Nick Farr Posted 20 January , 2006 Share Posted 20 January , 2006 I'm researching the history of the 1st Battalion Welsh Guards........Owen D kindly sent me this DCM citation....... 2361 Pte J.O. Pritchard (Carnarvon), W Gds. (LG 17 Sept. 1917). For conspicuous gallantry and devotion to duty in guiding a platoon of a relieving battalion to the front line, through a very heavy barrage, although wounded in fifteen different places early during the operation. He covered in all a distance of over three miles, and it was entirely due to his pluck and determination that a large section of the front line was relieved. He refused to have his wounds attended to until he had carried out his duty, after which he was carried back to the dressing station on a stretcher. (what?......WOUNDED FIFTEEN TIMES!!!!!) How was it decided which medal should be awarded? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 20 January , 2006 Share Posted 20 January , 2006 My take is that this bloke showed immense bravery, steadiness and responsibility. He was under fire and wounded, as you say 15 times but extent of wounds? I note he was taken out on stretcher so some must have been pretty grim. He was a private soldier/gdsman. STEADINESS = unspectacular? Is 'spectacular' i.e. exposed to the vision of many, a bigger factor in the award of VC than we would like to admit? In this case the guy is performing a duty which he has been charged with. He is seen as a cog in the wheel (by even his own comrades) acting as guide to a file of boys, most of them not recognising the vitally important role he has played? Perhaps the award of the DCM in such circumstances is actually an indication of how IMPORTANT some considered his role to be? I do not denigrate, I ask a question. Before anyone jumps down me throat!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOMMESOLDIER Posted 20 January , 2006 Share Posted 20 January , 2006 Also, doesn't an act have to be witnessed and recorded by an officer, to be considered for the VC ? Cheers Tim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gericht 1914 Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 I don't think it should have been a VC for the reason that it was awarded for (admittedly very courageously) carrying out a duty (ie. "Distinguished Conduct") rather than taking part in an "action" as such. A rather clumsy explaination on my part there, but I know what I mean!!! Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveBrigg Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 Quite possibly the 15 wounds were all received at the same time. The playwright R C Sherriff was wounded in 52 places, but all from the same shell. It takes nothing away from the bravery of this man in continuing to lead the platoon, but I suppose in terms of risk, he faced the same dangers as those whom he led. The criteria for awarding a VC seems to change according to circumstances; IMHO all those who left their trenches on the Somme, knowing that the wire was uncut and German defences largely intact, should have a medal for bravery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Farr Posted 21 January , 2006 Author Share Posted 21 January , 2006 Thanks for that...I see what you are saying. The only Welsh Guardsmen who received the VC was Serjeant Robert Bye. I've included details about him as a matter of interest. Sgt. Robert Bye, V.C. WELSH GUARDS Robert James Bye was born on December 12, 1889 at 13 Maritime Street, Graig, Pontypridd, Wales. His parents Martin and Sarah Jane Bye then moved to 21 Woodfield Street, Penrhiwceiber, near Aberdare, Wales, and Robert was educated at the local school there. After leaving school he worked at The Deep Dyffryn Colliery, Mountain Ash, also near Aberdare, before joining the Welsh Guards on April 3, 1915. Advancement through the ranks was rapid when he was promoted to Lance-Corporal in March 1916, Corporal in September of that year and then to Sergeant in April 1917. He served in France and Flanders and was discharged in February 1919. Six months later he re-enlisted in the Notts and Derby Regiment, remaining with it until 1925, and finally re-enlisting again in the Sherwood Foresters in World War Two. After the war he worked at Warsop Main, Firbeck and Welbeck Collieries in the Nottingham coalfield and also became a temporary police constable at Mansfield, Notts. He married a Welsh girl from Penrhiwceiber, Mabel Lloyd, at Pontypridd on October 14, 1912 and they had two sons and two daughters. He died in 1962, aged 72 and is buried at Warsop Cemetery, Nottingham. Sgt. Bye won his VC on 31 July 1917 at the Yser Canal, Belgium, where he displayed the utmost courage and devotion to duty during an attack on the enemy’s position. During the attack, at the third Battle of Ypres, Sgt. Bye saw that the leading waves were being troubled by two enemy blockhouses. He rushed at one of them and put the German garrison out of action. He then rejoined his company and went forward to the second objective. Later he volunteered to take charge of a party detailed to clear up a line of blockhouses which had been passed. He accomplished this, taking many prisoners, and then advanced to the third objective, again taking a number of prisoners. During the action he accounted for over 70 of the enemy. His actions in Woods 15 and 16 and at the Yser Canal on the same day were also taken into account. Sgt. Bye’s citation appeared in the London Gazette on September 6, 1917 and he was invested with his VC by King George V on September 27, 1917. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom compton Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 if he had been a OFFICER he would have got a vc no bother .tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raster Scanning Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 Just found this out of interest. This man was wounded 37 times! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raster Scanning Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 Cont Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raster Scanning Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 Sorry about the size best I could do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gericht 1914 Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 if he had been a OFFICER he would have got a vc no bother .tom. I'm sorry, but I very much doubt it. Can I ask what draws you to such a conclusion? Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Miller Posted 21 January , 2006 Share Posted 21 January , 2006 I don't think it should have been a VC for the reason that it was awarded for (admittedly very courageously) carrying out a duty (ie. "Distinguished Conduct") rather than taking part in an "action" as such. A rather clumsy explaination on my part there, but I know what I mean!!! Dave. James Miller VC, buried in Dartmoor Cem received his VC for relaying two messages over open country after being blasted in the abdomen before he'd barely taken a step. Was this death doing his duty, or did the fact that he volunteered become the reason it could be considered for the VC. I imagine dying at the feet of the officer who had given him the message in the first place might have helped his cause, medal wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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