a list of the names on the squares and any other details I could read. The date seems to be 1917.

Maybe it will be of interest to someone?

Pte S Hudson 8 Coy Welsh Rgt Pioneers

Rifleman C Mernagh 4th Royal Irish Rifles

Pte J Waugh Northumberland Fusliers

AB J Gillespie 1st Hawke Royal Naval Division

Pte Hexley 2nd Royal Warwickshire

D Sully 15th Divisonal Motor Transport

Pte. R Campbell 13th Royal Scots

Pte. W Lee 2nd Batt Suffolk Regt.

Pte. J Divall 10th Batt The Queens Own

Pte. G Wilkins 22nd Middlesex Regt

Pte A Burniston 26th Royal Fusiliers

Pte J Playford ?? Regt

Pte A Rowe 8th Batt East Sussex Regt

Pte J Pinnock 3rd London Regt

Pte C Hunt 3rd Worcestershire Regt

Sgt J Holliday Tyneside Scottish

Pte C Panter 1st Northants Regt

Pte Hawker 17th Notts and Derby

Pte H Pearce The Devon Regt 8th Batt

L/Cpl A Willats 17th Batt Middlesex Regt

Pte J Houseman West Yorks

Pte J Eaglesfield 1 S.Staffs Regt

Sgt A L Loft East York 8th Batt

Pte W Young 9th Glasgow Highlanders

RFLN C Harvey 1/9th London Regt (QVR)

Sgt R H Cass RE

Pte B M Pipps 1st Batt Royal Fusliers

Pte F Chitty 19th Batt The Welsh Regt

Pte JA Chitty 2/8 London Royal Fusiliers

Gunner J S McLeod RGA Heavy Batt

Pte C Bowles 121Machine Gun Corps

Cpl. H Heal 1st Batt Royal Warwick Regt

Pte E Coin 2nd Batt RMLI RND

Pte H J Placy 1st Field Ambulance

Sgt R E Machan 32nd Royal Fus

Sgt J Rooke 1st Yorkshire Regt

Rifleman H Earnshaw London Rifle Brigade

Pte S Cameron OAS

L/Cpl S Cage 1st Somerset Regt

Pte Hewer 1st Batt Royal Berks

Pte W Ormald Gordon Highlander

Pte W Knipe 9th West Riding

Pte W Moir 1st Gordon Highlanders

Pte W H Rothwell 1/5th L N Lancs Regt

Pte W Moir 1st Gordon Highlanders

Pte W Green WRFA RAMC TF

Pte A Wilson 1st Royal Sussex Regt

Pte JC Braybrook 1st London Regt RF

Cpl J Grace 7th Manchester Regt

Pte W Hargreaves 12th Manchester Regt

Pte H Plunkett 2nd Royal Irish

Pte J McDonald 1st Batt HLI

Sgt J Sims 8th West Riding

Pte J Leary 50th Division RAMC

Pte A Wilkinson 12th Manchester Regt

Pte Mill?? 6th Batt ASH Arg

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Hospital therapeutic sewing blanket.

Was big at the time ... sewing circles etc. Great pics.

I think that's what it is anyway.

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Richard,

Great photos, the first shows a section of gunners (RFA/RGA/RHA) the guy back right wears the rank of a staff sergeant - 3 stripes and a crown (don't know his appointment). Notice the cigarette in his hand.

Tom McC

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The cyclists in post #4 wear a non-regulation footwear? (though it seems more appropiate for pedalling)

Gloria

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The Tall SSgt - if early in the war he may hold the appointment of BSM

Compared to the other troops he is immaculately turned out. Also, I think he is wearing riding breeches. Not too uncommon for the RHA/RFA.

Again hope this helps

PS - I also think the back row of gunners look small, (horsemen? Jockeys on Home Service?)

Tom McC

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I think the 'lost' right arm is just behind the sergeant's back actually, as the normal way to fold a uniform sleeve is outwards with three equal folds as per regulations.

Excellent photos!

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Richard,

Great photos, the first shows a section of gunners (RFA/RGA/RHA) the guy back right wears the rank of a staff sergeant - 3 stripes and a crown (don't know his appointment). Notice the cigarette in his hand.

Tom McC

A gunner would never ever wear three chevrons and a crown .... the device over the chevrons is the full sergeant's gun, I believe. The gun was worn by all full ranks from sergeant upwards. Next rank up, several possible appointments, would have crown over gun, which I just do not see.

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Thanks to everyone for the feedback. It has now given me a few clues to try and make an identification of why the family should have this photo. My G.G.Grandfather was a sgt Major in the Royal Garrison Artillery up to about 1900. It maybe someone from that part of the family who followed in his footsteps?

On the other photo's does anyone have any clues to who the regiments are? I have enclosed a more detailed image of cap badges in case in can offer any further clues. Im trying to see of their is a connection with the name of Sims from the patchwork photo and the other pictures.

Thanks again to everyone for their kind contributions.

post-11370-1142110405.jpg

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I think the 'lost' right arm is just behind the sergeant's back actually, as the normal way to fold a uniform sleeve is outwards with three equal folds as per regulations.

Jake

The arm seems to be at a strange angle if it is behind his back. Will you please explain what you mean by "the normal way to fold a uniform sleeve is outwards etc".

Myrtle

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On the other photo's does anyone have any clues to who the regiments are? I have enclosed a more detailed image of cap badges in case in can offer any further clues. Im trying to see of their is a connection with the name of Sims from the patchwork photo and the other pictures.

For the rough look of the Cap Badge and Shoulder Titles... maybe the Northern Cyclist Battalion

Gloria

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Get someone to stand as per the sergeant with an arm behind his back Myrtle, and I'm sure it'll be self evident!

The proper and regualtion fold of the sleeve is to make three equal folds of the material and pin it with the cuff edge facing outwards (so as not to catch the side of the uniform jacket) and displaying any badge of rank or wound emblem worn at the cuff.

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Get someone to stand as per the sergeant with an arm behind his back Myrtle, and I'm sure it'll be self evident!

The proper and regualtion fold of the sleeve is to make three equal folds of the material and pin it with the cuff edge facing outwards (so as not to catch the side of the uniform jacket) and displaying any badge of rank or wound emblem worn at the cuff.

Jake

I had already done what you suggest before my last post. I still think that his right arm looks a smaller size than his left. He must have been left handed if not right armless as he is smoking with his left. I take it you are saying that the folded sleeve was the way in which an armless Sgt would wear his empty sleeve ?

Myrtle

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Comparatively 'armless, then?

I find it very difficult to believe that a one-armed RA Sgt [glad we have dropped the 'staff sgt' bit] would have been retained in the service. The place for an empty sleeve is across the front, surely, in any case?

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Surely the loss of an arm (or part of it) would be considered enough cause for a soldier to be honourably discharged from service -and receive a pension-? Since men without amputations were so (and got their SWB) I should say that an one-armed soldier was condidered "not fit" to remain, at least, in active services.

However, not being an expert, I stand to be corrected... does anyone know about soldiers with amputations being kept in service? I understand that physically unfit or medically downgraded men (though not amputees) would serve either in Home Service units, Labour Corps, Garrison duties or whatever form of service which didn't require the minimum physical/health standards of those serving in the Firing line (the ones enabling them to march with full-pack equipment to and from the lines, living in the trenches, fighting, etc...)

Gloria

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Grumpy/LB,

Yes your correct, the Sgt/SSgt Rank in the gunners would have a cloth field gun above the chevrons (similar to the one on the cap badge). Nicely spotted :)

Tom McC

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Some experienced men with wounds, and presumably amputations, were kept on in Recruitment and Training Units, though I remain unconvinced that this is the case in the photograph.

Surely a Senior NCO with front line service, as he appears to be, would be invaluable to the MOD and well able to pass on knowledge to new recruits, one-armed, 'recovered from wounds' or otherwise?

Wounded soldiers were retained until they were discharged after convalescence, and the wearing of uniform was still compulsory outwith hospital.

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Comparatively 'armless, then?

I find it very difficult to believe that a one-armed RA Sgt [glad we have dropped the 'staff sgt' bit] would have been retained in the service. The place for an empty sleeve is across the front, surely, in any case?

Couldn't he have been retained for training purposes ?

Jake

I posted the same time as you therefore my question has been answered.

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  • 3 weeks later...

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